Not enough turns

[Kuokkanen]

I just completed scenario Chateay de Quesnou and I must point out that it didn't have enough turns. Most of things I've been told about infantry tactics and moving under fire (move no more than 2 hexes per turn etc.) are just impossible in that scenario! Even though I managed take all VH, it was damn close call: I got 3 out of 4 in last turn and almost lost one when two french squads came back with a vengeance.

Becouse of rush I lost Panzer IV and 150 mm mobile howitzer. In addition lots of my infantry got killed. I had to save and load often, usually to fix my mistakes but sometimes just to find out where AT weapons are located. Without save/load I certainly wouldn't had reached any of VH. I don't suppose this is the way game is meant to be played.

Bottom line
All the talk about careful advance under fire is useless when there is no time for it! When you make scenarios, make sure there is enough time for movement, as instructed in forums and strategy guides, and time to clear obstacles and mines when they are present.

[vahauser]

Matti,
 
What version of the game are you using?  It looks like that scenario has not been upgraded to Enhanced DVRN. 
 
 

[FlashfyreSP]

90% of the existing scenarios were built under older versions of the game...and not everyone believes in the fundamentals of manuever and fire support. So you'll find many scenarios out there with limited time to accomplish the objective. Also, you are NOT REQUIRED to capture EVERY Victory Hex flag to win a battle; one of the marks of weak scenario design is an over-reliance on VH flag ownership to determine actual victory. The VH flags are worth a finite number of points in most cases, and the victory level is determined by the number of points you accumulate; with some "quick-n-dirty" math, you can determine whether you need to try for those rear VHs or not.

[Kuokkanen]

ORIGINAL: vahauser

Matti,

What version of the game are you using? It looks like that scenario has not been upgraded to Enhanced DVRN.

You got me. I have 8.04.

How much different is that... DVRN version?

[vahauser]

Matti,
 
I'm not even sure that the scenario has been upgraded to version 8.40 standards.  The movement rates of the vehicles seem all wrong.
 
I have no way of knowing if 15 turns is enough time to successfully complete the mission.  It could be that when the scenario was originally designed 15 turns was enough time.  I'm pretty sure that the scenarios that are included in the game have been playtested.  Perhaps the original playtesters concluded that 15 turns was enough time.
 
However, some people play faster than others.  I like short scenarios.  I like the time pressure and I like to move fast.  But some people like to play slow and deliberate.  They don't like time pressure and they don't like to move fast.  So it is not easy to design scenarios that will satisfy all players.
 
My suggestion is to play scenarios that have at least been upgraded to version 8.4.  I bet somebody around here has a list of the scenarios that have been upgraded to version 8.4.
 
--V

[Alby]

ORIGINAL: Matti Kuokkanen

You got me. I have 8.04.
How much different is that... DVRN version?

Like using Brown Bess Muskets against 50 Caliber Machine guns...
[:D]

[Kuokkanen]

ORIGINAL: Alby

ORIGINAL: Matti Kuokkanen

You got me. I have 8.04.
How much different is that... DVRN version?

Like using Brown Bess Muskets against 50 Caliber Machine guns...
[:D]

First off, correction: vanilla version was 8.403. I just installed DV and checked out scenario again. It still has 15 turns limit with same forces.

[Oldguard1970]

Hello Matti,
 
The editor will allow you to add turns to a scenario.  Click solitaire, editor, and then load the scenario you want to edit.  When the scenario loads, you will see a box near the bottom with the number of turns.  Just set that number to the number of turns you want to use.  Save the edited scenario either in its original slot or in a new slot with a name to tell you it is modified.
 
This does not permit you to add turns to a game in progress, but you can adjust a scenario before you get started.  As you look at a scenario before you start moving, you should be able to decide if you want to adjust it and add more turns.
 
 

[vahauser]

Matti,
 
If the scenario was not originally designed for version 8.4 or 8.403 or Enhanced DV, then changing the version will not make the scenario work correctly.  Somebody will have to manually upgrade the scenario to make it work correctly. 
 
I suggest trying a different scenario that has been upgraded to Enhanced DV.  I'm sure that somebody will be happy to give you a list of the scenarios that have been upgraded to Enhanced DV.
 
--V

[Alby]

Re itterating what Flash said.....I think his point may be the important factor here...regardless of what version you are using, the number of turns will remain the same...


"90% of the existing scenarios were built under older versions of the game...and not everyone believes in the fundamentals of manuever and fire support. So you'll find many scenarios out there with limited time to accomplish the objective. Also, you are NOT REQUIRED to capture EVERY Victory Hex flag to win a battle; one of the marks of weak scenario design is an over-reliance on VH flag ownership to determine actual victory. The VH flags are worth a finite number of points in most cases, and the victory level is determined by the number of points you accumulate; with some "quick-n-dirty" math, you can determine whether you need to try for those rear VHs or not."

For "Enhanced" scenarios and Campaigns...go here...
http://enhanced.netboardz.com/index.php ... 5b60443fe7

[vahauser]

Alby,
 
Agreed.  The number of turns will remain the same.  But 15 turns might have been enough when the scenario was originally designed. 
 
OldGuard1970 mentioned that you can adjust the number of turns using the Editor.  That is true, too.  But regardless of how many turns a person edits the scenario, the scenario won't play as originally intended unless it is upgraded.  And even if the scenario is upgraded to the latest version, it will still need to be playtested to see if it conforms to the intent of the original design.
 
Once again, I recommend to Matti that he only play those scenarios that have been upgraded and updated and playtested to the version of the game that he is using (which I think he is now using Enhanced DV).

[Kuokkanen]

ORIGINAL: vahauser

I suggest trying a different scenario that has been upgraded to Enhanced DV. I'm sure that somebody will be happy to give you a list of the scenarios that have been upgraded to Enhanced DV.

Someone should compile list of updated scenarios and campaigns that comes with DV and put it in with DV's Zip file [:-]

[FlashfyreSP]

ORIGINAL: Matti Kuokkanen

Someone should compile list of updated scenarios and campaigns that comes with DV and put it in with DV's Zip file [:-]

Someone seems awfully eager to tell those who worked on the Mod what they should do....[8|]

[Alby]

ORIGINAL: Matti Kuokkanen

ORIGINAL: vahauser

I suggest trying a different scenario that has been upgraded to Enhanced DV. I'm sure that somebody will be happy to give you a list of the scenarios that have been upgraded to Enhanced DV.

Someone should compile list of updated scenarios and campaigns that comes with DV and put it in with DV's Zip file [:-]

heres a link to where you will find all the Enhanced Scenarios and Campaigns...
I eagerly wait to see your list....
[:D]
http://enhanced.netboardz.com/