Allied AAR
Mogami- What do you feel the best usage of escort carriers is?
"Money doesnt talk, it swears. Obscenities, who really cares?" -Bob Dylan
"Habit is the balast that chains a dog to it's vomit." -Samuel Becket
"He has weapons of mass destruction- the world's deadliest weapons- which pose a direct threat to the
"Habit is the balast that chains a dog to it's vomit." -Samuel Becket
"He has weapons of mass destruction- the world's deadliest weapons- which pose a direct threat to the
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Ron Saueracker
- Posts: 10967
- Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 10:00 am
- Location: Ottawa, Canada OR Zakynthos Island, Greece
Escort carrier use
Use escort CVs in a subsidiary/support role. CAP and ASW cover for convoys and amphibious forces, and if you have a few of them, they can probably establish local air superiority over a landing area. Also to transfer air groups if allowed in the game. Perhaps operating separately from fleet CVs and in their rear area so they can fly LR CAP and ASW, thereby supporting fleet CVs while not unduly exposing themselves. This leaves big CV air groups to concentrate on close CAP and strike groups.
Yammas from The Apo-Tiki Lounge. Future site of WITP AE benders! And then the s--t hit the fan
For Instance, in the invasion of Luganville I sent a CVE and a CVL with the invasion fleet. It worked well in the sense that the first waves of LBA were met with large CAP's that knocked their numbers back. In the end, I did not lose one of the 25 transports in the invasion fleet despite several days of LBA attacks.
True, I did eventually lose both carriers but only because one made a run for it and left the landing zone that was protected by LRP from land bases. With her a/c complement depleted and with only a small escort she was dead meat.
True, I did eventually lose both carriers but only because one made a run for it and left the landing zone that was protected by LRP from land bases. With her a/c complement depleted and with only a small escort she was dead meat.
Iain Christie
-----------------
"If patience is a virtue then persistence is it's part.
It's better to light a candle than stand and curse the dark"
- James Keelaghan
-----------------
"If patience is a virtue then persistence is it's part.
It's better to light a candle than stand and curse the dark"
- James Keelaghan
"More Japanese air attacks from Rabaul and their carriers, hit Port Moresby and Gili Gili. Over 1000 casualties to the ground troops at those two locations over the last couple of days."
Thes ground casualty numbers seem excessive, even for an unopposed strike, over so short an interval. Is this typical?
How many a/c are they losing in ground attack? Given the fragility of IJN a/c, if you have any 3" flak or greater these attacks should be killing Kido Butai pretty quickly.
Thes ground casualty numbers seem excessive, even for an unopposed strike, over so short an interval. Is this typical?
How many a/c are they losing in ground attack? Given the fragility of IJN a/c, if you have any 3" flak or greater these attacks should be killing Kido Butai pretty quickly.
Show me a fellow who rejects statistical analysis a priori and I'll show you a fellow who has no knowledge of statistics.
Didn't we have this conversation already?
Didn't we have this conversation already?
Thes ground casualty numbers seem excessive, even for an unopposed strike, over so short an interval. Is this typical?
I agree MDiehl. I was thinking the same thing. Actually, it says in the report that these are the number 'killed', which makes it seem even more excessive. I could see that many being wounded, if you figure for everyone killed you have x5 or x10 wounded.
I agree MDiehl. I was thinking the same thing. Actually, it says in the report that these are the number 'killed', which makes it seem even more excessive. I could see that many being wounded, if you figure for everyone killed you have x5 or x10 wounded.
"Money doesnt talk, it swears. Obscenities, who really cares?" -Bob Dylan
"Habit is the balast that chains a dog to it's vomit." -Samuel Becket
"He has weapons of mass destruction- the world's deadliest weapons- which pose a direct threat to the
"Habit is the balast that chains a dog to it's vomit." -Samuel Becket
"He has weapons of mass destruction- the world's deadliest weapons- which pose a direct threat to the
-
Ron Saueracker
- Posts: 10967
- Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 10:00 am
- Location: Ottawa, Canada OR Zakynthos Island, Greece
Overkill with LCUs
Were there not less than 50 killed and wounded after Kongo and Haruna worked over the marines with their 14" high capacity HE shells? Obviously this kill rate must be adjusted or Washing Machine Charlie will kill off the entire 1st Marine Division in 3 months of night buzzing.:p
Yammas from The Apo-Tiki Lounge. Future site of WITP AE benders! And then the s--t hit the fan
Here is a US sub, one of the nice modern ones 
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"Money doesnt talk, it swears. Obscenities, who really cares?" -Bob Dylan
"Habit is the balast that chains a dog to it's vomit." -Samuel Becket
"He has weapons of mass destruction- the world's deadliest weapons- which pose a direct threat to the
"Habit is the balast that chains a dog to it's vomit." -Samuel Becket
"He has weapons of mass destruction- the world's deadliest weapons- which pose a direct threat to the
Recon info from Lae
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"Money doesnt talk, it swears. Obscenities, who really cares?" -Bob Dylan
"Habit is the balast that chains a dog to it's vomit." -Samuel Becket
"He has weapons of mass destruction- the world's deadliest weapons- which pose a direct threat to the
"Habit is the balast that chains a dog to it's vomit." -Samuel Becket
"He has weapons of mass destruction- the world's deadliest weapons- which pose a direct threat to the
Allow me to correct myself, it says 'losses', not 'killed'.
Hmmn, of course Port Moresby and Gili Gili would be a easier targets than the jungles of Guadalcanal, right? Less places to hide?
Hmmn, of course Port Moresby and Gili Gili would be a easier targets than the jungles of Guadalcanal, right? Less places to hide?
"Money doesnt talk, it swears. Obscenities, who really cares?" -Bob Dylan
"Habit is the balast that chains a dog to it's vomit." -Samuel Becket
"He has weapons of mass destruction- the world's deadliest weapons- which pose a direct threat to the
"Habit is the balast that chains a dog to it's vomit." -Samuel Becket
"He has weapons of mass destruction- the world's deadliest weapons- which pose a direct threat to the
Oboy! A hot new thread!
To Iain, Snigbert and other beta testers: I see where Snigbert sent a regimental combat team to Rennell. In PacWar, you could have five RCT's split from a single division and, if left alone, they would each grow into division-sized units. I never could justify that. It seemed there was no internal mechanism to limit the size of a detached units, and this detracted from the value of the game.
Do you all have any indication as to whether this is fixed or not in UV?
To Iain, Snigbert and other beta testers: I see where Snigbert sent a regimental combat team to Rennell. In PacWar, you could have five RCT's split from a single division and, if left alone, they would each grow into division-sized units. I never could justify that. It seemed there was no internal mechanism to limit the size of a detached units, and this detracted from the value of the game.
Do you all have any indication as to whether this is fixed or not in UV?
Pac War
Hi, Pac War units could clone themselves, Did you ever have to face a Japanese PBEM player who split the China Army and next thing you know the Japanese (billions of them) are entering India?
Message from Japanese commander " HQ please I need more troops
HQ "Go F%$^ yourself"
Commander "OK thanks"
Message from Japanese commander " HQ please I need more troops
HQ "Go F%$^ yourself"
Commander "OK thanks"
I'm not retreating, I'm attacking in a different direction!
"More Japanese air attacks from Rabaul and their carriers, hit Port Moresby and Gili Gili. Over 1000 casualties to the ground troops at those two locations over the last couple of days"
that is a lot of casualties! the guys must have been at a USO show to get that may casualties. I don't remember in any books about Guadalcanal that Japanese air caused a large number of casualties. If the Japanese could get that many men with air power they would not have to send in ground troops.
that is a lot of casualties! the guys must have been at a USO show to get that may casualties. I don't remember in any books about Guadalcanal that Japanese air caused a large number of casualties. If the Japanese could get that many men with air power they would not have to send in ground troops.
June 19th through July 18th
June 19th, 1942: Saratoga is 15 days away, and I find out that the Wasp will be in Pearl Harbor in 11 days. So before the Saratoga arrives I will know if the Wasp is also being sent.
I transfer Hudsons from PM to Cooktown, because they've been startlingly ineffective against Japanese ships.
There is another large air raid on Gili Gili...they're becoming commonplace at this point. 68 Vals, 48 Kates and 13 Zeros in the attack.
June 20th, 1942: Deciding I don't want to abandon Rennell Is., but I don't want to risk losing more transports to Japanese surface interdiction, I form a convoy with strong surface forces to protect it. 7 CAs, 6 DDs and 10 or so AP/AKs. I start loading them up at Noumea and order them to resupply Rennell Is.
S-41 hits AO Sata with 2 torpedoes, sinking her.
I also notice supplies on Gili Gili are critically low, probably due to the heavy bombing they have withstood. I have 4 airgroups of transport aircraft in Townsville, and I order them to start supplying Gili Gili by air.
June 22nd, 1942: Due to my Goerring-esque airbridge, supplies at Gili Gili reach a marginal level. (Orange instead of red)
I also decided to organize a nice air strike on Lae's airfield. I order all of the Marauders and Mitchells to attack there. We end up getting in a 74 plane raid, which does 28% damage to the runways and kills 118 Japs.
AP Katoomba is sunk at Port Moresby by Rabaul Bettys.
Japanese carriers launch a strike against a convoy resupplying Gili Gili. The get a bomb hit on the Australia and 2 bomb hits on the Hobart. I withdraw the convoy and cancel all the other convoys to Gili Gili and Port Moresby.
June 23rd, 1942: SS Grayback arrives, our first American sub reinforcement. I put it under computer control and allow it to run off towards Truk looking for prey.
More tragedy at Gili Gili. A surface force with 2 battleships (Kirishima and Hiei) intercept a small convoy leaving Gili Gili. They sink all three ships, the Demodicus, Diomed and Manunda.
Another large air strike against Lae, they now have 57% airfield damage.
June 24th, 1942: Another raid against Lae officially renders their airfield inoperable.
June 27th, 1942: S-45 hits Heiyu Maru at Lunga
June 28th, 1942: S-45 hits and sinks Chikaya Maru at Lunga
June 29th, 1942: Reinforcements arrive at Noumea. III Amphibious Corps, NZ Engineers and NZ Coastal Defense battery, 105 Base Force and 12th Australian Engineers.
Also, the CA Vincennes and Canberra arrive, along with CL Leander, CL St Louis and CL Honolulu.
I put together a task force with these fresh ships and some transports, to bring the NZ Engineers, NZ Coastal Defense and 105 base force to Nevea and start on the airfield there.
June 29th, 1942: The Battle of Rennell Island.
My new 'Protect convoys to Rennell' policy is tested.
My force: His Force:
CA San Francisco CA Kumano
CA Pensacola CA Ashigara
CA Chester BB Haruna
CA Northampton BB Kongo
CA Indianapolis CA Mogami
CA Louisville CL Nagara
CA Salt Lake City 9 DD
4 DDs
6 APs
2 AKS
Seems relatively fair, right? They sneak to within 5000 yards of us at Night
The Northampton seems to be stuck between the Kongo and Ashigara, as the three ships spend quite some time exchanging fire. Then the Chester joins in and begins firing on the Ashigaru as well. The Northampton bravely does quite a good job hitting the Kongo and Ashigara both with her 8 inch guns.
Then the Pensacola and Kumano square off, firing furiously at each other but not scoring many hits.
The Nagara and Mogami start to pick on the Louisville, which fires back at the Mogami. The Salt Lake City moves in and starts to hammer away at the Nagara and she's soon burning.
When the smoke clears, the Northampton and Chester sink, along with the DD Anderson. The Japanese DD Yagumo also sinks.
The Ashigara and Kongo each suffered 8 shell hits, the later is heavily damaged and on fire. The Nagara suffered 12 shell hits and is also heavily damaged and on fire.
The Louisville and Salt Lake City also took a beating, with 10 and 13 shell hits respectively they are both heavily damaged.
This was one of the more vicious surface battles I've seen, it seemed fitting after the equally nasty carrier battle earlier in the campaign.
June 30th, 1942: Saratoga is now 4 days away, and we see that the Wasp will also be joining us in 19 days. Good news indeed.
We are forced to scuttle the Salt Lake City, as she has lost propulsion and is ready to sink anyway.
The World's Finest Fighting force will be arriving at Noumea in 15 days. (1st Marine Division)
July 1st, 1942: We shift our air attacks from Lae's airfield to the port facilities.
July 2nd, 1942: Luganville reaches level 4 airfield size. I immediately rebase our B-17 assetts there.
It only equates to 37 airplanes, but give us time and there will be plenty more where those came from.
July 4th, 1942: Independence day. The Saratoga arrives and I put together a task force under Adm. McCain with the 3 Carriers, the newly arrived CLAAs San Diego and Atlanta, and DDs.
July 5th, 1942: 5 Japanese Carriers attack Gili Gili.
July 7th, 1942: S-43 hits Kiyozumi Maru, sinking her
Aircraft from PM interdict a Japanese convoy to Lae, managing to hit a few APs with 250 lb bombs.
July 8th, 1942: We move the III Amphibious Corps HQ to Rennell Island by destroyer. They have some support and engineers that might help build the base there a little more quickly.
July 9th, 1942: CA Louisville and DD Hammann are sent to Pearl Harbor for repairs.
July 11th, 1942: Our new airfield opens at Nevea. Hooray!
There was a strange lull in the action for a few days...all that happened here was some small air raids on each others bases.
July 16th, 1942: Indianapolis and Pensacola to Pearl Harbor for repairs.
5 CVs and 1 CVL spotted off of New Britain.
The Marines have arrived, and I begin organizing my task forces for an invasion of the Eastern Solomons.
Invasion Force Lunga: 5 DDs, 4 APDs, San Francisco, Vincennes, 10 APs
Invasion Force Tulagi: 5 DDs, 10 APs, CL Honolulu
Screening Force: CVE Long Island (ASW Patrol), Canberra, Leander, St Louis, 6 DDs
Air Task Force 1: Enterprise, Hornet, Atlanta, San Diego, Achilles, Phoenix, Nashville, New Orleans, Astoria
July 17th, 1942: Japanese forces land at Gili Gili!!!
6 Aircraft Carriers support them!!!
July 18th, 1942: All out air attack from Port Moresby on the invasion forces. They are met by over 90 Zeros flying CAP over the enemy TF.
We manage to hit the Zuiho with 2 500 lb bombs, but in the course of the attack we have 66 aircraft destroyed or damaged.
Wasp arrives at Noumea and we form our second air task force:
Saratoga, Wasp, Quincy, Juneau, San Jaun, 7 DDs
We now have 4 carriers, the next one on schedule is the Yorktown in about 4 months. I see there are now a total of 7 Japanese carriers operating. Some of them are CVLs or CVEs, but our Patrol planes dont seem to be able to distinguish.
I now have my forces assembled for an invasion. Lunga is a size 3 airfield, I'm not sure how many planes are located there. I did see a HQ unit, which suggests there might be larger ground units present.
The Japanese Carriers are tied up at Gili Gili, and the situation there is unresolved. Now I need to decide whether to go after the Japanese carriers with my own, or concentrate on attacking the Eastern Solomons while the enemy is preoccupied.
Suggestions?
I transfer Hudsons from PM to Cooktown, because they've been startlingly ineffective against Japanese ships.
There is another large air raid on Gili Gili...they're becoming commonplace at this point. 68 Vals, 48 Kates and 13 Zeros in the attack.
June 20th, 1942: Deciding I don't want to abandon Rennell Is., but I don't want to risk losing more transports to Japanese surface interdiction, I form a convoy with strong surface forces to protect it. 7 CAs, 6 DDs and 10 or so AP/AKs. I start loading them up at Noumea and order them to resupply Rennell Is.
S-41 hits AO Sata with 2 torpedoes, sinking her.
I also notice supplies on Gili Gili are critically low, probably due to the heavy bombing they have withstood. I have 4 airgroups of transport aircraft in Townsville, and I order them to start supplying Gili Gili by air.
June 22nd, 1942: Due to my Goerring-esque airbridge, supplies at Gili Gili reach a marginal level. (Orange instead of red)
I also decided to organize a nice air strike on Lae's airfield. I order all of the Marauders and Mitchells to attack there. We end up getting in a 74 plane raid, which does 28% damage to the runways and kills 118 Japs.
AP Katoomba is sunk at Port Moresby by Rabaul Bettys.
Japanese carriers launch a strike against a convoy resupplying Gili Gili. The get a bomb hit on the Australia and 2 bomb hits on the Hobart. I withdraw the convoy and cancel all the other convoys to Gili Gili and Port Moresby.
June 23rd, 1942: SS Grayback arrives, our first American sub reinforcement. I put it under computer control and allow it to run off towards Truk looking for prey.
More tragedy at Gili Gili. A surface force with 2 battleships (Kirishima and Hiei) intercept a small convoy leaving Gili Gili. They sink all three ships, the Demodicus, Diomed and Manunda.
Another large air strike against Lae, they now have 57% airfield damage.
June 24th, 1942: Another raid against Lae officially renders their airfield inoperable.
June 27th, 1942: S-45 hits Heiyu Maru at Lunga
June 28th, 1942: S-45 hits and sinks Chikaya Maru at Lunga
June 29th, 1942: Reinforcements arrive at Noumea. III Amphibious Corps, NZ Engineers and NZ Coastal Defense battery, 105 Base Force and 12th Australian Engineers.
Also, the CA Vincennes and Canberra arrive, along with CL Leander, CL St Louis and CL Honolulu.
I put together a task force with these fresh ships and some transports, to bring the NZ Engineers, NZ Coastal Defense and 105 base force to Nevea and start on the airfield there.
June 29th, 1942: The Battle of Rennell Island.
My new 'Protect convoys to Rennell' policy is tested.
My force: His Force:
CA San Francisco CA Kumano
CA Pensacola CA Ashigara
CA Chester BB Haruna
CA Northampton BB Kongo
CA Indianapolis CA Mogami
CA Louisville CL Nagara
CA Salt Lake City 9 DD
4 DDs
6 APs
2 AKS
Seems relatively fair, right? They sneak to within 5000 yards of us at Night
The Northampton seems to be stuck between the Kongo and Ashigara, as the three ships spend quite some time exchanging fire. Then the Chester joins in and begins firing on the Ashigaru as well. The Northampton bravely does quite a good job hitting the Kongo and Ashigara both with her 8 inch guns.
Then the Pensacola and Kumano square off, firing furiously at each other but not scoring many hits.
The Nagara and Mogami start to pick on the Louisville, which fires back at the Mogami. The Salt Lake City moves in and starts to hammer away at the Nagara and she's soon burning.
When the smoke clears, the Northampton and Chester sink, along with the DD Anderson. The Japanese DD Yagumo also sinks.
The Ashigara and Kongo each suffered 8 shell hits, the later is heavily damaged and on fire. The Nagara suffered 12 shell hits and is also heavily damaged and on fire.
The Louisville and Salt Lake City also took a beating, with 10 and 13 shell hits respectively they are both heavily damaged.
This was one of the more vicious surface battles I've seen, it seemed fitting after the equally nasty carrier battle earlier in the campaign.
June 30th, 1942: Saratoga is now 4 days away, and we see that the Wasp will also be joining us in 19 days. Good news indeed.
We are forced to scuttle the Salt Lake City, as she has lost propulsion and is ready to sink anyway.
The World's Finest Fighting force will be arriving at Noumea in 15 days. (1st Marine Division)
July 1st, 1942: We shift our air attacks from Lae's airfield to the port facilities.
July 2nd, 1942: Luganville reaches level 4 airfield size. I immediately rebase our B-17 assetts there.
It only equates to 37 airplanes, but give us time and there will be plenty more where those came from.
July 4th, 1942: Independence day. The Saratoga arrives and I put together a task force under Adm. McCain with the 3 Carriers, the newly arrived CLAAs San Diego and Atlanta, and DDs.
July 5th, 1942: 5 Japanese Carriers attack Gili Gili.
July 7th, 1942: S-43 hits Kiyozumi Maru, sinking her
Aircraft from PM interdict a Japanese convoy to Lae, managing to hit a few APs with 250 lb bombs.
July 8th, 1942: We move the III Amphibious Corps HQ to Rennell Island by destroyer. They have some support and engineers that might help build the base there a little more quickly.
July 9th, 1942: CA Louisville and DD Hammann are sent to Pearl Harbor for repairs.
July 11th, 1942: Our new airfield opens at Nevea. Hooray!
There was a strange lull in the action for a few days...all that happened here was some small air raids on each others bases.
July 16th, 1942: Indianapolis and Pensacola to Pearl Harbor for repairs.
5 CVs and 1 CVL spotted off of New Britain.
The Marines have arrived, and I begin organizing my task forces for an invasion of the Eastern Solomons.
Invasion Force Lunga: 5 DDs, 4 APDs, San Francisco, Vincennes, 10 APs
Invasion Force Tulagi: 5 DDs, 10 APs, CL Honolulu
Screening Force: CVE Long Island (ASW Patrol), Canberra, Leander, St Louis, 6 DDs
Air Task Force 1: Enterprise, Hornet, Atlanta, San Diego, Achilles, Phoenix, Nashville, New Orleans, Astoria
July 17th, 1942: Japanese forces land at Gili Gili!!!
6 Aircraft Carriers support them!!!
July 18th, 1942: All out air attack from Port Moresby on the invasion forces. They are met by over 90 Zeros flying CAP over the enemy TF.
We manage to hit the Zuiho with 2 500 lb bombs, but in the course of the attack we have 66 aircraft destroyed or damaged.
Wasp arrives at Noumea and we form our second air task force:
Saratoga, Wasp, Quincy, Juneau, San Jaun, 7 DDs
We now have 4 carriers, the next one on schedule is the Yorktown in about 4 months. I see there are now a total of 7 Japanese carriers operating. Some of them are CVLs or CVEs, but our Patrol planes dont seem to be able to distinguish.
I now have my forces assembled for an invasion. Lunga is a size 3 airfield, I'm not sure how many planes are located there. I did see a HQ unit, which suggests there might be larger ground units present.
The Japanese Carriers are tied up at Gili Gili, and the situation there is unresolved. Now I need to decide whether to go after the Japanese carriers with my own, or concentrate on attacking the Eastern Solomons while the enemy is preoccupied.
Suggestions?
"Money doesnt talk, it swears. Obscenities, who really cares?" -Bob Dylan
"Habit is the balast that chains a dog to it's vomit." -Samuel Becket
"He has weapons of mass destruction- the world's deadliest weapons- which pose a direct threat to the
"Habit is the balast that chains a dog to it's vomit." -Samuel Becket
"He has weapons of mass destruction- the world's deadliest weapons- which pose a direct threat to the
-
madflava13
- Posts: 1501
- Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2001 10:00 am
- Location: Alexandria, VA
I say stick with Lunga invasion and save your resources for a more favorable opportunity. With Rennell Island and Nevea built up, and Lunga in hand, you'll have a powerful hold on the eastern solomons...
Just my two cents
Just my two cents
"The Paraguayan Air Force's request for spraying subsidies was not as Paraguayan as it were..."
Too Fast
Hi, Snigbert how long will it take the Jap CV to react to your invasion. I don't think you'll be able to unload. If you lose the CV reaction battle anything ashore at Lunga will be left all alone with no hope of help. Your putting your head right into a noose. No matter how frustrating doing nothing may be. You have to set up a carrier battle under favorable conditions. Get your LBA up in the forward bases supplied and ready. Then fight the battle where they can help make up for the Japs having more CV. If you lose at least the Marines are safe. If you win the invasion will be justified. Also take control of all your subs and place them in the path the Japs will have to rake to get to the battle area.
I'm not retreating, I'm attacking in a different direction!
Getting LBA up to the forward bases could take months. I have held Rennell for over a month with large numbers of supplies (30000) and lots of troops working on it, and I still can't land a plane there. Raising Nevea from a level 1 airfield to a level 2 airfield could take just as long.
I think it would take a day or two for the Japanese carriers to react from Gili Gili to make it to Guadalcanal. However, if they do that they are leaving their own invasion open to counter attack.
I somewhat agree with what Mogami is saying, however, sometimes you have to strike when an opportunity presents itself rather than waiting until everything is lined up in perfect order.
So I intend to go with the following plan:
1. Move my 4 carriers (in 2 task forces) to the eastern edge of the Solomons, with orders not to chase after enemy carrier groups. In this position they will be out of range of Rabaul, and within (the limits of) range for the Nevea CAP.
2. Have my screening force bombard Lunga
3. Land 1st Marines on Lunga (except for 1st Paras and 1st Raiders, which will take Tulagi)
Keep in mind I have 346 carrier based planes operating now...1/3 of which are Wildcats. These should be able to put up enough CAP to deal with the Lunga air units.
I will swiftly take Lunga and rebase it with my own planes, before the Japanese carriers can react.
I think it would take a day or two for the Japanese carriers to react from Gili Gili to make it to Guadalcanal. However, if they do that they are leaving their own invasion open to counter attack.
I somewhat agree with what Mogami is saying, however, sometimes you have to strike when an opportunity presents itself rather than waiting until everything is lined up in perfect order.
So I intend to go with the following plan:
1. Move my 4 carriers (in 2 task forces) to the eastern edge of the Solomons, with orders not to chase after enemy carrier groups. In this position they will be out of range of Rabaul, and within (the limits of) range for the Nevea CAP.
2. Have my screening force bombard Lunga
3. Land 1st Marines on Lunga (except for 1st Paras and 1st Raiders, which will take Tulagi)
Keep in mind I have 346 carrier based planes operating now...1/3 of which are Wildcats. These should be able to put up enough CAP to deal with the Lunga air units.
I will swiftly take Lunga and rebase it with my own planes, before the Japanese carriers can react.
"Money doesnt talk, it swears. Obscenities, who really cares?" -Bob Dylan
"Habit is the balast that chains a dog to it's vomit." -Samuel Becket
"He has weapons of mass destruction- the world's deadliest weapons- which pose a direct threat to the
"Habit is the balast that chains a dog to it's vomit." -Samuel Becket
"He has weapons of mass destruction- the world's deadliest weapons- which pose a direct threat to the
Hello...
The number "killed" in the report is notoriously innaccurate. Reduce the value significantly and change most of those "killed" to wounded or missing (but return later). Fog of war.
I have frequently seen more men reported killed in a unit than the total in the unit and when I looked at the unit, it looked pretty healthy.
Hope this Helps...
Michael Wood
___________________________________________________
The number "killed" in the report is notoriously innaccurate. Reduce the value significantly and change most of those "killed" to wounded or missing (but return later). Fog of war.
I have frequently seen more men reported killed in a unit than the total in the unit and when I looked at the unit, it looked pretty healthy.
Hope this Helps...
Michael Wood
___________________________________________________
Originally posted by Snigbert
Thes ground casualty numbers seem excessive, even for an unopposed strike, over so short an interval. Is this typical?
I agree MDiehl. I was thinking the same thing. Actually, it says in the report that these are the number 'killed', which makes it seem even more excessive. I could see that many being wounded, if you figure for everyone killed you have x5 or x10 wounded.
Offenese versus Defense
Greetings. I was just wondering what opportunity had presented it's self? The Japs may leave their invasion open to counter attack by reacting to yours but I'm missing how you intend on exploiting that reaction.
What are the natures and requirements of war that decide when to maintain a defense or when to commit to the offense?
I believe it is exploitable weakness. The stronger side by virtue of a material/space/time advantage is entitled to the risk of attack in order to profit from their advantage. The materially stronger side can mass the required force while still providing for
the basic defensive needs. The weaker side has to protect their position and can only gather attacking force at the expense of weakening their already inferior position. Your basic positions are not secure from attack and yet you feel there exists an opportunity to expand. As long as the enemy is in possession of
more offensive power you should remain on the defensive.
The intentions of the enemy have yet to be determined. You should wait until you have an understanding of what those plans are and then once they have been understood look for a way to exploit them. Make him expend his offensive power on your prepared defense. When all his material has been committed then using material you have kept in reserve decide how to employ it to exploit the situation.
The proper course would be to eliminate any weakness in your position. Remove the material disadvantage either by building up or by defeating his offensive. And then going over to the offensive against the enemies weakest points.
By doing this you will gradually improve your situation and dictate the future course of the campaign. While you may have 1-2 days to off load onto Lunga I wonder if that is enough time to unload enough supplies to maintain your force. Can you guarantee future supply reinforcement if that should prove necessary Your base/support units are engaged in other work and will have to move to Lunga to keep it operating. The enemy will be able to use his numbers to cordon off Lunga while a counter move is prepared. He might decide to leave you on Lunga while striking at your rear now without the defense of the units stranded on Lunga. The attack is desired it is true my question is ... is it justified by the strategic conditions that require the attacker to be stronger then the defender and an exploitable weakness for a target. The loss of Lunga under the present conditions for the Japanese does not change their status. Rather it provides them with a ready made weakness of yours to use to further draw your forces into battle where they hold even greater advantage. until you defeat his present active forces you have no reason to suppose any offensive by your self will meet with success.
It will however be exciting and interesting to hear how you make out. Good Luck ( I don't like to leave things to chance if preparation and planning will/can do instead )
What are the natures and requirements of war that decide when to maintain a defense or when to commit to the offense?
I believe it is exploitable weakness. The stronger side by virtue of a material/space/time advantage is entitled to the risk of attack in order to profit from their advantage. The materially stronger side can mass the required force while still providing for
the basic defensive needs. The weaker side has to protect their position and can only gather attacking force at the expense of weakening their already inferior position. Your basic positions are not secure from attack and yet you feel there exists an opportunity to expand. As long as the enemy is in possession of
more offensive power you should remain on the defensive.
The intentions of the enemy have yet to be determined. You should wait until you have an understanding of what those plans are and then once they have been understood look for a way to exploit them. Make him expend his offensive power on your prepared defense. When all his material has been committed then using material you have kept in reserve decide how to employ it to exploit the situation.
The proper course would be to eliminate any weakness in your position. Remove the material disadvantage either by building up or by defeating his offensive. And then going over to the offensive against the enemies weakest points.
By doing this you will gradually improve your situation and dictate the future course of the campaign. While you may have 1-2 days to off load onto Lunga I wonder if that is enough time to unload enough supplies to maintain your force. Can you guarantee future supply reinforcement if that should prove necessary Your base/support units are engaged in other work and will have to move to Lunga to keep it operating. The enemy will be able to use his numbers to cordon off Lunga while a counter move is prepared. He might decide to leave you on Lunga while striking at your rear now without the defense of the units stranded on Lunga. The attack is desired it is true my question is ... is it justified by the strategic conditions that require the attacker to be stronger then the defender and an exploitable weakness for a target. The loss of Lunga under the present conditions for the Japanese does not change their status. Rather it provides them with a ready made weakness of yours to use to further draw your forces into battle where they hold even greater advantage. until you defeat his present active forces you have no reason to suppose any offensive by your self will meet with success.
It will however be exciting and interesting to hear how you make out. Good Luck ( I don't like to leave things to chance if preparation and planning will/can do instead )
I'm not retreating, I'm attacking in a different direction!
Sounds like the best plan also try to scrape together a fast surface TF so that if the Japanese carriers react to your invasion of the Solomons you can slip them into Gilli Gilli and do some damage to the transports. If the Japanese CVs don't react then your invasion is safe. Either way you gain. If they split their forces oh boy 'Katie bar the door'.Originally posted by Snigbert
So I intend to go with the following plan:
1. Move my 4 carriers (in 2 task forces) to the eastern edge of the Solomons, with orders not to chase after enemy carrier groups. In this position they will be out of range of Rabaul, and within (the limits of) range for the Nevea CAP.
2. Have my screening force bombard Lunga
3. Land 1st Marines on Lunga (except for 1st Paras and 1st Raiders, which will take Tulagi)
Keep in mind I have 346 carrier based planes operating now...1/3 of which are Wildcats. These should be able to put up enough CAP to deal with the Lunga air units.
I will swiftly take Lunga and rebase it with my own planes, before the Japanese carriers can react.
