Lead Block logic not working

[dreamtheatervt]

In a pass play out of the I formation, I want my FB to go toward the left to block, and the HB to go right to block. For some reason, they don't follow their logic boxes and carry out their assignment, they both try to go up the middle and they run into the QB who is dropping back. Both backs have [Lead Block] logic before moving. After removing the [Lead Block] logic, the players performed their assignments. It appears [Lead Block] is not working properly.

[nmleague]

For lead blocking you need to do the logic this way.
 
lead block
move to next point
 
you have to give the the lead logic, but then give them the route to follow for the lead  so the move to next point
 
at the next point I would probably given them a "blcok"  pass logic

[Marauders]

Whom are they Lead: blocking for in a pass play?
 
Shouldn't they be using Block: Backfield logic?
 

[dreamtheatervt]

ORIGINAL: nmleague

For lead blocking you need to do the logic this way.

lead block
move to next point

you have to give the the lead logic, but then give them the route to follow for the lead  so the move to next point

at the next point I would probably given them a "blcok"  pass logic

That is exactly what I did.

ORIGINAL: Marauders

Whom are they Lead: blocking for in a pass play?

Shouldn't they be using Block: Backfield logic?

I had them using the [block backfield] logic after leading to the point. For dropback passing, it is a moot point, but for a sprintout pass, I would like the RB's to pickoff anyone they run into on their way to the logic point, and [lead block] seems like the proper command to do that.

[nmleague]

Well with that logic they should block anyone that comes to them as they move to the next point.  That said, for RB blocking on passes I never use lead block logic, they usually are moving to a point and then have pass block logic.  I recent created some sprint out passes, I need to check the RB logic, they are running to a point outside the OT and then pass blocking, not sure if I just gave them move to logic and then pass blocking at the next point, or if I gave them lead block, move to next point and then pass block logic.

[dreamtheatervt]

My point is that regardless of whether my use of the [lead to] fits someone else's definition of its use, the players should still act accordingly.  If I want my receiver to run in a circle and pick his nose, he should do that (assuming David adds in [pick nose] logic.

[nmleague]

I agree if you give them lead logic with the point to move to then they should do that.  I guess the only place I have used it is with pulling linemen or a RB leading through the point of attack.  Even then many times it seems to me that the pulling lineman only go so far and then turn back to block someone.  But I havent checked it that much.

[dreamtheatervt]

My pulling lineman have worked out real well for the most part. I've found that sometimes the 3 dimensional players have trouble performing in one dimension, i.e. a running play which is designed to be an "outside" handoff (outside meaning the QB is closer to the LOS than the HB at the exchange) is ran as an "inside" handoff. Play still works as intended, it just looks different on the field than it does in the PDS.

[dreamtheatervt]

Lead block doesn't work for running plays either, the FB is still ignoring his run path; so my point remains valid.

[hack153]

adding onto the blocking subject....
 
it seems that you always have to set the LT and C to "block" "nearest".  from what i've seen, when facing many of the games basic zone defenses (zone 3, 43 zone) the RE or DT will plow the LT and C over if their blocking is set on "out" or "pass".  not sure why it does that.  i always have my LT and C blocking "nearest" now. 
 
is this a bug or glitch in the game?  anyone having the same problem?

[nmleague]

I think in all the pass plays in all my playbooks I have the OT using a block nearest, instead of block pass.  If they have a block pass they never block the DE if he is rushing the gap inside the OT.  I do use block pass logic for the guards and C.

[David Winter]

Hi.
 
 There may be some confusion on how the [LEADBLOCK] command works.  If this flag is set true, the player will follow their described route until there is an unblocked defender, up field of the ball carrier, with in a certain range of the ball carrier. If that situatin occurs, the player will drop away from his route, and move to block that player. This is probably why you're seeing players with lead block not following their routes.
 
 I could change the code so that the player would only look for un blocked defenders that are within a certain distance of himeself (allowing him to keep closer to his designed route), but if the ball carrier breaks off his route to avoid defenders, the lead blocker would get out of position.

[dreamtheatervt]

Mr. Winter,
 
That sounds like a fix in my book.  It might explain why my inside running game is non-existant up to this point except for quick dive plays.

[Marauders]

It might explain why my inside running game is non-existant up to this point except for quick dive plays.

 
Maybe I should send you a few plays. [;)]

[Marauders]

I could change the code so that the player would only look for un blocked defenders that are within a certain distance of himeself (allowing him to keep closer to his designed route), but if the ball carrier breaks off his route to avoid defenders, the lead blocker would get out of position.

 
I agree with Dream on this being a good change.  It is more realistic, and the lead blocker usually cannot see what the runner is doing behind him anyway.  It also allows for flowing blocks to the flats.
 
- Marauders

[Deft]

Another useful means for running inside is putting short delays in for the linemen you intend to block LBs.  By timing the OL or lead block FBs to hit the hole just before RB,  they will more likely pick up hole filling LBs and allow RBs to get to the next level.
 
For Dave's suggestions, I would say yes.  If the lead blocker doesn't follow his route then it might as well be another Block Nearest Defender command. 

[dreamtheatervt]

Mauraders,

I'd be interested in seeing what you are doing. In my experience, the O-line doesn't seem to be able to hold their blocks long enough, and my lineman don't try to make second level blocks. At this point I'm chalking it up to the PDS not working the same way as I am imagining things in my head.

[brb321]

Hey guys. Does anyone have any great 12-man they would like to share???

[Marauders]

brb321 stated: Hey guys. Does anyone have any great 12-man they would like to share???

 
Old Coach is working on some Canadian rules plays.  I am cleaning up the old playbooks as well, and plays are being added to expand the Canadian default playbook.  I don't know if one will be able to call any of the plays "great", as that is subjective, but there will be more plays.
 

Dream stated:  I'd be interested in seeing what you are doing. In my experience, the O-line doesn't seem to be able to hold their blocks long enough, and my lineman don't try to make second level blocks. At this point I'm chalking it up to the PDS not working the same way as I am imagining things in my head.

 
What kind of blocking logic are you using?
 
Do you use Move To: to get blockers upfield to make second level blocks?
 

[hack153]

quote:

I could change the code so that the player would only look for un blocked defenders that are within a certain distance of himeself (allowing him to keep closer to his designed route), but if the ball carrier breaks off his route to avoid defenders, the lead blocker would get out of position.

I agree with Dream on this being a good change. It is more realistic, and the lead blocker usually cannot see what the runner is doing behind him anyway. It also allows for flowing blocks to the flats.

- Marauders

that seems like a great idea to me. that would help.