Has anyone ever been able to hold onto Singapore or North Luzon?

[Japanese_Spirit]

I have been wondering for a while now but has anyone ever been able to hold Singapore and North Luzon (either against the AI or opponent) and defeat the overall Japanese offensive? Nearly every PBEM, both Sing and NL fall, the latter being quicker than in reality.

Is it even possible to defeat the Japanese offensive early on?

[Terminus]

I've held onto Luzon all through the war once, but that was against the poor, lame-brained AI. I counter-attacked it at Clark Field, kicked its forces out, and it never came back.

When I scrubbed the game in 11/43, it still hadn't come back, and Manilla, Clark, Bataan and Naga were all still mine.

[Japanese_Spirit]

ORIGINAL: Terminus

I've held onto Luzon all through the war once, but that was against the poor, lame-brained AI. I counter-attacked it at Clark Field, kicked its forces out, and it never came back.

When I scrubbed the game in 11/43, it still hadn't come back, and Manilla, Clark, Bataan and Naga were all still mine.

Hmmmm....I see. How did you manage the supply problems in Luzon? Did you manage to ship in extra supplies from the states or did you empty Borneo?

[RUPD3658]

Single ship convoys. The AI ignores them

[FAdmiral]

ORIGINAL: RUPD3658

Single ship convoys. The AI ignores them

Is that what the programming of the AI had originally intended?
Or is it just a 0 dice roll for something that small....

JIM

[marky]

i held out in manila til late 43 but against the AI

against a human its impossible without reinforcements and supplies and planes, and THATS imposssible in the early part of the game

the japs have control of the sea and the air thuis by default they control the ground as well

[RUPD3658]

ORIGINAL: FAdmiral

ORIGINAL: RUPD3658

Single ship convoys. The AI ignores them

Is that what the programming of the AI had originally intended?
Or is it just a 0 dice roll for something that small....

JIM

Don't know why it works but it seems to. Single ship convoys get hit more often by search planes but seem to be ignored by strike AC.

[niceguy2005]

It all depends on the level of skill of your opponent (or lack thereof). Using typical levels of force it would be next to impossible for to hold either, even against the AI.

T, in your example did the AI, not use historical levels of troops?

[Terminus]

Erm, I seem to recall about 2½ division equivalents at Clark, battering themselves against my defences with endless Deliberate Attacks. They got so weak that I kicked them out using the troops I had at Clark, augmented by the Marines and the Provisional Tank Group. Never came back.

Poor AI confuses so easily...

[LittleJoe]

From my expierience against human opponents i think Java is the first chance that the Allies have of stopping the Japanese advance.

[Jaypea]

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Erm, I seem to recall about 2½ division equivalents at Clark, battering themselves against my defences with endless Deliberate Attacks. They got so weak that I kicked them out using the troops I had at Clark, augmented by the Marines and the Provisional Tank Group. Never came back.

Poor AI confuses so easily...

I have had this same experience against the AI. I am thinking of creating a game mod to play via email where The Phillipinne army is fully mobilized and the 41st ID was actually sent to PI plus some additional supplies that were on the way or had been requested by Mac. Just for fun.

[Japanese_Spirit]

Don't know why it works but it seems to. Single ship convoys get hit more often by search planes but seem to be ignored by strike AC.

I must disagree with you there. My single ship convoys were getting bombed left, right and centre by Japanese strike AC's. They were either sailing or unloading supplies at either Bataan or Manila itself. I guess it just depends on some games over others I guess.

At the current moment, I am holding the enemy nicely at Lingayen. When I feel more confident, I will try the Japanese and then hopefully, keep to my name and try a PBEM as the Rising Sun itself. [:D]

However, back onto the main topic at hand, gentlemen, has anyone ever been successful in holding Singapore or Luzon, despite from Terminus, in particular against a Human opponent?

Is it even possible?

[FAdmiral]

ORIGINAL: Japanese_Spirit

Don't know why it works but it seems to. Single ship convoys get hit more often by search planes but seem to be ignored by strike AC.

I must disagree with you there. My single ship convoys were getting bombed left, right and centre by Japanese strike AC's. They were either sailing or unloading supplies at either Bataan or Manila itself. I guess it just depends on some games over others I guess.

After looking at this situation more closely in my Allied game vs. Jap AI, I think it
has to do more with distance and better targets. If I take a single ship TF too close
to an enemy airbase, it (AI) will surely devote some planes to make an attack. But
if the distance is much greater, I would guess a dice roll will prefer a better target
if one is available. Patrol sightings have alot to do with it too. I find the AI will attack
a base about 99% of the time over sending aircraft long distances to attack the sighting
of 1 ship....

JIM

[Roger Neilson II]

Yes and its a right pain in the posterior if the allies can pull it off, see our AAR:

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=943426

for details

Roger

[Japanese_Spirit]

After looking at this situation more closely in my Allied game vs. Jap AI, I think it
has to do more with distance and better targets. If I take a single ship TF too close
to an enemy airbase, it (AI) will surely devote some planes to make an attack. But
if the distance is much greater, I would guess a dice roll will prefer a better target
if one is available. Patrol sightings have alot to do with it too. I find the AI will attack
a base about 99% of the time over sending aircraft long distances to attack the sighting
of 1 ship....

JIM

I have noticed that myself. If the ships go to Bataan, the planes from Formosa attack and vice versa, so it is indeed a close proximity issue. Which is good, because it makes the game a bit more harder to tackle. Cheers Jim.

Yes and its a right pain in the posterior if the allies can pull it off, see our AAR:

tm.asp?m=943426

for details

Roger

Ah, I remember reading this once, a year back. Nice writing, my good sir! Anyway, it is good to know that atleast someone was able to hold onto Sing. Any tips you can give? As an Allied player, one of my goals is to try and defend Singapore, mainly for historical reasons but still.

And I hope you don't feel offended but if I may comment as lastly, if that is your picture as an avatar, I must say, you do indeed look like a very relaxed chap there. [;)]

Cheers.

[DSwain]

ORIGINAL: Japanese_Spirit

After looking at this situation more closely in my Allied game vs. Jap AI, I think it
has to do more with distance and better targets. If I take a single ship TF too close
to an enemy airbase, it (AI) will surely devote some planes to make an attack. But
if the distance is much greater, I would guess a dice roll will prefer a better target
if one is available. Patrol sightings have alot to do with it too. I find the AI will attack
a base about 99% of the time over sending aircraft long distances to attack the sighting
of 1 ship....

JIM

I have noticed that myself. If the ships go to Bataan, the planes from Formosa attack and vice versa, so it is indeed a close proximity issue. Which is good, because it makes the game a bit more harder to tackle. Cheers Jim.

Yes and its a right pain in the posterior if the allies can pull it off, see our AAR:

tm.asp?m=943426

for details

Roger

Ah, I remember reading this once, a year back. Nice writing, my good sir! Anyway, it is good to know that atleast someone was able to hold onto Sing. Any tips you can give? As an Allied player, one of my goals is to try and defend Singapore, mainly for historical reasons but still.

And I hope you don't feel offended but if I may comment as lastly, if that is your picture as an avatar, I must say, you do indeed look like a very relaxed chap there. [;)]

Cheers.

What a great and enjoyable AAR, Roger - kudos to all concerned

[Capt. Harlock]

Anyway, it is good to know that atleast someone was able to hold onto Sing. Any tips you can give? As an Allied player, one of my goals is to try and defend Singapore, mainly for historical reasons but still.

I was able to hold Singapore against the AI, playing Pacific War rather than WitP, even using "help Japanese" option.. The key there was pulling out the air groups for a couple of weeks so that the Japanese stopped bombing the airfield and moved to richer targets, then sneaking some longer-ranged fighters back in right when the small convoys arrived. This is not entirely gamey, since IRL Singapore was in fact reinforced. (They sent near-useless troops, unfortunately.)

[Big B]

I have been wanting to do something "waht if" like that - but I am still trying to get the baseline down...

ORIGINAL: Jaypea

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Erm, I seem to recall about 2½ division equivalents at Clark, battering themselves against my defences with endless Deliberate Attacks. They got so weak that I kicked them out using the troops I had at Clark, augmented by the Marines and the Provisional Tank Group. Never came back.

Poor AI confuses so easily...

I have had this same experience against the AI. I am thinking of creating a game mod to play via email where The Phillipinne army is fully mobilized and the 41st ID was actually sent to PI plus some additional supplies that were on the way or had been requested by Mac. Just for fun.

[Roger Neilson II]

ORIGINAL: DSwain

ORIGINAL: Japanese_Spirit

After looking at this situation more closely in my Allied game vs. Jap AI, I think it
has to do more with distance and better targets. If I take a single ship TF too close
to an enemy airbase, it (AI) will surely devote some planes to make an attack. But
if the distance is much greater, I would guess a dice roll will prefer a better target
if one is available. Patrol sightings have alot to do with it too. I find the AI will attack
a base about 99% of the time over sending aircraft long distances to attack the sighting
of 1 ship....

JIM

I have noticed that myself. If the ships go to Bataan, the planes from Formosa attack and vice versa, so it is indeed a close proximity issue. Which is good, because it makes the game a bit more harder to tackle. Cheers Jim.

Yes and its a right pain in the posterior if the allies can pull it off, see our AAR:

tm.asp?m=943426

for details

Roger

Ah, I remember reading this once, a year back. Nice writing, my good sir! Anyway, it is good to know that atleast someone was able to hold onto Sing. Any tips you can give? As an Allied player, one of my goals is to try and defend Singapore, mainly for historical reasons but still.

And I hope you don't feel offended but if I may comment as lastly, if that is your picture as an avatar, I must say, you do indeed look like a very relaxed chap there. [;)]

Cheers.

What a great and enjoyable AAR, Roger - kudos to all concerned

Very rude of me not to respond, but fact is I missed the comments here... away and other things to do perhaps.

I look forward to another game where my hero Flashman can star as the main character.... but not yet.

as regards how to hold Singers it had a lot to do with the enemy not bringing enough force into play fast enough. I cannot claim any credit for that, its simply the way the game went the Japs hit lots of places with forces that were not really strong enough to do the job... and once the initial steam ran out we went for the kill big time!

I doubt if we would be allowed to get away with it again!

Cheers

Roger