Andy Mac v PZB ....The Allies Fight Back

[Andy Mac]

OK not a lot to say a quiet turn passes the Armoured Corps and 1st Army are en route to PI when they arrive I will allow a couple of days rest to lower fatigue and then its time to load up for Armageddon...
 
No matter what the losses this attack will press on no retreat no surrender on til victory.
 
Although I have one Nuke left I will not be using it to tactically support my attacks as that would be unsportsmanlike.
 
I dont like the broad frontage required for my assault Corps 1 Corps per 60 miles in the 1st echelon (9 Divs in  3 Corps 1 from each assaulting Army) so defacto 1 Div per 20 miles is light coverage.
 
The second echelon when landed will half that to 1 Div per 10 miles  (2nd Corps from each of the assaulting Armies) and then when I identify the main assault point the 3rd echelon goes in (5 further Corps and another Army HQ) it will be 1 Div and an Armoured Regt for every 3 miles of front at the key point.
 
In total 4 Armies of 11 Corps and 35 Divs plus an army reserve of 3 Divs landing abreast .....
 
 
 
 

[Andy Mac]

The embarkation ports for the invasion are Manila, San Marcelino, Bataan, Linguyen, Vigan and Aparri its a lot of troops and ships to load up I will do a full count just before the rest of the troops arrive.
 
 
 

[veji1]

Waow !! Is that the biggest WITP landing part ever ?

[Andy Mac]

In total a MINIMUM of
14 CV's
4 CVL's
19 CVE's
14 Battleships
57 Cruisers
158 Destroyers
142 Destroyer Escorts
56 APD's
24 2k APA's (3 Divs worth of assault lift)
70 4k and 6k AP's (non assault lift for 15 Divs)
320 AK's - 84 of which are AKA's (16 Divs if assault loaded more likely support troops)
32 AO's
51 Auxilliary
90 MSW, DM and DMS's
14 Subchasers
270 LST, LSD and LSV's (assault lift for 9 Divs)
366 LSM, LCI and LCI (G/R/M)'s (assault lift for 2 Divs or a shed load of armour)

Thats over 1,700 ships and its a minimum I could add another 300+ AK's depending on timing......

The APA's and LST's, LSM's and LCI's will take the first 14 Divs.
The small AKA's (4.5k) will take an additional 4 Divs of Infantry and all my Tanks

Total 18 Divs Assault loaded or 6 Corps.

3rd and 4th Echelon will either be loaded on normal AP's or await the LST's in north PI

This is going to be big - very very big.....

[Andy Mac]

Not a lot to say just waiting for fatigue to go from the AmrouredCorps before I begin the loading.
 
1st Aus Army will try to take Madra I have limited confidence in its ability to suceed but its a diversion anyway

[Andy Mac]

Another quiet turn as the preparation continues.

Not a lot to say my forces continue to prepare and recover fatigue and disruption

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 10/20/45

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Air attack on Ishieak , at 52,46

Japanese aircraft
C6N1-S Myrt x 13

No Japanese losses

Aircraft Attacking:
13 x C6N1-S Myrt bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Taichu , at 49,43


Allied aircraft
P-38J Lightning x 7
F-5C Lightning x 3
A-26B Invader x 29


No Allied losses

Japanese ground losses:
66 casualties reported

Airbase hits 4
Runway hits 44

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x A-26B Invader bombing at 6000 feet
5 x A-26B Invader bombing at 6000 feet
6 x A-26B Invader bombing at 6000 feet
3 x A-26B Invader bombing at 6000 feet
3 x A-26B Invader bombing at 6000 feet
3 x A-26B Invader bombing at 6000 feet
3 x A-26B Invader bombing at 6000 feet
3 x A-26B Invader bombing at 6000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Takao , at 48,45


Allied aircraft
PB4Y Liberator x 3


Allied aircraft losses
PB4Y Liberator: 3 damaged

Airbase hits 2
Runway hits 5

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x PB4Y Liberator bombing at 6000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Madras , at 18,21


Allied aircraft
TBM Avenger x 7
Thunderbolt II x 9
Beaufighter VIF x 18
P-38J Lightning x 3


Allied aircraft losses
TBM Avenger: 4 damaged

Airbase hits 4
Runway hits 18

Aircraft Attacking:
10 x Beaufighter VIF bombing at 2000 feet
6 x Beaufighter VIF bombing at 2000 feet
7 x TBM Avenger bombing at 5000 feet
2 x Beaufighter VIF bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Madras , at 18,21


Allied aircraft
SB2C Helldiver x 37
Liberator VI x 29


Allied aircraft losses
SB2C Helldiver: 1 damaged
Liberator VI: 1 destroyed, 1 damaged

Japanese ground losses:
45 casualties reported
Guns lost 2

Airbase hits 10
Runway hits 57

Aircraft Attacking:
11 x Liberator VI bombing at 6000 feet
3 x Liberator VI bombing at 6000 feet
2 x Liberator VI bombing at 6000 feet
34 x SB2C Helldiver bombing at 2000 feet
3 x Liberator VI bombing at 6000 feet
3 x Liberator VI bombing at 6000 feet
3 x Liberator VI bombing at 6000 feet
3 x SB2C Helldiver bombing at 2000 feet
3 x Liberator VI bombing at 6000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Krung Thep , at 29,39


Allied aircraft
Beaufighter Mk 21 x 6


Allied aircraft losses
Beaufighter Mk 21: 1 damaged

Airbase hits 1
Runway hits 4

Aircraft Attacking:
6 x Beaufighter Mk 21 bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Krung Thep , at 29,39


Allied aircraft
Beaufighter Mk 21 x 13


Allied aircraft losses
Beaufighter Mk 21: 1 damaged

Airbase hits 2
Runway hits 4

Aircraft Attacking:
7 x Beaufighter Mk 21 bombing at 2000 feet
6 x Beaufighter Mk 21 bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Amboina , at 39,73


Allied aircraft
PB4Y Liberator x 7


Allied aircraft losses
PB4Y Liberator: 1 damaged

Japanese ground losses:
11 casualties reported

Airbase hits 2
Runway hits 2

Aircraft Attacking:
4 x PB4Y Liberator bombing at 17000 feet
3 x PB4Y Liberator bombing at 17000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Cagayan , at 42,59


Allied aircraft
B-24J Liberator x 6


No Allied losses

Japanese ground losses:
11 casualties reported

Airbase hits 2
Airbase supply hits 2
Runway hits 13

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x B-24J Liberator bombing at 6000 feet
3 x B-24J Liberator bombing at 6000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Naga , at 44,54


Allied aircraft
F6F Hellcat x 6
F4U-1D Corsair x 7
F6F-5N Hellcat x 7


No Allied losses

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Jolo , at 38,59


Allied aircraft
PB4Y Liberator x 3
B-24J Liberator x 11


Allied aircraft losses
B-24J Liberator: 1 damaged

Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 17

Aircraft Attacking:
8 x B-24J Liberator bombing at 6000 feet
3 x PB4Y Liberator bombing at 6000 feet
3 x B-24J Liberator bombing at 6000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on 188th USA Glider Regiment, at 18,19

Japanese aircraft
Ki-51 Sonia x 10

No Japanese losses

Aircraft Attacking:
10 x Ki-51 Sonia bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on 188th USA Glider Regiment, at 18,19

Japanese aircraft
G4M2 Betty x 20

Japanese aircraft losses
G4M2 Betty: 2 damaged


Allied ground losses:
31 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

Aircraft Attacking:
20 x G4M2 Betty bombing at 1000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on 48th/C Division, at 21,19


Allied aircraft
F4U-1D Corsair x 10
P-38J Lightning x 3


No Allied losses

Aircraft Attacking:
10 x F4U-1D Corsair bombing at 2000 feet

[Andy Mac]

A little action out west in India I am moving into Madras to take the city not much to say really my behind the lines troops have achieved quite a lot.

PZB has been fairly relaxed and has not attacked them before which is a bit weird

I ended up using paratroopers as normal infantry because at this stage against lvl 9 forts para dropping them is a waste.

I have 3 1/2 Bdes of Paratroopers at Madras and about half a Bde of the 188th Glider Regt at Bangalore with the small detachment of 4th USMC Bn that PZB has cleared out of the way below.

I have also using the same trick ordered an Australian Tk Bn to go cross country to block off the northern approach to Madras

I estimate 3 - 500AV x 4 x 4 = 4800 to 8000 defensive AV but I will have air superiority and Colorado to provide some 16" support it should be a winnable battle as long as I can stop reinforcements arriving.

Andy


AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 10/21/45

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Air attack on Ishieak , at 52,46

Japanese aircraft
J1N1-S Irving x 6
C6N1-S Myrt x 44

No Japanese losses

Aircraft Attacking:
6 x J1N1-S Irving bombing at 2000 feet
11 x C6N1-S Myrt bombing at 2000 feet
9 x C6N1-S Myrt bombing at 2000 feet
12 x C6N1-S Myrt bombing at 2000 feet
6 x C6N1-S Myrt bombing at 2000 feet
6 x C6N1-S Myrt bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Takao , at 48,45


Allied aircraft
PB4Y Liberator x 3


Allied aircraft losses
PB4Y Liberator: 3 damaged

Japanese ground losses:
13 casualties reported

Airbase hits 2
Runway hits 4

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x PB4Y Liberator bombing at 6000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Kweiyang , at 41,35

Japanese aircraft
D4Y Judy x 15
A6M5c Zeke x 27

No Japanese losses

Airbase hits 1
Runway hits 16

Aircraft Attacking:
24 x A6M5c Zeke bombing at 2000 feet
13 x D4Y Judy bombing at 2000 feet
2 x D4Y Judy bombing at 2000 feet
3 x A6M5c Zeke bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Kweiyang , at 41,35

Japanese aircraft
D4Y Judy x 17
B7A Grace x 8

No Japanese losses

Airbase hits 1
Runway hits 14

Aircraft Attacking:
8 x B7A Grace bombing at 9000 feet
15 x D4Y Judy bombing at 2000 feet
2 x D4Y Judy bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Madras , at 18,21


Allied aircraft
TBM Avenger x 7
Beaufighter VIF x 19
P-38J Lightning x 4


Allied aircraft losses
TBM Avenger: 1 damaged

Japanese ground losses:
26 casualties reported

Airbase hits 5
Airbase supply hits 3
Runway hits 25

Aircraft Attacking:
10 x Beaufighter VIF bombing at 2000 feet
7 x Beaufighter VIF bombing at 2000 feet
7 x TBM Avenger bombing at 5000 feet
2 x Beaufighter VIF bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Madras , at 18,21


Allied aircraft
SB2C Helldiver x 37
Liberator VI x 32


Allied aircraft losses
SB2C Helldiver: 1 destroyed, 3 damaged
Liberator VI: 1 damaged

Airbase hits 14
Runway hits 66

Aircraft Attacking:
6 x Liberator VI bombing at 6000 feet
3 x Liberator VI bombing at 6000 feet
4 x Liberator VI bombing at 6000 feet
33 x SB2C Helldiver bombing at 2000 feet
3 x Liberator VI bombing at 6000 feet
5 x Liberator VI bombing at 6000 feet
5 x Liberator VI bombing at 6000 feet
3 x SB2C Helldiver bombing at 2000 feet
2 x Liberator VI bombing at 6000 feet
2 x Liberator VI bombing at 6000 feet
2 x Liberator VI bombing at 6000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Amboina , at 39,73


Allied aircraft
PB4Y Liberator x 8


Allied aircraft losses
PB4Y Liberator: 1 damaged

Runway hits 11

Aircraft Attacking:
5 x PB4Y Liberator bombing at 17000 feet
3 x PB4Y Liberator bombing at 17000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Cagayan , at 42,59


Allied aircraft
B-24J Liberator x 6


Allied aircraft losses
B-24J Liberator: 1 damaged

Runway hits 11

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x B-24J Liberator bombing at 6000 feet
3 x B-24J Liberator bombing at 6000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Legaspi , at 44,55


Allied aircraft
F6F Hellcat x 6
F4U-1D Corsair x 2
F6F-5N Hellcat x 8


No Allied losses

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Jolo , at 38,59


Allied aircraft
PB4Y Liberator x 5
B-24J Liberator x 15


No Allied losses

Japanese ground losses:
13 casualties reported

Airbase hits 3
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 23

Aircraft Attacking:
9 x B-24J Liberator bombing at 6000 feet
3 x PB4Y Liberator bombing at 6000 feet
2 x PB4Y Liberator bombing at 6000 feet
3 x B-24J Liberator bombing at 6000 feet
3 x B-24J Liberator bombing at 6000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on 133rd IJNAF Base Force, at 18,21


Allied aircraft
Thunderbolt II x 8
Liberator VI x 18
Mosquito FB.VI x 34
A-26B Invader x 3


Allied aircraft losses
Mosquito FB.VI: 1 damaged

Japanese ground losses:
52 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x Liberator VI bombing at 16000 feet
10 x Mosquito FB.VI bombing at 2000 feet
14 x Mosquito FB.VI bombing at 2000 feet
7 x Liberator VI bombing at 16000 feet
10 x Mosquito FB.VI bombing at 2000 feet
8 x Liberator VI bombing at 16000 feet
3 x A-26B Invader bombing at 16000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on 133rd IJNAF Base Force, at 18,21


Allied aircraft
Beaufighter VIC x 14
Mosquito FB.VI x 14


No Allied losses

Japanese ground losses:
35 casualties reported

Aircraft Attacking:
14 x Beaufighter VIC bombing at 2000 feet
14 x Mosquito FB.VI bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on 188th USA Glider Regiment, at 18,19

Japanese aircraft
Ki-51 Sonia x 12

No Japanese losses


Allied ground losses:
6 casualties reported

Aircraft Attacking:
12 x Ki-51 Sonia bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Taichu , at 49,43


Allied aircraft
F-6D Mustang x 1


No Allied losses


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at 19,19

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 5346 troops, 65 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 111

Defending force 70 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 8

Japanese max assault: 108 - adjusted assault: 108

Allied max defense: 6 - adjusted defense: 1

Japanese assault odds: 108 to 1


Japanese ground losses:
11 casualties reported

Allied ground losses:
21 casualties reported


Defeated Allied Units Retreating!

[Andy Mac]

I have about 2,000 AV in India so it should be a good fight but If Madras falls then that is two of the key Indian objectives back in allied hands.
 
Karachi/Bombay will never fall but perhaps Calcutta/Delhi could also beretaken.
 
This is a side show so I dont get to excited
 
In Luzon forces move to the embarkation ports I estimate 2 weeks before loading begins maybe less
 
Green is loading at San Marcelino -8th US Army (2 Corps 2,500 AV)
Red is loading at Bataan - 6th US Army (2 Corps 2,500 AV)
Blue is loading at manila - 10th US Army (2 Corps 2,500 AV)
White is also loading at manila - 1st US Army (5 Corps and the Army Reserve - 7,500 AV)
 
Green hits Nagasaki
Red hits Kitkyami
Blue hits Sasebo
 
White hits either Nagasaki or Sasebo whichever is weakest (it preps 50:50)
 
Now assuming 1,000 AV  per base that means forest x 3, forts x 4 = 12,000 defensive AV so it will be close and it will not be a quick battle....
 
But if I land on just two bases I save 2,500 AV but I am forces to take Nagasaki which I dont want to do I want the choice.
Andy
Andy
 
 

[Andy Mac]

I am a little worried about Mines I only have 70 MSW's at Manila and about 15 DMS's
 
I have to expect most MSW's to go down in the first wave and I will have at least 12 Invasion troop carrying TF's to cover plus 3 Supply at least so 15 TF's plus supporting ASW and surface TF's
 
Also only 13 operational BB's and 21 8" or better cruisers
 
I may pressgang North Carolina into this fight she is 50 sys damage but can make 14 knots and has all her main guns so that would add another BB
 
Maryland and Richelieu can only make 8 knots which is to slow assuming I bring back Colorado after the fight ends at Madras that would lift it up to 17 Battleshps of which 4 are shore bombardment only the three cripples and Arkansas.
 
I am also concerned about my shortage of Destroyers I onlyt have 300 DD and DE's the Kamikaze threat is going to be nasty so allocating appropriate AA defence to each TF is paramount.
 
I have potentially 16 Fleet Carriers If I pull the 3 cripples out of yard hands 20 sys each and transfer Wasp back
 
So 8 Carrier TF's each needing a powerfull screen at least 8 modern DD's and 2 - 3 Cruisers or a BB and 2 Cruisers so 1/2 of my modern DD's are acting as screening units for the carriers. Assuming 4 Bombardment/SC Groups each of 3 BB's with the rest in invasion TF's that takes another 18 Destroyers
 
Then my Escort Carriers will need a couple of Modern DD's to spearhead the DE's
 
I am going to come up short of Destroyers and Cruisers before I am done.
 
I need to cover 4 seperate hexes each of the Invasion Hexes and the off shore marshalling point.
 
I am allowed 4 USN Fleet Carriers per hex so that at least works I fear my losses in this attack are going to be painfull !!!
 
 

[Andy Mac]

In total I have 52 Cruisers at Manila now beofre I start messing about with TF's
 
If I pull in other units that are in yard hands I can add another 13 Cruisers (only 3 CA's) all of which can make 16 knots or better and are sub 50 sys.
 
I estimate I can add another 20 DD's to my roster by closing down everything e.g. HMAS Bataan is en route
 
If I strip the convoy routes of DE's maybe I can add another 40 DE's but they will arrive piecemeal....
 
This is going to be fun orders have been issued 1 escort per convoy everything else sail for Manila and the sound of the guns...............
 
 

[Andy Mac]

Just been talking with PZB about a few issues and wanted to share my thoughts with the forum.
 
I face 2 risks at present that I am balancing off.
 
1. Tactical Risk i.e. how hard is it to take a base and get an AF and how can I exploit from there.
2. Logistics Risks i.e. I dont get any more ships and my pilot pools are empty and I have limited aircraft replacements and I dont get more LCU's.
 
I have enough for one big battle but I will NEVER be as strong as I am now every ship that is sank does not get replaced every pilot I lose is lost for good.
 
This is it.
 
What this means is that the tactically sound move of taking Formosa and possibly Okinawa/Apanamani while being the right thing to do under 1. is the wrong thing to do under 2. because I will take the losses anyway so I may as well take them going deep.
 
i.e. The driver for a deep strike now is logistics and the fact that I dont get Midways, the BPF will never appear, 1st US Army formations and Tiger force will never appear.
 
Had the reinforcemts continued to flow I would probably have given more weight to the tactical but they dont what I have now is all I am ever going to have.
 
Therefore its use it or lose it time.
 
I dont want to go into the cauldron that is sure to surround me at my chosen invasion location I am going to lose a lot of ships doing it BUT I do believe it is the right decision given where we are now.
 
So game on time for Operation Olympic !!!!
 
Andy

[Andy Mac]

p.s. D DAy is set for 21st November 1945.......

[Hortlund]

Man, this will be really interesting!

[duckenf]

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

i.e. The driver for a deep strike now is logistics and the fact that I dont get Midways, the BPF will never appear, 1st US Army formations and Tiger force will never appear.

Why is this the case?

I know you've committed to Japan, but there seem a lot of objectives in India that are worth a lot of points. Ithink it is reasonable to think that he would have difficulty making reinforcements over the distance of India, less so over the Home Islands. You could conceivably have gotten all of India and Burma back and some inroads into China if you had gone that way -- and you'd have killed a lot of his troops.

[Andy Mac]

[:D][:D][:D]
 
I could have but how could I get this far and not try to take Japan.....
 
In terms of game and getting the draw you are correct that would be better points wise but cest la vie I would rather go down swinging than earn a draw by ignoring the reality of the war.....
 
Its just not in me to pass this by - I will go in with everytrhing I have no reserves nada its all or nothing.
 
If it floats and can fight its going in !!!!
 
However it turns out it should be a lot of fun

[Andy Mac]

p.s. China like Manchuria is a truce so while I would have flet ok taking say HK anything more would have been iffy...
 
Also I only have 17,000 AV on the whole map and 15,000 of it is going in at the HI.
 
I have a few more units that I have paid PP's for out of China which are defensively covering SEA but I would not dream of attacking with them.
 
Andy

[Andy Mac]

Remember guys no more than 4 fleet carriers per hex is what I agreed to to limit UBERCAP so this will be painfull.....

[Andy Mac]

Another turn passes not a lot to say my forces are closing on Madras I will attack in two days and see where I stand

[Andy Mac]

India its the only active theatre at present

[Andy Mac]

ps they are at 55 miles so they should cut the rail link tomorrow