Why does Hakodate default to a Soviet Command?

[seydlitz_slith]

In one of my current PBEM games, I invaded Hokkaido, the northern island of Japan, in March 1942. I successfully landed at Hakodate and kicked the pitiful garrison out. Much to my surprise, instead of a US flag popping up to show control of the hex, instead I had a Soviet Flag, and the hex showed to be assigned to Far East Command.

I was tempted to leave it on Far East Command for a few turns (for about two seconds) on the premise that if he counterattacked, the hex showed Soviet control, and it would result in a Soviet Activation. (Wouldn't that have surprised him!!!)

At any rate, I paid command points out of my pool to change the command to a US one. Points that I much rather would have used elsewhere on the board. Now, as I advance northwards to the other three cities on the island, I anticipate that I will have to pay command points for each of them also as I capture them.

On the flip side, the Hakodate repair ship yard is working for me. The city keeps wanting me to buy these cheap mutsubishi engines...I told them to make Toyotas instead. And I have already began bombing Tokyo with my B-17s.

Point is, isn't this a bug in the game code? Shouldn't a location default at least to the nationality of the country that took the hex?
Along with that, what happens if I leave the hex under Soviet control. Would a Japanese attack on the hex bring Russia into the War? Will my US units draw supply from Soviet stockpiles? Will the presence of allied units in Soviet territory allow those units to continue to freely move around in other Soviet controlled territory?

Lots of "what ifs" here.

[bradfordkay]

I thought that this was addressed in one of the patches (I could be very wrong here, faulty memory and all that). Which version of the game is this PBEM using?

[seydlitz_slith]

version 1.8.02 is what I have.   Stock with AB extended map and Big B's scenario 192.

[wdolson]

I noticed that all the bases in Manchuko and Korea turn Soviet when catured. Even by Chinese. The 3 bases between Canton and Shanghai become SW Pacific bases when captured.

Bill

[KDonovan]

invaded N.japan in March 42, against a human??....how did you manage that? (and wheres your AAR)

[seydlitz_slith]

March 1942 is correct.
I decided about 5 days into the game what I wanted to do, and set the designated units to train for the targeted cities. Then I saved command points up so that I could change enough units to unrestricted commands. Finally, near the end of February, I loaded all of the units onto two 100 ship TF, Had two more TF loaded with supplies and air units (medium and short range stuff that I couldn't fly in) as well as over 100,000 in supplies. I gathered up just about the whole US fleet including all of the carriers to protect it, and set sail so that the fleet would cross the climate line the day after winter ended.

Meanwhile, my opponent was engaged in finishing off the southern islands in the Philipines and on starting the campaign in Borneo/Celebes. He had also taken Malaya and we were tangling over Moulmein and the gateway to Rangoon. About two weeks before I landed in Hakodate, I teased him with a measured engagement over Port Blair in the Indian Ocean in hopes that I would draw more of his units away from home. Appearently it worked, or he was already committed to the operation anyway.

By the time he spotted me, the KB was too far away to stop the landings, and a lot of his airpower was away down south. He of course rushed all of his naval units north that were in the home Isles, but they were not enough to stop the landing. I lost two old battleships, and he lost one of the Fusos sunk, other damaged badly. He also lost some cruisers and destroyers. In two days, I unloaded over 1500 AV, 750 AV support, and over 10 air units. By the time the KB showed up, My surface units were on their way back home. We had a running carrier battle, and I lost Lex and Hornet. Sara and Yorktown are damaged, but both will live. He had Akagi, Kaga, and Soryu damaged. I will be surprised if Akagi survives. The others will be in the yards for quite a while.

Everything that can fly in Japan has been attacking for days, but when you bing that many transports, it is hard to sink enough to make a difference. Out of the landing force I lost most of one CD artillery unit and a B-25C unit. Everything else landed.

The waters in the ops area are carpeted with my subs, and I am hoping to get one of the damaged carriers as they limp home.

Even better, most of Japan is in bombing range, and I have already bombed Tokyo port with 30 B-17s in a daylight raid. Nothing like bombing a port with 99+ ships disbanded. I got 3 hits on CVE Unyo during the mayhem.

For him to dislodge me, he will have to effectively cease offensive operations for about three months on one of his other fronts to bring enough force back home to deal with the problem. In the meantime, I plan to bomb him into the stone age if at all possible.

Why did I do this?
1. I wanted to try something different to see if it would work.
2. I wanted to hit him somewhere that would force him to engage, and not necessarily on terms that he would like.
3. Every pilot he lost defending against this invasion would only further degrade his future ability to defend....and he was already in pilot trouble.
4. If I could sink or damage a good percentage of his limited "good" cruisers, battleships, and carriers, then I could defend the rest of the Pacific a lot easier.
5. You can't sink islands.
6. Hokkaido is already lightly defended at start, and most Japanese players tend to immediately strip it of the only "good" division based there.
7. By going there, I am cutting off significant oil supplies as well as some of his major engine factories.

It is also worth mentioning that while the invaision was taking place, my Ducth Martin 139s flying out of Java managed to score multiple bomb hits on the carriers of the baby KB. Shoho is heavily damaged, and two of the other carriers have taken 1-2 hits each. While the lihter bombs wouldn't worry the fleet carriers, they tend to hurt on the baby flat tops.

So, call me a madman or not, I did this for a reason. Everything that sailed in the invasion fleet was considered expendable. Most of the cities on the island are worth 600 vp each to me, and can by themselves prevent him from getting an auto-victory unless he takes them back.

[seydlitz_slith]

In case anyone doubts what I said I did, here is a screen shot from our pbem. It doesn't matter whether my opponent can see the screen shot or not. Frankly, if he sees it, it should only increase his worries.

If you notice the top of the map, I am about land at Paramushio Jima next turn and take it also.
[:'(]

[VSWG]

[X(][:D][X(][:D]

Is John Wayne commanding those PT boats at Hokkaido? [;)]

[keeferon01]

very interesting, but you lost 2 carriers and the jap player should have you turfed out that base in four weeks, how he let this happen in the first place is beyond me.

[seydlitz_slith]

True, but Most of the planes made it to Hakodate from the carriers that were lost. The damage inflicted on the combined fleet made it worth the two carriers. How long I can hold is a question, but that is a lot of AV there, with a lot of supply. I failed to mention that in the weeks before the invasion, I had B17s based out of Chunking bombing Samah and Pescadores, where he had a lot of transports anchored. I would guess that I have damaged about 25% of his transport capacity, so it will make it tight on moving troops around. In the meantime, he now has several more spots to defend.

Even after he kicks me off Hokkaido, I will have served my purpose. My main offensive arm in this gameat this point are my subs anyway, and I can happily sit and conduct a sub war until all of those war emergceny build ships arrive.

[Mynok]

As a pretty much strictly Japanese player, I can say it will be difficult to gather enough forces to dislodge that base without denuding the SRA and SE Asia operations pretty seriously. Not to mention the transport capacity required to move those troops into position. I think you will have plenty of time to build up solid fort levels as long as you can supply them. That will be your hardest task.

[seydlitz_slith]

That is why I tried to bring about 100,000 supply with me. I agree that supply will be the key.

[Mynok]

Running B17s and having that many AV will eat into that 100,000 pretty quickly. You will need that much every month if you plan sustained operations there.

[RUPD3658]

A few bombardments by the Jap BBs should starve the base out pretty quickly. After the first few months the Jap BBs become white elephants so this would give them something usefull to do.

As to your original question, I think the bases are hard coded as to what command they become when captured.

[alanschu]

Haha, I can see why people use airfield cap limits based on size as a house rule. 

[goodboyladdie]

Thank God for house rules. With that many aircraft on a size 2 airfield you would not be able to clear enough space for anything to take off or land. It's an interesting tactic and must have given your opponent a few sleepless nights - that'll teach him to start a war with you...[:D]

[keeferon01]

wow I play a pbem game with a guy in my town and I'm glad he don't use these forums, that screencap would give him big ideas, quite amazing

[Dive Bomber1]

This is really interesting!!! Can you keep us all posted on what happens? Maybe you can start an AAR now. You appear to have come up with the Allied equivalent of the Japanese invasion of India.

Thanks -

[niceguy2005]

ORIGINAL: RUPD3658

A few bombardments by the Jap BBs should starve the base out pretty quickly. After the first few months the Jap BBs become white elephants so this would give them something usefull to do.

As to your original question, I think the bases are hard coded as to what command they become when captured.

I agree with RUPD. You will have to find a solution to Japanese bombardment fleets. The key to winning now will be control of the air over your base. If you can control the air you can stem the tide of the bombardment fleets. Otherwise every attack will take out a large % of your supply at the base. PT boats and mines might help.

Still, its an impressive and gutsy operation. Another key will be the capture of supporting bases. If you can get enough bases with enough airfields operational you just might pull it off.

[treespider]

ORIGINAL: niceguy2005

ORIGINAL: RUPD3658

A few bombardments by the Jap BBs should starve the base out pretty quickly. After the first few months the Jap BBs become white elephants so this would give them something usefull to do.

As to your original question, I think the bases are hard coded as to what command they become when captured.

I agree with RUPD. You will have to find a solution to Japanese bombardment fleets. The key to winning now will be control of the air over your base. If you can control the air you can stem the tide of the bombardment fleets. Otherwise every attack will take out a large % of your supply at the base. PT boats and mines might help.

Still, its an impressive and gutsy operation. Another key will be the capture of supporting bases. If you can get enough bases with enough airfields operational you just might pull it off.

One or two good bombardments by a BB fleet will shut the level two airfield down...then sustainment Airfield Bombardment by aircraft will keep it closed.

Wonder what is defending Pearl or Alaska at the moment?