I would like to hear a bit about how the players performed in this scenario with the XXX Corps.
I think I'm quite slow because I didn't reach Valkenswaard until next morning.
How did you perform in "Breakout from Joe's Bridge"
Moderator: Arjuna
RE: How did you perform in "Breakout from Joe's Bridge"
Here's a tip.
Think about moving units using way points and frontage instead of attacking. I think you will find this gets you a bit more progress.
Cheers
Ray
Think about moving units using way points and frontage instead of attacking. I think you will find this gets you a bit more progress.
Cheers
Ray
RE: How did you perform in "Breakout from Joe's Bridge"
I also find that setting XXX Corps movement up the cooridor to 'Minimum Aggro' helps them stay the course to Eindhoven & Valkenswaard.
simovitch
RE: How did you perform in "Breakout from Joe's Bridge"
i Have issue way poits to my force but the best i can do its a draw i reach valkenswaard in the next morning.
RE: How did you perform in "Breakout from Joe's Bridge"
You will know that historically, progress was extremely slow.
RE: How did you perform in "Breakout from Joe's Bridge"
I hope you don't mind me reviving an old thread...
I won Breakout yesterday after a few unsuccesful attempts. I noticed that the quickest way to send these guys up the road is using Move order / Fastest speed / Road Column formation / Quickest route / Min aggro / Rapid fire / Max losses.
Especially "Quickest route" seems important. With "unspecified" your units tend to use "Avoidance" to find a way around the Germans - which ends up with them bogged down in polder or march.
My plan was for the Irish Guards to advance towards Valkenswaard up the main road as quickly as they could, with 2 Dorset and 1 Hampshire giving flank protection to the left and right of the road: 2 Dorset and 1 Hampshire were to assault along the road towards the big forest south of Valkenswaard. Grenadier Guards group was to follow the Irish Guards to the south of the woods, then turn right and advance on Valkenswaard from a different angle. Either the Irish or Grenadier Guards were to push on towards Aalst and Gennep, which one I hadn't decided. I extricated 2 Devon from their positions in the marshes to guard the approach towards Joe's Bridge; later on I planned to position them where needed. As Coldstream Guards and Welsh Guards groups became available they were to move through the Irish / Grenadier Guards groups towards Eindhoven.
Things started out pretty badly for the Irish Guards. After heavy artillery bombardment the FallschirmJaeger Coy in the south forest ran for it, but a Flak battery halted the entire Irish Guards group; they decided to bypass the Flak via an alternative route but became bogged down in swampland. I changed the Grenadiers' orders to "Quickest Route" and they moved quickly up the road, assisted by numerous arty barrages and airstrikes. By nightfall they arrived at the crossroads and turned right, leaving the Irish to battle their way through the forest.
Then the Coldstream guards appeared and I made a major mistake. I ordered its base to advance on Eindhoven instead of the Bde HQ. However, the Base zoomed up the road, overtaking the Irish and only halting in front of the Valkenswaard bridge, having bypassed multiple enemy units! I realised my mistake, gave the entire Coldstream Guards group the same order and watched them take the bridge in conjunction with the Irish. The latter decided it was time for a rest, and Coldstream Guards captured Valkenswaard at daybreak on D2. The Coldstreamers moved on to Aalst but were stopped for a time by a FJ Bn, enabling Welsh Guards to overtake them and arrive in Eindhoven at around 1200 hours on D2. The Coldstreamers followed them into Eindhoven; the Grenadiers - moving quite slowly along a track - took up positions in Valkenswaard, and Irish Guards moved on Aalst and Gennep after waking up from a well-deserved rest.
Meanwhile I moved some artillery up to the 2 Dorsets and 1 Hampshires position at the south of the forest and moved 2 Devon to the north of the forest, blocking the road that enters Valkenswaard from the West. 2 Devon and the Coldstreamers almost managed to cut off a FJ Bn southwest of Valkenswaard, but it retreated just in time. After Coldstream Guards had moved on, 2 Devon blocked what appeared to be a Bn strength FJ Battle group coming in from the west along the road. Another counter-attack materialised west of Eindhoven, but was broken up easily by my newly brought-up artillery.
At the end of the scenario, Welsh Guards group was at the Philips factory, ready for the push on Son, with Coldstream Guards group close behind; the Coldstreamers could have gone further but were delayed at the last moment by KG Walther HQ and Base. I had Grenadier Guards group defending Valkenswaard and Irish Guards group defending Aalst and Gennep. 231 Bde was defending the road back to Joe's bridge, with 2 Dorsets guarding the western approaches to Valkenswaard and the others defending my forward fire base at the south of the big forest, containing about 5 Bns of 25-pounder guns. The score: Allies 100 - Germans 0. I suffered 264 casualties, the Germans close to 1500.
Inspection of the battlefield showed numerous german units on the west flank trying to catch up but failing. On the east flank almost no resistance remained. Technically the road was cut in a few places, but the German road blocks consisted of platoon-strength remnants of FJ units that had only barely survived the battle.
I reflected a bit on the next moves - to be made if the map were larger and the scenario longer. The next stage of the battle would be for 504 PIR to defend Eindhoven, for 1 Hampshires to relieve the Grenadier Guards in Valkenswaard and 2 Devon to move up to the Aalst / Gennep area. This would free the Guards groups to advance on Son, with Coldstream Guards set to reach the blown bridge there way before nightfall, with the Guards' bridging troop not far behind. The Guards div troops could be used to quickly sweep the road up to Eindhoven, arriving at Son with their Bridging troop to start building a new bridge.
In retrospect, I think that the Grenadiers' flanking move did not accomplish much, besides defending the right flank of the advance against a few scattered units. It would be better to keep to the main road next time, I think. I guess the move by 2 Devon to block the western approaches to Valkenswaard was a key move, as it was ideally placed to repel German counter attacks. Also, I think I could have moved 2 Dorset and 1 Hampshire towards Valkenswaard and Aalst before the end of the scenario, thereby enabling Guards Armoured to move north even faster than they did now. But as you don't get any points in this scenario for doing this - although I believe it would be a sensible move from a historical perspective - not doing so didn't cost me anything.
I won Breakout yesterday after a few unsuccesful attempts. I noticed that the quickest way to send these guys up the road is using Move order / Fastest speed / Road Column formation / Quickest route / Min aggro / Rapid fire / Max losses.
Especially "Quickest route" seems important. With "unspecified" your units tend to use "Avoidance" to find a way around the Germans - which ends up with them bogged down in polder or march.
My plan was for the Irish Guards to advance towards Valkenswaard up the main road as quickly as they could, with 2 Dorset and 1 Hampshire giving flank protection to the left and right of the road: 2 Dorset and 1 Hampshire were to assault along the road towards the big forest south of Valkenswaard. Grenadier Guards group was to follow the Irish Guards to the south of the woods, then turn right and advance on Valkenswaard from a different angle. Either the Irish or Grenadier Guards were to push on towards Aalst and Gennep, which one I hadn't decided. I extricated 2 Devon from their positions in the marshes to guard the approach towards Joe's Bridge; later on I planned to position them where needed. As Coldstream Guards and Welsh Guards groups became available they were to move through the Irish / Grenadier Guards groups towards Eindhoven.
Things started out pretty badly for the Irish Guards. After heavy artillery bombardment the FallschirmJaeger Coy in the south forest ran for it, but a Flak battery halted the entire Irish Guards group; they decided to bypass the Flak via an alternative route but became bogged down in swampland. I changed the Grenadiers' orders to "Quickest Route" and they moved quickly up the road, assisted by numerous arty barrages and airstrikes. By nightfall they arrived at the crossroads and turned right, leaving the Irish to battle their way through the forest.
Then the Coldstream guards appeared and I made a major mistake. I ordered its base to advance on Eindhoven instead of the Bde HQ. However, the Base zoomed up the road, overtaking the Irish and only halting in front of the Valkenswaard bridge, having bypassed multiple enemy units! I realised my mistake, gave the entire Coldstream Guards group the same order and watched them take the bridge in conjunction with the Irish. The latter decided it was time for a rest, and Coldstream Guards captured Valkenswaard at daybreak on D2. The Coldstreamers moved on to Aalst but were stopped for a time by a FJ Bn, enabling Welsh Guards to overtake them and arrive in Eindhoven at around 1200 hours on D2. The Coldstreamers followed them into Eindhoven; the Grenadiers - moving quite slowly along a track - took up positions in Valkenswaard, and Irish Guards moved on Aalst and Gennep after waking up from a well-deserved rest.
Meanwhile I moved some artillery up to the 2 Dorsets and 1 Hampshires position at the south of the forest and moved 2 Devon to the north of the forest, blocking the road that enters Valkenswaard from the West. 2 Devon and the Coldstreamers almost managed to cut off a FJ Bn southwest of Valkenswaard, but it retreated just in time. After Coldstream Guards had moved on, 2 Devon blocked what appeared to be a Bn strength FJ Battle group coming in from the west along the road. Another counter-attack materialised west of Eindhoven, but was broken up easily by my newly brought-up artillery.
At the end of the scenario, Welsh Guards group was at the Philips factory, ready for the push on Son, with Coldstream Guards group close behind; the Coldstreamers could have gone further but were delayed at the last moment by KG Walther HQ and Base. I had Grenadier Guards group defending Valkenswaard and Irish Guards group defending Aalst and Gennep. 231 Bde was defending the road back to Joe's bridge, with 2 Dorsets guarding the western approaches to Valkenswaard and the others defending my forward fire base at the south of the big forest, containing about 5 Bns of 25-pounder guns. The score: Allies 100 - Germans 0. I suffered 264 casualties, the Germans close to 1500.
Inspection of the battlefield showed numerous german units on the west flank trying to catch up but failing. On the east flank almost no resistance remained. Technically the road was cut in a few places, but the German road blocks consisted of platoon-strength remnants of FJ units that had only barely survived the battle.
I reflected a bit on the next moves - to be made if the map were larger and the scenario longer. The next stage of the battle would be for 504 PIR to defend Eindhoven, for 1 Hampshires to relieve the Grenadier Guards in Valkenswaard and 2 Devon to move up to the Aalst / Gennep area. This would free the Guards groups to advance on Son, with Coldstream Guards set to reach the blown bridge there way before nightfall, with the Guards' bridging troop not far behind. The Guards div troops could be used to quickly sweep the road up to Eindhoven, arriving at Son with their Bridging troop to start building a new bridge.
In retrospect, I think that the Grenadiers' flanking move did not accomplish much, besides defending the right flank of the advance against a few scattered units. It would be better to keep to the main road next time, I think. I guess the move by 2 Devon to block the western approaches to Valkenswaard was a key move, as it was ideally placed to repel German counter attacks. Also, I think I could have moved 2 Dorset and 1 Hampshire towards Valkenswaard and Aalst before the end of the scenario, thereby enabling Guards Armoured to move north even faster than they did now. But as you don't get any points in this scenario for doing this - although I believe it would be a sensible move from a historical perspective - not doing so didn't cost me anything.
RE: How did you perform in "Breakout from Joe's Bridge"
Nicely done AAR, thanks. I think you found the right combination of route, formation, speed, and agression.
Now how about one for Eindhoven Historical Campaign?
Now how about one for Eindhoven Historical Campaign?
simovitch
RE: How did you perform in "Breakout from Joe's Bridge"
I'm glad you liked my AAR. I've been planning on doing the other historical scenarios but I didn't like the fact that Guards Armoured is not present in the Eindhoven one. It would have been nice if there existed exit victory hexes in HTTR, the idea being that you get points for moving units off the map (e.g., Steel Panthers: the World at War has them). Then it would be possible to add the Guards to the Eindhoven scenario, with the objective being to move them to the northern map edge before a certain time.
RE: How did you perform in "Breakout from Joe's Bridge"
Exit objectives was one of the features we added for COTA.
RE: How did you perform in "Breakout from Joe's Bridge"
ORIGINAL: guyhill
I'm glad you liked my AAR. I've been planning on doing the other historical scenarios but I didn't like the fact that Guards Armoured is not present in the Eindhoven one.
The Guards Armoured are assumed to pass through Hells Highway to Nijmegen. Only the Coldstream and Grenadier Guards re-appear northeast of Uden on D6 as they did historically.
Without exit conditions it was the best compromise, but you wouldn't be able to use them anyway. Einhoven Historical is still one of my favorite HTTR scenarios.
simovitch
RE: How did you perform in "Breakout from Joe's Bridge"
Well BftB will sure bring the chance to remake those historical scenarios from HttR on it and with all the new things made since HttR it will sure be a new experience.
RE: How did you perform in "Breakout from Joe's Bridge"
Yep, that it will...[;)]ORIGINAL: BigDuke66
Well BftB will sure bring the chance to remake those historical scenarios from HttR on it and with all the new things made since HttR it will sure be a new experience.
simovitch