Stale

Jason629 · Post by **Jason629** » Sun Mar 31, 2002 1:29 am

Things seem to be getting a little stale around here! I think the impending release has everybody just sitting around waiting for UV to go gold. Anyway, lets get back to basics. If Ichiki had been patient and waited for the rest of his unit...could the Japanese have dislodged Vandegrift on the first try?

Snigbert · Post by **Snigbert** » Mon Apr 01, 2002 6:42 am

I doubt it would have helped. Waiting would have given the Marines more time to consolidate their positions.

Ichiki just led his men to slaughter, it was really poor tactics on his part that lost the battle. Not the number of men he had available.

Jason629 · Post by **Jason629** » Mon Apr 01, 2002 8:28 am

I agree, the entire Ichiki Detachment was just about 2,000 men. I think this speaks volumes in terms of what the Japanese thought (or didnt think) the Americans could offer in terms of an offensive at this point in the war.

Ron Saueracker · Post by **Ron Saueracker** » Mon Apr 01, 2002 10:25 pm

That was Japan's whole problem, they used the "pinch here, a dash there, we're Japanese samurai! One Japanese soldier worth 20 round eyes in grolious field of marshall combat." doctrine. The Army and Navy rarely co operated with one another, let alone trusted each other, leading to gross mismanagement of campaigns.

I wonder if this "political" aspect, prevalent in the allied camp as well, is taken into account in the sim? Perhaps abstractly as was done in Victory Games' "War in the Pacific" using command points.

mogami · Post by **mogami** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 6:51 am

One interesting thing about the piecemeal use by the Japanese was the result that the Marines always thought they were actually outnumbered. They would count the Japanese dead after each attack and assume it to be a small percent of available Japanese troops rather then the entire force. Since the Allies considered 20-25 percent casualties to be enourmous they figured 2k dead Japs equaled 10-25k available. That many enemy troops made them defensive minded. Had they caught on sooner they could have secured the Island earlier and prevented the future build up by the Japanese.

Ron Saueracker · Post by **Ron Saueracker** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 7:13 am

That's a very appropriate point mogami...can't wait to play ya online!

mogami · Post by **mogami** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 7:19 am

Originally posted by Ron Saueracker
That's a very appropriate point mogami...can't wait to play ya online!

Don't tease me the suspense of waiting is making me crazy(ier)
I have plans to move my computer and refridgerator and coffee maker into the bathroom so I never have to move once this game is released.

TIMJOT · Post by **TIMJOT** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 8:04 am

Originally posted by Ron Saueracker
That was Japan's whole problem, they used the "pinch here, a dash there, we're Japanese samurai! One Japanese soldier worth 20 round eyes in grolious field of marshall combat." doctrine. The Army and Navy rarely co operated with one another, let alone trusted each other, leading to gross mismanagement of campaigns.

I wonder if this "political" aspect, prevalent in the allied camp as well, is taken into account in the sim? Perhaps abstractly as was done in Victory Games' "War in the Pacific" using command points.

That peicemeal stuff goes for the IJN too. Does anyone know why if Yamamoto felt Guadacanal was so important why didnt just send the whole combine Fleet down there to finish business? Even in the later battles why did he just send two Kongos BBs to Bombard Guadacanal, why not all four. Why not throw in the Nagatos to boot?

4 Kongos, 2 Nagatos, 1 Yamato against the Washington and S.Dakota at 2nd Naval Battle Guadacanal and things might have ended differently.

mogami · Post by **mogami** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 8:10 am

As pointed out during the great fuel debate there were in fact plans to use the Super BB's but low fuel reserves prevented it. Those monsters simply burned too much fuel to permit them to be on hand. The Kongo class were fast enough to run back and forth out of Raubal but the others had to be held up at Truk as secondary fuel storage (often their fuel was siphoned off to refuel other fleet units) A TF with all the mentioned BB's could not be maintained (1 Super 4CA 1 Cl and 8 DD) required 45k tons a fuel for a single sortee from Truk to Guadalcanal The total production per month was 214k tons.

Jason629 · Post by **Jason629** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 9:51 am

I like that! "The Great Fuel Debate of 2002". Not exactly Lincoln-Douglass.........but pretty good.

mogami · Post by **mogami** » Tue Apr 02, 2002 8:29 pm

Just watched John Garfield movie where he portrays Marine Joe Schmidt who holds river crossing on Aug 21 1942. Funniest lines in movie

Joe: I just joined the Marines. Shooting Japs sounds like more fun then Shooting bears.

Rose: Be carefull they don't shoot you.

Joe: Me? What do they have against me?

Ron Saueracker · Post by **Ron Saueracker** » Wed Apr 03, 2002 2:20 am

Pride of the Marines I think it was called.

mogami · Post by **mogami** » Fri Apr 05, 2002 2:37 am

Sorry I think it was Al Schmidt not Joe Schmidt.
using a watercooled MG and of course the old wounded Japanese soldier with the grenade trick.

Stale

Stale

Ichiki

Japanese tactics

fuel

The Great Fuel Debate

Joe Schmidt

Al not Joe