Siege problem

[Twotribes]

This has happened twice, once in Lynchburg and i didnt save and this time in Little Rock , have save.

The city has not fallen, I arrive with a relief force and drive off the Besiegers yet at the end of the turn in reports it says the city fell, I lose will, US gains will, I am still in command of city AND all troops are gone from the city.

In the case of Lynchburg I had just moved new brigades in, Little Rock it was just the defenders I lost.

It wont let me put the save here. Ok zipped it now it goes in.

[Twotribes]

Has anyone else seen this? I am pretty sure I am on D patch. Though the screen doesnt list the letter just the numbers.

[Erik Rutins]

I can confirm I've seen this too, seems to be a quirk in the siege order system.

[Twotribes]

I don't think it is bad enough to hold up the official patch, but i assume it is being looked into?

Another good reason not to keep large forces in a city ).

[spruce]

are you sure it's a minor nuisance. IIRC I had this once with the USA sieging Memphis, eventually they didn't capture it - like you describe...but they plundered the whole city to the ground.

[Twotribes]

Didn't have a plunder problem, the problem is that you can occasionally lose garrisons and even points for victory without ever losing the city.

[Twotribes]

I have changed my mind, I keep losing, as the CSA, forts and cities and brigades when I dont lose sieges. This bug is very annoying and IS effecting game play.

[Gray_Lensman]

Didn't I read somewhere that the problem is in the movement phase sequence that sieges were resolved prior to combats occuring?  I was under the impression that they were going to change that to have siege's resolved after all other combats have been resolved.

[Twotribes]

Well I dont see the point in continueing to play as the South. I have lost 3 forts and 2 cities to this "bug" all of them without losing actually.

[ericbabe]

This is what's happening: the siege happens at the beginning of the turn order sequence.  You are losing the siege, and subsequently the national will, the units in the city, and so forth.  After that, the besiegers are driven out of the province.  The city/fort is not actually captured by the besiegers, because that happens at the end of the turn.  We may try moving siege resolution after the movement sub-phases since this sequence of events seems to confuse people, and people seem to want a chance to kick out the besiegers before they get a chance to besiege, but it is not a bug in the code per se.

[jkBluesman]

ORIGINAL: ericbabe

This is what's happening: the siege happens at the beginning of the turn order sequence. You are losing the siege, and subsequently the national will, the units in the city, and so forth. After that, the besiegers are driven out of the province. The city/fort is not actually captured by the besiegers, because that happens at the end of the turn. We may try moving siege resolution after the movement sub-phases since this sequence of events seems to confuse people, and people seem to want a chance to kick out the besiegers before they get a chance to besiege, but it is not a bug in the code per se.

Is it possible to resolve the siege before the movement sub-phase but just skipp the consequences to the end of the turn? Thus a successful kick-out of the besiegers will prevent the loss of national will but allow the besiegers to inflict casualties on garrisons.

[Erik Rutins]

Something like that would be my preference too.

[Twotribes]

The only problem being that in the file I sent you Little Rock never changed hands. At the end of the Turn it is still firmly red, YET the CSA lost and USA gained will as if a capitol had fallen. There is no return gain for the fact the CSA still controls the capitol. So in effect a permanent lose that can never be rectified occurred on behalf of the Union.

[sadja]

In my game, US was besiging Memphis, It also plundered the city and destroyed the capitol. I drove out the union troops before they captured it, but it shows in blue and not on my screen. I still control the river province. If the union did take the city wouldn't the province fall? The garrison was standing in the river province after the battle and like I said the city is blue the province on the economy says needs capitol but Memphis isn't on my city list.

[Twotribes]

I have another instance of a capital "falling" to an enemy siege , the USA loses will for it and the city never actually changes hands, so the CSA loses no will for losing it also. The first example above shows this, I can provide another if anyone cares to look at this.

[Twotribes]

Maybe I am not being clear....

Twice now I have had enemy forces supposedly capture a State Capitol ( Little Rock) I lost will for the "capture" yet the city NEVER changed hands.

What does this mean? It means the CSA got a FREE 2 will from me with no way for me to hurt them back, even though I obviously "recaptured" the city.

I have provided a save for the first time, I have a save for the second. In fact I have the save before and the save when the will is lost.

If this is "working as intended" I suggest that you rethink what that means.

Clarity, the first save is me as the CSA and the US getting the free boost, the second I have not sent is me as the USA and the CSA getting the free boost.

If this is "working as intended" then the game has a serious problem.

[Mr. Yuck]

ORIGINAL: sadja

In my game, US was besiging Memphis, It also plundered the city and destroyed the capitol. I drove out the union troops before they captured it, but it shows in blue and not on my screen. I still control the river province. If the union did take the city wouldn't the province fall? The garrison was standing in the river province after the battle and like I said the city is blue the province on the economy says needs capitol but Memphis isn't on my city list.

Ok- I don't have the game open right now but I believe what happened to you is that the plundering Yankees destroyed the province capitol building and you will get nothing from the province of Memphis until you rebuild it. This has nothing to do with province control.

You can march a division all around the enemy rear areas, never capture anything, and as long as you keep hitting the plunder button before you close out the turn-you can do immense damage to his economy.

[Gil R.]

Mr. Yuck might have the answer. I should also refer everyone to Ericbabe's post up above (#9). We may one day change the order in which things happen so that sieges are not resolved first, but that sort of thing requires some significant reprogramming and can lead to new problems, so it's not a change we can make overnight.

[ericbabe]

I can just get rid of the NW loss/gain for losing cities/forts.  THat'd be an easy fix.