AE Land and AI Issues [OUTDATED]

[Blackhorse]

ORIGINAL: VSWG

Right now aviation support squads need no support. Will this be changes in AE, or will all Aviation Regiments lose their support squads, since they are not needed?

This is being reviewed. At this time, US Aviation Regiments have no support squads -- they support only air, not ground, units. Play testing and time will determine if other base forces give LCUs adequate support.

[Blackhorse]

ORIGINAL: spence

But apparently the CD defenses controlling Manila Bay are still split between the Bataan hex and the Manile hex?

Yes. There's no easy answer for this.

In the actual war, if the Japanese captured Bataan while the Allies dug in to Manila, the harbor forts would still have prevented the Japanese fleet from sailing into Manila Bay. So we can't have all the CD defenses in Bataan.

Splitting the CD defenses seems to be the "least bad" option.

[Blackhorse]

ORIGINAL: el cid again
There is a new book - Australian Special Forces - and it appears that small forces - small enough to be delived by submarine on occasion - were a factor later in the war. And farther afield than I would have imagined. Similarly, an older book, The Alamo Scouts, indicates the US used such forces with effect in the MarArthur area. [They were modeled on the Eskimo Scouts, who during the war were special recon elements: today two different kinds of units claim their liniage: Alaska National Guard claimed all but one of its battalions were "Eskimo Scouts" until they were required to reform as support battalions - but a few small elements were retained anyway; The Alaska State Defense Force - which stills wears the ATG (Alaska Territorial Guard) patch - claims its three light infantry battalions are also of the same liniage (a fourth battalion - newly formed up - is Military Police).] The Aleutians campaign involved a lot of learning - including why you should NOT send in a landing without current assets on island. In a strange battle, US and Canadian forces landed on opposite ends of a valley - but the enemy was not present - so when they met - in the near perpetual fog of the area - they engaged each other - somewhat vigorously! The other big land battle didn't go so badly - because the enemy was actually there - although they did spook us by a kamakaze charge at the end that nearly overran a firebase.
The engine seems to work well if you put ANY small unit in the hex - you get good intel.

I did some follow-up research on the Alamo and Eskimo Scouts. The Alamo Scouts were the brainchild of LTG Krueger. He called them "Alamo Scouts" because he was a proud Texan.They reported directly to him as an "Army" level asset. Their total strength never exceeded 127 men, and they deployed in 'teams' of a dozen men or less to conduct raids and recon. The Alamo Scouts are too small to include as a separate unit in WitP-AE, especially in 1944.

The Alaskan Territorial Guard, aka "Eskimo Scouts" was a collection of unpaid, all-volunteer Alaskans who patrolled the long, sparsely populated coastline in their spare time looking for Japanese scouting parties, and searching for survivors of not-infrequent US airplane crashes. There were over 6,000 of these folks, led by a permanent military staff of 21 people, commanded by a US Army Major.

The Eskimo Scouts were basically "Coastwatchers on Ice". Wikipedia has a nice article on them. To represent the capabilities of the Eskimo Scouts I will see if we can add a "coastwatcher" capability to Alaskan bases in WitP-AE in a patch, if it is not already incorporated.

MG Buckner formed another special recon unit, the "Alaskan Scouts", later formalized as the 1st Combat Intelligence Platoon (Provisional). These were local rugged outdoorsmen who conducted recon and guided US landings in the Aleutians. This group was analagous to the Alamo Scouts, and like them, is too small to make an independent appearance in WitP-AE.

[Blackhorse]

That's it for US Land OOB observations for the next few days.

I'm still racing through China on vacation -- Taipei, Shanghai, Wuxi, Nanjing and Beijing so far, and I'm off to Harbin tonight.

Note to self: WitP-AE definitely needs more cold weather penalties in Northern China in the Winter.

Happy New Year, all!

[saj42]

A question regarding replacements and upgrade 'cos i'm a bit confused (not TO&E change - I understand that)
 
In stock WITP, air units have separate buttons for 'upgrading' and 'accepting replacements', LCUs don't.
 
In AE, will LCUs handle 'upgrading devices' and 'accepting replacement devices' as separate processes ??? (so we don't have the old problem of recombining a Division's three elements because one has upgraded). This would also allow a player to rebuild a rear area/garrison LCU with old devices, saving the new devices/upgraded squads for the frontline combat units.

[Andy Mac]

No sorry Tallyho as per stock

[spence]

According to "Shattered Sword" there were two 7 or 7.1 inch coast defense guns on Midway in June 42.

[Mike Scholl]

ORIGINAL: spence

According to "Shattered Sword" there were two 7 or 7.1 inch coast defense guns on Midway in June 42.

Suckers must have been really old..., I don't think the US had used a 7" gun since before the turn of the century. If I recall correctly, there were a few on Oahu that the Navy had given the army during the First World War...., so it's possible.

[treespider]

History of Marine Corps Operation In World War II has this to say about the 7 inchers...in Volume I, Part V, Chapter 3, Page 216-217...

p 216 -Batteries A and C of the 4th Defense Battalion, left pearl Harbor on 19 December with the old Navy 7-inch (note 4) and the 3 inch guns which had been shipped to Pearl Harbor for Midway prior to the outset of war.

p 216 ...turned over to Battery A the mission of installing and manning the 7inch and 3 inch batteries to be emplaced on Eastern Island...

p 216 (note 4) - These 7 inch weapons had been removed from pre-World War I battleships and stored in reserve at naval yards. KJ Bauer "Ships of the navy"

p 217 Umstead's 5 inch Battery, along with the island's other 7 inch battery, were set up south of the radio station on Sand Island.

[msieving1]

ORIGINAL: Mike Scholl

ORIGINAL: spence

According to "Shattered Sword" there were two 7 or 7.1 inch coast defense guns on Midway in June 42.

Suckers must have been really old..., I don't think the US had used a 7" gun since before the turn of the century. If I recall correctly, there were a few on Oahu that the Navy had given the army during the First World War...., so it's possible.

They came from the Connecticut class pre-dreadnought battleships, which were completed 1906-1908, contemporary with HMS Dreadnought. The Connecticuts were armed with 4 12", 8 8", and 12 7" guns.

[Don Bowen]

The desired weaponry of a Marine Defense Battalion was army 155mm CD and 90mm AA guns. But both these types were in short supply, but various Naval weapons were available. For CD guns, there were numbers of old 5in/51, mostly previous installed in casemates on battleships and removed during refits.

So the Marines produced several separate TOEs for Defense Battalions. TOE numbers in the range 133-155 were used for Defense Battalions. I have three, all dated 27 February, 1941. I wish I had them all.


D-155-A:

Eight 155mm CD Guns
Twelve 90mm AA Guns
Twelve 37mm AA Guns
Twelve 20mm AA/AT guns
Sixteen 50Cal AAMG
Thirty 30Cal MG

To the best of my knowledge no Defense Battalion was ever fielded with this armament. By the time 155mm and 90mm guns were available, the 37mm were replaced by 40mm and the numbers of AA weapons rearranged.



D-155-B:
I have never been able to find a TOE under this designation, but I assume it is for a Defense Battalion variation. Based on the TOE of the other variations that I have, this is probably the one in general usage at the end of 1941. If anyone has any additional data, I'd be very happy to see it!



D-155-C:
Eight 155mm CD Guns
Twelve 90mm AA Guns (3inch M3 substitutes if 90mm not available)
Thirty 50Cal AAMG
Thirty 30Cal MG



D-155-D:
Six 7inch/45 CD Guns (substitute 5"/51 is 7" not available)
Twelve 90mm AA Guns (3inch M3 substitutes if 90mm not available)
Sixteen 50Cal AAMG
Thirty 30Cal MG


The ultimate TOE of a Defense Battalion was:
Eight 155mm cD Guns
Sixteen 90mm AA Guns
Sixteen 40mm AA Guns (one source says six but I think this is a typo)
Sixteen 20mm AA Guns
Sixteen 50Cal AA Guns (later in the war, as 4-gun mounts)
Thirty 30Cal MGs (reduced as the war went on and the threat of amphibious assault waned)



The standard MDB at the end of 1941 had:
Six 5"/51 CD Guns
Twelve M3 3" AA Guns
Twenty Four 50Cal AAMG
Thirty 30Cal MG


There is another known TOE:
Six 5"/51 CD Guns
Twelve M3 3" AA Guns
Twenty-Four 50Cal AAMG
Twenty-Four 30Cal MG


At some time prior to this, the numbers of MG were larger:
Six 5"/51 CD Guns
Twelve M3 3" AA Guns
Forty Eight 50Cal AAMG
Forty Eight 30Cal MG


All Defense Battalions were designed to be split or reinforced as required. TOEs existed for reinforceing light infantry companies, slightly enlarged light tank platoons (6 tanks), and additional CD guns (both 6" and 7", along with 5"/51). Each installation could be tailored as need and especially to space and supply constraints.

The six CD guns of an early Defense Battalion, for example, were organized into three firing batteries of two guns each and a minimal HQ Battery of less than a dozen clerks and supply types. The senior Commanding Officer of a firing battery doubled as Coast Defense Battery Commander, the next senior as XO, etc. What would be the HQ Battery staff was mostly split up between the firing batteries. If the CD Battery was concentrated at a single location, like Wake, the HQ battery would be formed from the component parts. If the firing batteries were dispersed (like Johnston and Palmyra) the HQ detachment remained at a rear base (Pearl) and oversaw the deliveries of supplies and replacements.

Note that the term "Battery" is overloaded. The Defense Battalion consisted of a CD Gun Battery, AA Gun Battery, Light AA Battery (AAMG), Beach Defense Battery (30Cal), Searchlight Battery, and HQ Battery. The CD "Battery" was organized like a battalion, with it's component units designated as batteries. Thus the CD Battery included three firing batteries and an HQ Battery.

[Montbrun]

Malarial Zones

The allies made a concerted effort to battle Malaria, assigning special medical units, and even obsolete aircraft to spray pesticides. For example, Guadalcanal became a R&R area later in the war.

IMHO, Allied HQs in a Malarial Zone should reduce the effects of malaria.

[Halsey]

ORIGINAL: Brad Hunter

Malarial Zones

The allies made a concerted effort to battle Malaria, assigning special medical units, and even obsolete aircraft to spray pesticides. For example, Guadalcanal became a R&R area later in the war.

IMHO, Allied HQs in a Malarial Zone should reduce the effects of malaria.

good idea...

[Shark7]

ORIGINAL: Halsey

ORIGINAL: Brad Hunter

Malarial Zones

The allies made a concerted effort to battle Malaria, assigning special medical units, and even obsolete aircraft to spray pesticides. For example, Guadalcanal became a R&R area later in the war.

IMHO, Allied HQs in a Malarial Zone should reduce the effects of malaria.

good idea...

Hmm, I can see it now...the great Japanese crop-duster hunt...shot down the crop-dusters, malaria goes up, allied morale goes down.... [:D]

OK, maybe that is a bit silly.... [8|]

[Nomad]

Then you get Gen. Vandegrift at guadalcanal stating something like 'I am here to kill japs, no mosquitoes.' This was after a breifing on mosquitoes and malaria. [&:]

[witpqs]

Andy,

When you say that in India Japanese units north of a certain line (I think you said near Madras) would trigger reinforcements, did you mean geographically North of that point, or Above that point on the rotated game map projection being used?

[Andy Mac]

Bollocks I always get Delhi and Madras mixed up.
 
The reinforcements will only arrive if a line parralell to 1 hex below Delhi is crossed (or at least thats trhe intent)
 
Broadly we dont want to make it so that no where is vulnerable.
 
Andy

[treespider]

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

Bollocks I always get Delhi and Madras mixed up.

The reinforcements will only arrive if a line parralell to 1 hex below Delhi is crossed (or at least thats trhe intent)

Broadly we dont want to make it so that no where is vulnerable.

Andy

Folks will also have to realize that the India invasion Gambit will be an entirely different kettle of fish for the Japanese in AE simply due to the changes in shipping requirements for such an endeavor....

[Andy Mac]

As Treespider says Normandy style invasions by either side in 42 or 43 are going to be tricky until proper ships are available.
 
Not impossible but not easy either.
 
Andy

[Jim D Burns]

Do the allied replacement levels significantly increase as new equipment items come online later in the war, or are you still stuck with a brigade or so a year for most allied powers? I think either replacement levels should be tweaked way up to a division plus a month to allow rapid changeover of equipment types, or some very large units should arrive and be disbanded after 1 day to add tons of the upgraded equipment to the pools to allow for upgrade speeds that can compete with how fast Japan can upgrade its entire army in about a month.

Even a division worth of equipment a month probably won’t allow the US to upgrade all its forces by game end. So perhaps a mix of larger replacement rates and disbanded units to allow upgrades to be complete within a few months?

Jim