Sealion

[fcam1387]

In the games against the AI (I have yet to try sealion against a human opponent) when I have launched an invasion of Britain I usually end up conquering it by early 1941. However, regardless of the signifigant boost to industrial production and about 3-4 turns worth of preparation, the Soviet Union always steamrolls right through central Europe and I am generally powerless to stop them because the invasion of Britain is generally costly and I have a fair amount of garrisoning troops in the Isles. I am wondering whether people (in pbem games in particular) have had much luck with Sealion and if so, how exactly did they prepare for the inevitable war with the Soviet Union? Is a Japanese invasion from the Far East necessary to reduce pressure?

Thanks

[WanderingHead]

I play humans exclusively, so I don't know how difficult it is to Sea Lion the AI.

However, I can say that I have never made a focused Sea Lion attempt in AWD. I will perhaps tech up amphib and buy another transport, but that is just to keep the WA playing honest and to be able to exploit a mistake if I find one.

I've always felt that if I focused on Sea Lion, the Russians would eventually walk right over me [:)].

[Petiloup]

ORIGINAL: fcam1387

the Soviet Union always steamrolls right through central Europe and I am generally powerless to stop them because the invasion of Britain is generally costly and I have a fair amount of garrisoning troops in the Isles.

Noticed the same think playing against the AI. Taking the UK is not a problem but then Russia usually enters war early and steamrolls Poland or Rumania. Can still be managed but I think it's because we play the game where the AI is stronger than if playing against a human player. The Total War scenario is normally not a problem.

Now I wouldn't try this against a human most of the time unless getting an opportunity and for this I build at least 3 new transports with Germany and a few Heavy bombers. 1 or 2 para can help and all this can be still usefull if going to do Barbarossa. At least it push the British to divert some of his assets for defending the UK and makes it a bit easier in the Med for Italy.

Not sure about other players strategy but compare to WAW I think in AWD Barbarossa would be the choice 95% of the time instead of Sealion and in that sense I think AWD is too close to WW2 to be a good "what if" game.

In my sense if Germany successfully invade France and the UK, we should see Russia being more scared to go to war with Germany than eager to do so but then Germany might get a field day into winning with AV.

Maybe doing just that if London is occupied then maybe see Russia getting points to get soon enough a better factory multiplier but then get her war entry delayed by bumping up the amount of points needed might just give back a real choice between Sea Lion and Barbarossa. Then add up an event giving a fair chance of US declaring war to Germany only by unfreezing the East part of the US. Something like 10-15% each turn because if not it might be very very difficult for Russia to sustain the next attack from Germany.

Not sure about what to do but if AWD could give the option for a better feeling of a "what if" political game then I think it would the Grand Strategy game that would satisfy everybody. 1 scenario to replay WW2 as it was and 1 "what if" scenario.

[WanderingHead]

ORIGINAL: Polonthi
Maybe doing just that if London is occupied then maybe see Russia getting points to get soon enough a better factory multiplier but then get her war entry delayed by bumping up the amount of points needed might just give back a real choice between Sea Lion and Barbarossa.

Yeah. It would actually be nice if production and DOW were on separate tracks, so it would be possible to ramp up armaments without going to war (like if Russia could go to FM=3 without DOW).

I also like the idea of letting the USA DOW Germany and Japan separately, but I don't think it is going to happen. I doubt this can be successfully modded, although I suppose you could do it with house rules.

[wargameplayer]

Actually in my games against human players--about 3-4 of them I have done a pretty cheap operation sea lion.
Typically I'll build up air and fighters (they can be used on the east front any way). and I get my fighter speed up to two asap. Generally, if the UK is left with just one infantry /AA/air and Art I can get an invasion off. The uk is stretched so thin, I've seen the UK player hurry to defend Africa or elsewhere and just forget to leave somehting there. So if the opportunity arises I strike and take england down.
That actually slows down an invasion of russia because the supplies needed to get the UK up to snuff take a bit of time out of you. But longer term, if you can prolong a soviet invasion you'll go in with the ability to do lots of bad things to Russia.

< Message edited by WanderingHead -- 12/23/2006 7:54:17 AM >

(in reply to fcam1387)
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RE: Sealion - 12/23/2006 10:43:15 AM
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Polonthi
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quote:

ORIGINAL: fcam1387

the Soviet Union always steamrolls right through central Europe and I am generally powerless to stop them because the invasion of Britain is generally costly and I have a fair amount of garrisoning troops in the Isles.



Noticed the same think playing against the AI. Taking the UK is not a problem but then Russia usually enters war early and steamrolls Poland or Rumania. Can still be managed but I think it's because we play the game where the AI is stronger than if playing against a human player. The Total War scenario is normally not a problem.

Now I wouldn't try this against a human most of the time unless getting an opportunity and for this I build at least 3 new transports with Germany and a few Heavy bombers. 1 or 2 para can help and all this can be still usefull if going to do Barbarossa. At least it push the British to divert some of his assets for defending the UK and makes it a bit easier in the Med for Italy.

Not sure about other players strategy but compare to WAW I think in AWD Barbarossa would be the choice 95% of the time instead of Sealion and in that sense I think AWD is too close to WW2 to be a good "what if" game.

In my sense if Germany successfully invade France and the UK, we should see Russia being more scared to go to war with Germany than eager to do so but then Germany might get a field day into winning with AV.

Maybe doing just that if London is occupied then maybe see Russia getting points to get soon enough a better factory multiplier but then get her war entry delayed by bumping up the amount of points needed might just give back a real choice between Sea Lion and Barbarossa. Then add up an event giving a fair chance of US declaring war to Germany only by unfreezing the East part of the US. Something like 10-15% each turn because if not it might be very very difficult for Russia to sustain the next attack from Germany.

Not sure about what to do but if AWD could give the option for a better feeling of a "what if" political game then I think it would the Grand Strategy game that would satisfy everybody. 1 scenario to replay WW2 as it was and 1 "what if" scenario.

(in reply to fcam1387)
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RE: Sealion - 12/23/2006 5:00:26 PM
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WanderingHead
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Polonthi
Maybe doing just that if London is occupied then maybe see Russia getting points to get soon enough a better factory multiplier but then get her war entry delayed by bumping up the amount of points needed might just give back a real choice between Sea Lion and Barbarossa.

[Petiloup]

[quote]ORIGINAL: wargameplayer

Generally, if the UK is left with just one infantry /AA/air and Art I can get an invasion off.

[quote]

IF the Allied player does that yes, IF... but usually should choose to loose Africa to protect the UK if necessary.