Ver 4 Bug s Here!

Paul Vebber · Post by **Paul Vebber** » Sat Sep 09, 2000 8:08 pm

1) ID flags don't work
2) Surrendering player in online game does not get end game screen becasue player accepting surrender is immediately disconnected.
3) OOB/Scenario issues (Finns in particualr)

David Heath · Post by **David Heath** » Sat Sep 09, 2000 8:35 pm

As has always been the Matrix way once we get a few days worth of feedback we will correct these bugs and make a patch. It will be VERY small in size.

David

Kharan · Post by **Kharan** » Sat Sep 09, 2000 9:08 pm

Two small things I've noticed are that forward obs graphic has 3 or 4 men (maybe there's a reason?) and retreating tanks don't make a sound.

Hopefully this isn't thought of as complaining, but I still couldn't find evidence that abandoned tanks are counted destroyed even with total battlefield control. Infact, even empty tanks destroyed by spiking aren't counted in the end score (although they are said to be destroyed in the unit list).

Then about the aircraft.

If you don't count the ground specialists, it seems you have less than 40% chance for a plane (with 70-80 exp) to get a second run. So if you spend ~100 points for a plane which has MG's and cannons only, you are most likely to get only one run (which of course doesn't do much at all). A plane with bombs or rockets will drop them, and then most likely leave. Realistic? Probably. Balanced? Read on...

Now, I've always thought that aircraft are more or less worth their points because even if their bombs or rockets don't get much done, they can stick around and machine gun down infantry and shoot at tanks with their cannon until ammo runs out or they are badly damaged.

I will accept the high cost, the out of contact feature and the fact that planes in SPWAW will leave after only 1 point damage, but this does seem a bit much. Or is it intentional, so that only ground attack specialists are to be used in random battles, and the other planes are just for experimenting?

If not, I suggest that the cannon be included in the "good weps" and the experience roll, if not eliminated altogether(there already is enough hazard versus effectiveness divided by cost and 1 damage point is not too hard to get), made way easier (70 exp should give 70% to stay).

Hmm... I probably sound too negative, but frankly, if those were fixed, the game would be bloody near perfect!

ps. Great to have the unit pictures!

Paul Vebber · Post by **Paul Vebber** » Sat Sep 09, 2000 9:25 pm

Another one seems to be that if you hit F9 to surrender and choose to abort, your poor leadership decision causes your turn to end...

Paul Vebber · Post by **Paul Vebber** » Sat Sep 09, 2000 9:29 pm

A big reason for the high sost of Aircraft is their Lessoned but still considerable intel gathering capability...And those bombers can be devestating in the right place...even with one run. Continnue to let us know what you think!

We will revisit the "abandoned tank issue - thought that was squashed but wouldn't be the first or third time its made a reappearance...

McGib · Post by **McGib** » Sat Sep 09, 2000 10:24 pm

Started up a "battle" twice and got a blank screen for a map. The small map in the corner was also blank. All the keys on the right were there and apparently working, just no map. The game appeared to work as I got op fire prompts but I could see nothing.

Paul Vebber · Post by **Paul Vebber** » Sat Sep 09, 2000 11:11 pm

delete the steel.prf file in teh SAVE folder. that ususally fixes that.

Kharan · Post by **Kharan** » Sun Sep 10, 2000 12:08 am

A big reason for the high sost of Aircraft is their Lessoned but still considerable intel gathering capability...And those bombers can be devestating in the right place...even with one run. Continnue to let us know what you think!

Even if you could access the plane info screen and turn off weapons so you could use them as scouts (hint hint), 3 MG and cannon sprays (that's one run) for 90 points is still a bit dubious.

Hopefully aircraft cannons can and will be included in the "good weapons" that allow planes to stay. However, I realize the limited influence of one person's opinion

.

We will revisit the "abandoned tank issue - thought that was squashed but wouldn't be the first or third time its made a reappearance...

It's been bugging me since v1.0 and even in v2.3 where it was said to be fixed I couldn't see it work

. IIRC, in v2.3 abandoned tanks started to give points according to number of their crew (5-manned tank gave 5 points).

But since I'm the only one who talks about it, it can be just me

. So can anyone else produce any situation (a save?) where abandoned (or destroyed by spiking) tanks are counted destroyed in the end results?

Don · Post by **Don** » Sun Sep 10, 2000 1:52 am

I had the problem with the forward observers - except mine showed 5 men! When I tried to put them in the FO jeep, it said it couldn't carry everyone. I've never tried putting them in the jeep before, but I figure it should work. I checked the OOB for the FO crew, and it says it's 2 men, so I don't know what the problem is.
Other than that, installation and gameplay went great, and I have to get used to the move radius being dark on the light map. I like the way the game has been "tightened up" with less delays!

Don

Don · Post by **Don** » Sun Sep 10, 2000 2:05 am

Oh yea, and ID flags worked fine for me (US and German)

Don

Wild Bill · Post by **Wild Bill** » Sun Sep 10, 2000 2:52 am

The F0 jeep is considered "full" of folks already observing. If you want a jeep for the FO, you'll have to buy it Don. The FO jeep is occupied and no one wants to give up his seat.

I think if you look inside the F0 Jeep it already has a crew listed inside.

Right click on it and see how many men are in the jeep.

Wild Bill

------------------
In Arduis Fidelis
Wild Bill Wilder
Coordinator, Scenario Design
Matrix Games

Galanti · Post by **Galanti** » Sun Sep 10, 2000 3:05 am

Sound cuts in and out, fades in and out. Can this be cured by deleting steel.prf and reseting preferences?

Still, a fantastic effort!

Rhone · Post by **Rhone** » Sun Sep 10, 2000 3:46 am

So far I have not noticed bugs but have a couple of questions.

1. When playing a WWII campaign, I select the U.S. Army and I start with 4300 points and 4300 support points as well. That seems like alot, is that a correct number of points to start with?

2. Sounds are missing, fast artillery is silent...but I have a SB Live.

3. A few of the tanks in the U.S. Army arsenal show up as antiquated cannons (in the encyclopedia).

4. Is there a way to get the red highlight on my active unit to go away? I don't like that.

Just bringing up issues. It's a truly great game and so far seems up for the challenge of becoming even better!

[This message has been edited by Rhone (edited September 09, 2000).]

Paul Vebber · Post by **Paul Vebber** » Sun Sep 10, 2000 4:34 am

The lack of scor for abandaned tanks is a bonafide bug we will fix...they show as destroyed,but thepoints don't show up to be counted.

With fog of war on the graphics for infantry are "generic" for small (2-4) med (5-8) and large (9+) so you are not sure how many men your enemy has. The number will tell you "truth" about your own forces.

COuld be an error if a "MG only" pplane is 90 points, they should be under 60.

Will check the other stuff...Thanks!

Pack Rat · Post by **Pack Rat** » Sun Sep 10, 2000 9:46 am

Originally posted by McGib:
Started up a "battle" twice and got a blank screen for a map. The small map in the corner was also blank. All the keys on the right were there and apparently working, just no map. The game appeared to work as I got op fire prompts but I could see nothing.

I saw the same thing. I hit my i key and every thing turned on. The music played fine but battle sounds were a shrill, rebooted machine and it works fine now. I had rebooted after patch but maybe the config update didn't take first time, dunno.

------------------

Good hunting,
Pack Rat

Rhone · Post by **Rhone** » Sun Sep 10, 2000 12:03 pm

After investigating further, I notice that the support points vary ALOT based on the year and the starting force points vary a bit as well. I know the veterans out there already know this but I am new to these points as the last time I played was with the original steel panthers which I recall the points being a whole lot less.

So anyway, I thought having 4300 support points was excessive. I bought a ton of B-26's and a few 16 inch bombardments form ships and focused it all on the center of my Morroccan Beachhead...it's late and I haven't gotten my troops there yet, but I'm pretty sure everything in this 300x400 yard area is gone. All the tankers my bombers spotted are destroyed. I don't know if the points are realistic or not, but that was a whole lot of fun! Craters and smoke are the new owners of that small piece of real estate, not Vichy French!

Thanks again for a wonderful product, but my artillery sounds are still silent...I just pretend it's what the enemy on the ground hears!

fdlu · Post by **fdlu** » Sun Sep 10, 2000 4:10 pm

Just noticed. (i won´t call it a bug)

Still no text descriptions in the
encyclop. (would be very informative)
the folder enc. is still full of nice
txt files.

Some pictures are wrong.(not many)

Kharan · Post by **Kharan** » Sun Sep 10, 2000 7:28 pm

COuld be an error if a "MG only" pplane is 90 points, they should be under 60.

The cheapest plane of all is the british Meteor Mk I which costs 81 points. It has a 20mm cannon. On average (with 70-80 exp) you will get 4 cannon shots (2 attack runs) out of them and then they're gone.

With the cost of one Do-217E2 (16 bombs, 16 per turn) you will get 8 150mm howitzers (480 rounds, 24 per turn).

I'm not saying that all equipment needs to be balanced (effectiveness vs cost) meticulously with each other, but surely planes should have a place somewhere. I know this isn't a problem in those games where the computer buys the troops.

I do not expect you to suddenly lower the airplane costs, but could you take a look at that new exp roll, if it just is too low? 70 experience should give 70% chance to stay on the battlefield, IMO.

Btw, good to know you guys found the bug re: empty tanks. I hadn't totally lost my mind after all

.

Some small (and trivial cosmetic) things:

In timed play, range (the y-key) needs to be entered twice.

British equipment list goes off the screen in '45 and there's no "next" button.

Next and previous buttons in encyplopedia display a fort which doesn't have a picture.

Aircraft that don't have or have run out of bombs display the bombing message.

Paul Vebber · Post by **Paul Vebber** » Sun Sep 10, 2000 8:15 pm

OOOPs I forgot the program multiplies the base cost of aircraft by 1.5... I will fix that!!

sami heimola · Post by **sami heimola** » Sun Sep 10, 2000 8:19 pm

I noticed a strange bug. Meeting engagement Finns vs Russians 1944. I played two turns and everything was OK. No ID flags. As I pressed "change turn"-button, ID flags for each sides appeared but whole game crashed! So I was have to reboot my computer...

Another bug: VP flags have strange "stripes" shown in the beginning of game. But if I move my troops on them, stripes disappear.

Has anyone else noticed these?

Sami

[This message has been edited by sami heimola (edited September 10, 2000).]