Why isn't PBEM integrated into wargames?

[marcusm]

Just in case the title confuses someone.

What I mean is that I would like to see the actual email management integrated into the game systems. Adding email support to standard applications isn't really that hard (even I can write smtp/pop managers).

I just find it cumbersome to remember filenames and manage email turns via my normal email software when it could have been done much more neatly within the games.

Am I the first to think of this?

[ravinhood]

I agree with this also. I would like to see PBEM features streamlined to make it much easier to send and get files and have them automatically set themselves up so all I have to do is press like one button and I'm playing my turn or sending my turn to my opponent. They can make all these pretty pictures and can't even make PBEM easier to use.

[marcusm]

I just thought that if this was improved upon then PBEM could see itself vitalized and
growing more popular. I still think pbem is the optimal mp format for those with a hectic life .

[Brigz]

ORIGINAL: marcusm

I just find it cumbersome to remember filenames and manage email turns via my normal email software when it could have been done much more neatly within the games.

Am I the first to think of this?

I'm not sure I follow you. I mean, how hard is it to send a game file? I can do it in less than a minute. Hit one icon to call up my email server. Click on my opponents address. Attach the file and, zoom, it's on it's way. And I don't even have to exit the game program.

I guess if it was part of the game software I could save... what... 15 seconds![&:]

Then again, I could be totally missing your point.[;)]

[marcusm]

Because, once you have more than one round at a time it becomes cumbersome to manage the files.
Second, these files can easily drown among other email (even not counting spam).

Third. It's something that would enhance the pbem aspect of games.

[Veldor]

ORIGINAL: marcusm

Just in case the title confuses someone.

What I mean is that I would like to see the actual email management integrated into the game systems. Adding email support to standard applications isn't really that hard (even I can write smtp/pop managers).

I just find it cumbersome to remember filenames and manage email turns via my normal email software when it could have been done much more neatly within the games.

Am I the first to think of this?

This thread seriously offends me.

What you are suggesting is that wargame developers raise the bar and actually develop something better than that which came before them.

It is the whole point of computer wargaming I thought to look backwards and only try to recreate and redo what already was.

Certainly there is no time or need to put effort into anything that hasn't already been the norm.

How ridiculous to suggest a developer institute a feature not already present in all other wargames.

Innovation, Evolution, these things do not apply to the wargaming niche.

I'm really surprised by your statements... [;)]

[Veldor]

ORIGINAL: Dave Briggs
I'm not sure I follow you. I mean, how hard is it to send a game file? I can do it in less than a minute. Hit one icon to call up my email server. Click on my opponents address. Attach the file and, zoom, it's on it's way. And I don't even have to exit the game program.

I guess if it was part of the game software I could save... what... 15 seconds![&:]

Then again, I could be totally missing your point.[;)]

Because its not that easy to everyone. Different people have different levels of computer literacy. Different people have different tolerances for whats too much effort and whats not. Some people get confused by it or have security software or other items that make managing the files manually a pain.

I can cite half a DOZEN times in the last month i've gotten the wrong turn sent to me, or mine back etc by accidental click/use of the wrong file. Or even a missing attachment.

It should be easier because its simple to make it easier. Just no one want to take the first step forward on this.

Its a shame.

Its an even bigger shame that no developers ever directly comment on issues like these. Unforgiveable really. It just leaves the rest of us to mostly agree on flaws that we might otherwise be happily corrected on. But I think, rather, the reason they never comment is because we are in fact correct more often than not...

So this challenge to the devs... This is an easier one... Why can't you/didn't you/aren't you/won't you do this?

Thanks!

[Veldor]

ORIGINAL: Veldor
So this challenge to the devs... This is an easier one... Why can't you/didn't you/aren't you/won't you do this?

I'll answer this one for you Veldor. Not a problem and happy to take up the challenge.

You see its this simple. We spent several weeks arguing over what color the flag was suppose to be for the historical period in question. With the resultant research required on all fronts by the majority of our staff on this issue we just didn't have time to apply to anything that would enhance the playing experience such as the simple UI enhancement the forum member above mentioned.

We've also weighed carefully complaints in the past and simply find that these types of complaints die quicker due to an inability by most to provide any direct evidence as to their accuracy or not. Whereas minor historical accuracy concerns are just never let go of since there are more referenceable sources for this for the average user.

I do sincerely hope that you understand our position on this and related issues and know that we do not plan to change it anytime soon unless such a time as it should otherwise become the norm in the wargaming world at which point we would obviously comply.

We do thank you for your concern.

Kind regards...

[marcusm]

Interesting responses .

For me this is also a marketing scheme. I am thinking of ways to bring PBEM to new
crowds. There are some who look down upon email based games and call it slow and cumbersome.

Question is how to respond to that challenge? In game pbem is one way but perhaps web based "PBEM portals"
is another.

[marcusm]

Almost forgot. Does anyone remember those mini email games like the UFO/XCOM one? Those
were actually ahead of their time.

[e_barkmann]

SSG's PBEM management system has been present in their games since Korsun Pocket. They even used a compression and error check system so that the system would check for corruption during transit. In their latest games they also have a management window to check each PBEM game status and easy deletion of older games. Very cool.

Cheers Chris

[marcusm]

Sounds good. I hope more games adpot those ideas.

[Veldor]

ORIGINAL: marcusm

Interesting responses .

For me this is also a marketing scheme. I am thinking of ways to bring PBEM to new
crowds. There are some who look down upon email based games and call it slow and cumbersome.

Question is how to respond to that challenge? In game pbem is one way but perhaps web based "PBEM portals"
is another.

Just this week someone came to these forums vowing to never buy another Matrix Game due to problems with PBEM. The whole Better Business Bureau thing. I think thats all too common amongst the new blood though many probably never even post asking for help at all.

NOT EVERYONE enjoys forums, being attacked for everything they post, and so on. So the new blood comes, gets bitten, and goes away for ever.

And sure that guy was a newb nut. But for as wrong as he was he was also right.

[Veldor]

ORIGINAL: Chris Merchant

SSG's PBEM management system has been present in their games since Korsun Pocket. They even used a compression and error check system so that the system would check for corruption during transit. In their latest games they also have a management window to check each PBEM game status and easy deletion of older games. Very cool.

Cheers Chris

Good to know. That's one series I must confess to never having tried. Might be a neat thing to promote and/or even the type of features that add up to warranting some sort of demo.

If its in there why not other games? It might even be the sort of thing worthwhile for Matrix to develop in a modular fashion in a way that can be used in all of their games. Those types of things would save developers the needless redundant work of coding it each on thier own and further add to the value that Matrix can offer them..

PS. That really is impressive to know about SSG. By comparison they are a major outfit though Maybe its the aspiring Garage Devs that need the help then..

[Brigz]

ORIGINAL: Veldor




Because its not that easy to everyone. Different people have different levels of computer literacy. Different people have different tolerances for whats too much effort and whats not. Some people get confused by it or have security software or other items that make managing the files manually a pain.

I can cite half a DOZEN times in the last month i've gotten the wrong turn sent to me, or mine back etc by accidental click/use of the wrong file. Or even a missing attachment.

It should be easier because its simple to make it easier. Just no one want to take the first step forward on this.

Its a shame.

Its an even bigger shame that no developers ever directly comment on issues like these. Unforgiveable really. It just leaves the rest of us to mostly agree on flaws that we might otherwise be happily corrected on. But I think, rather, the reason they never comment is because we are in fact correct more often than not...

So this challenge to the devs... This is an easier one... Why can't you/didn't you/aren't you/won't you do this?

Thanks!

Guess I minimalized the problem or really didn't get the gist of it. I really haven't given this much thought, but I do see your points. I'm sure an integrated pbem system would make gaming a smoother process. Just has never been a big problem for me.[8D]

[marcusm]

I actually heard of the PBEM portal system regarding AGEOD:s Civil War game. I have and like that
game but the pbem system is a real pain in the butt to use. Wargame designers really need to think
of accessibility when desiging games. It would do alot to bring new wargamers to the community. I am
one of those who refuse to buy into the "Wargamers will never increase and alway be in decline". It is possibe
to recruit new gamers. For the simple fact that history interst never dies out, it was why I started in the first place.

[mack2]

It's about time developers did not just take the lazy option of PBEM, and intergrate direct connections into their games, so both people are online at the same time, can play a game without needing to muck around emailing each other.

Starcraft had direct connection back in 1998, so there should be no excuse for a simple 1v1 connection over the internet for a wargame in 2008.

[JudgeDredd]

Never been a problem for me because I do not pbem...I did pbem when I beta tested, and I see why it would help gamers during the process.

I agree...good point. [&o]

[e_barkmann]

An enthusiast created an application to help in PBEM games, but sadly it looks like development ended in 2004:

http://www.nic.fi/~fuerte/pbem.htm

cheers

[Fred98]

The SSG games have used a great PBEM feature since late 2003 with the release of Korsun Pocket.

When you hit the End Game button, it opens up you’re email and attaches the file ready to send.

You can type a few comments before you send the email if you so choose.

When you’re opponent sends the turn, you click on the file and the game opens up and the turn opens ready for you to play!

Korsun Pocket
Battles in Normandy
Battles in Italy
Battlefront

-