sync problems with new start on v1.806

[Mark VII]

Just started a new game with standard game, normal map playing scenerio 16. As the Allied player my combat animation does not mirror game reality when I look at the turn. I see Allied ships nailed by bombs & torps and sink and when I start the turn there is the same ship or ships sailing along like nothing happened and some other ship has vanished and now listed as sunk. We both patched using v.1.806 Revised option since we had not patched with the first 1.806. We are at 12-15-41 and the problem is not clearing up.

Been playing since initial release and have never seen this before on my computers. We started this new game after we both patched and non-sync-ing has been present since the first turn.

Ed has been sending me a text copy of the combat but I am missing the fine details of combat. Like what size of round just struck that IJN ship and what on board weapon system just got knocked out. You get all sorts of info watching the combat animation!

thanks for any help.....terry

[Yamato hugger]

Sync bug is nothing new and will likely always be there until (if ever) the replay routine is re-written. If you have gone this long without encountering it before, count yourself VERY lucky. I dont know that I have ever played the allies without being bitten by it at one point or another. Animations off helps, but isnt a cure. You can try re-syncing (search for "sync" and you will find the exact proceedure to follow to re-sync) but no promises that it will stay in sync. I have an allied game (CHS) started in 1.806 that has never been in sync (we are on the 1/30/42 turn atm).

[jwilkerson]

One thing that can at least reduce the frequency is to make absolutely sure you both are using the same EXE file ... you can compare byte count ... date time stamp (which will usually be adjusted by time zone) or even use a CRC utility, there are a number of easy downloadable ones.

In my PBEMs with Moses and Nik ... we only have synch problems when we upgrade the EXEs ... otherwise (knocking on wood) we've played hundreds of synch-problem-free turns ... but Japanese player always sends the Combat and Ops reports along too just to be sure ... and if I'm playing Allies, I read the combatreport b4 watching to replay so my expectations are set correctly.

[rtrapasso]

As Allies - there are a couple of things you can do to try and prevent sync bug... it is related to the amount of memory you have.

SO - run the file from a (preferably cold) boot, ie - don't load anything else before you finish running the turn. Make sure you have any memory hogs in the background turned off (i had some problems with things like screensavers, esp things like SETI@HOME).

Set your virtual memory settings up to maximum.

This can SOMETIMES get rid of problems.

You can also ask your IJ opponent to not use the ESC key during replays - some people insist that this can cause (or intensify) the bug.

Actions with PT boats seem to also cause problems, esp. strafing PTs. One game i had would invariably start a replay problem when this happened.

[rtrapasso]

If all of the above fail, try the Pompack method for resyncing:

"1. Japanese player, receives Allied turn.

2. Japanese player turns off COMBAT REPORTS

3. Japanese player watches combat, enters orders and sends to Allied Player. (Japanese player does without combat reports and SIGINT for one turn; take good notes during combat)

4 . Allied player watches replay with COMBAT REPORTS ON (AFAIK)

5. Allied player enters orders and sends to Japanese Player

6. Japanese Player receives allied turn, turns ON COMBAT REPORTS

7. Japanese player watches combat, enters orders and sends to Allied Player."

[bilbow]

Make sure you are using the exact same pwhex file also. In my game with Feinder we were out of sync until I sent him my pwhex. Fixed the problem.

[Mark VII]

Thanks, I will try to get Ed to use this fix first when I send him the turn directly.

ORIGINAL: rtrapasso

If all of the above fail, try the Pompack method for resyncing:

"1. Japanese player, receives Allied turn.

2. Japanese player turns off COMBAT REPORTS

3. Japanese player watches combat, enters orders and sends to Allied Player. (Japanese player does without combat reports and SIGINT for one turn; take good notes during combat)

4 . Allied player watches replay with COMBAT REPORTS ON (AFAIK)

5. Allied player enters orders and sends to Japanese Player

6. Japanese Player receives allied turn, turns ON COMBAT REPORTS

7. Japanese player watches combat, enters orders and sends to Allied Player."

[Charbroiled]

IMHO...I think the sync bug is related to the sub routine fixes from patch 1.6 (I think that was the patch). I don't think that the sync problem started until then. Also, at times, the report will be normal form a couple of events and then will go south after a sub attack. I can't think of a single time where I had a sync problem start when there wasn't a sub attack.

[rtrapasso]

ORIGINAL: Charbroiled

IMHO...I think the sync bug is related to the sub routine fixes from patch 1.6 (I think that was the patch). I don't think that the sync problem started until then. Also, at times, the report will be normal form a couple of events and then will go south after a sub attack. I can't think of a single time where I had a sync problem start when there wasn't a sub attack.

Oh, i wish this were the case... it would be a lot easier to address.

Some people have said that subs cause the problem, but this has not been my experience.

[Admiral DadMan]

ORIGINAL: Charbroiled

IMHO...I think the sync bug is related to the sub routine fixes from patch 1.6 (I think that was the patch). I don't think that the sync problem started until then. Also, at times, the report will be normal form a couple of events and then will go south after a sub attack. I can't think of a single time where I had a sync problem start when there wasn't a sub attack.

Don't kid yourself.

The "Synch Bug" has been around since WitP's origins, which of course, is UV. Attempts to fix this have been ongoing for at least 5 years. Every time we think it's nailed, it pops up again.

One idea I've never heard floated was to make BOTH players run a seperate combat replay file (passworded for FoW), instead of having the IJN player have replay integrated. Not too feasible at this point I'm guessing.

[rtrapasso]

This is my recollection of how long it's been going on as well... but with more people playing the game, we get more complaints.

[Charbroiled]

ORIGINAL: Admiral DadMan

ORIGINAL: Charbroiled

IMHO...I think the sync bug is related to the sub routine fixes from patch 1.6 (I think that was the patch). I don't think that the sync problem started until then. Also, at times, the report will be normal form a couple of events and then will go south after a sub attack. I can't think of a single time where I had a sync problem start when there wasn't a sub attack.

Don't kid yourself.

The "Synch Bug" has been around since WitP's origins, which of course, is UV. Attempts to fix this have been ongoing for at least 5 years. Every time we think it's nailed, it pops up again.

One idea I've never heard floated was to make BOTH players run a seperate combat replay file (passworded for FoW), instead of having the IJN player have replay integrated. Not too feasible at this point I'm guessing.

My bad then (having never played UV). The first I saw that there was a problem was after 1.6. Must be as Robert says...more people playing, therefore more complaints.

Just wanted to put my observations in to try to help fix the bug. I almost alway have the sync bug after an upgrade, but then it fixes itself out the next turn. The other times I've seen it was always after a sub attack and it would fix itself during a turn where there was no sub attack (maybe coincidence). I have had a couple of times where, as Japan, I had to rerun the combat and saw differing results because; once the game locked up before I saved after combat, and once I overwrote the combat save before sending to my opponent.

[jwilkerson]

ORIGINAL: Admiral DadMan

ORIGINAL: Charbroiled

IMHO...I think the sync bug is related to the sub routine fixes from patch 1.6 (I think that was the patch). I don't think that the sync problem started until then. Also, at times, the report will be normal form a couple of events and then will go south after a sub attack. I can't think of a single time where I had a sync problem start when there wasn't a sub attack.

Don't kid yourself.

The "Synch Bug" has been around since WitP's origins, which of course, is UV. Attempts to fix this have been ongoing for at least 5 years. Every time we think it's nailed, it pops up again.

One idea I've never heard floated was to make BOTH players run a seperate combat replay file (passworded for FoW), instead of having the IJN player have replay integrated. Not too feasible at this point I'm guessing.

Yup synch problem exists in all three games in the family: UV/WITP/WPO.

[Admiral DadMan]

Here's what I think is happening, and it all starts with the IJ Player because I've noticed it most with IJ Players with multiple (Human & AI) opponents:

-The IJ Player sets all the parameters to start the game, and these are read (and now "locked"). If the IJ Player is playing has other games going (PBeM or vs AI) and runs different settings, it screws up the CombatSave Replay, and I don't mean for just the Allied Player, I mean the file itself so that if EITHER Player ran it, there would be screwy output.

I noticed it happened to me in UV when I played as IJ and had more than one game going.

Maybe this has already been examined.

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

Yup synch problem exists in all three games in the family: UV/WITP/WPO.

ORIGINAL: Admiral DadMan

Don't kid yourself.

The "Synch Bug" has been around since WitP's origins, which of course, is UV. Attempts to fix this have been ongoing for at least 5 years. Every time we think it's nailed, it pops up again.

One idea I've never heard floated was to make BOTH players run a seperate combat replay file (passworded for FoW), instead of having the IJ player have replay integrated. Not too feasible at this point I'm guessing.

ORIGINAL: Charbroiled

IMHO...I think the sync bug is related to the sub routine fixes from patch 1.6 (I think that was the patch). I don't think that the sync problem started until then. Also, at times, the report will be normal form a couple of events and then will go south after a sub attack. I can't think of a single time where I had a sync problem start when there wasn't a sub attack.

[rtrapasso]

An interesting idea...

But many of the problems with the Sync Error can be traced to other problems (insufficient memory, different exe files, different PWHEX files) -it is not just one bug, of course.

[jwilkerson]

ORIGINAL: Admiral DadMan

Here's what I think is happening, and it all starts with the IJ Player because I've noticed it most with IJ Players with multiple (Human & AI) opponents:

-The IJ Player sets all the parameters to start the game, and these are read (and now "locked"). If the IJ Player is playing has other games going (PBeM or vs AI) and runs different settings, it screws up the CombatSave Replay, and I don't mean for just the Allied Player, I mean the file itself so that if EITHER Player ran it, there would be screwy output.

I noticed it happened to me in UV when I played as IJ and had more than one game going.

Maybe this has already been examined.

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

Yup synch problem exists in all three games in the family: UV/WITP/WPO.

ORIGINAL: Admiral DadMan

Don't kid yourself.

The "Synch Bug" has been around since WitP's origins, which of course, is UV. Attempts to fix this have been ongoing for at least 5 years. Every time we think it's nailed, it pops up again.

One idea I've never heard floated was to make BOTH players run a seperate combat replay file (passworded for FoW), instead of having the IJ player have replay integrated. Not too feasible at this point I'm guessing.

I guess the short answer is what rtrapasso said (multiple problems). Michael Wood (before I came on board the dev team) tightened up the player PREF save code to prevent the type of problem you describe, at least for WITP (I think this was roughly 1.6 time frame in WITP land). Don't know if this got ported over to UV or WPO. But being the suspicious type that I am, I still play my real PBEMs all in separate installs of the game. In the past 18 months, I've played hundreds and hundreds of PBEM turns and probably had about 15 turns of replay issues, all around EXE upgrade time and these went away after 1-2 turns. But my opponents and I have a rule never to exit out of animations ... never ever ever no esc key no done button no exit period. I think this is what stops the bug - I think it (they - the bugs that is) are tied to animations. Of course turning off animations is an option but having learned to avoid the esc/done/anything buttons during the animations I like leaving them on. Of course being the suspicious types that we are we also have rule that Japanese player must send combatreport.txt and operationsreport.txt with every turn. And when I am Allies - I read the combatreport before I load the replay - that gets my expectations aligned with reality.

[Mark VII]

A new development over the weekend with our 1.806 start. In addition to the sync issues, now the text version of the combat report in not refreshing after running the combat animation. Ed had been sending me a copy of the combat report text and I noticed it was the same for three days. A quote from an email to Ed.


"This makes the second turn in a row that you sent the combat text report for 12-17-41. It is also the second turn in a row that my computer ALSO generated a combat report for 12-17-41 eventhough as I watch the combat replay the date was 12-18 and then 12-19 and new things are happening. The operation report seems new as there is some airfield growth that happened during that turn. Not sure about the intel report but they are at least different."

We have since ended the game, deleted the game and reinstalled up to 1.804. New game started and I am waiting for the Dec 8, combat to come back to me to see if things are back to normal. Before any other upgrades, we have decided to wait for the next comprehensive patch to come out and hope things will be fixed. As I said earlier, we have been playing since the beginning of WitP and never have had problems like this till we installed 1.806.