westfront:the liberation of europe of SSI games

[Georgy Zhukov]

westfront full game download free in this link:
http://www.juegoviejo.com/pc/w/Western% ... -45_1.html.
is very good game same war in russia but of the west front.

[Uffz.Exner]

Anybody interrested in a match Westfront1944?

[DavidFaust]

I think the game is unplayable with the large amount of bugs it has.

[Tom1939]

Yes, I agree it is unplayable. But how nice would it be to play in the west as well in the east. Ok, ok I stop dreaming.

[Rasputitsa]

I agree WF ver. 1.0 has many bugs and gameplay issues. See thread 'WIR fan site', I am waiting for dave_wolf to to come back on his WIR site, to see if he will host files that will improve the game. These files do not solve all the problems and each one of you will have to decide if the editor allows you to adjust the game to make it playable. I can get by with it, but then I could live with all the bugs in early versions of WIR. I need some advice on how to get these files into a state to download. [&:]

[hgilmer]

I had West Front and I played it and I had no issues with it right out of the box. What were the bugs? (Well, I should say I don't remember any bugs. It's been a few years, y'know.)

Edit: I read some of the other thread "WIR fan site", and I remember some of those issues. Most of the issues I had were on the German side and yes, I remember you couldn't hardly do anything with all the restrictions and such on the German side.

[Rasputitsa]

For me the biggest problems with WF were, firstly, the graphics, which were more primitive than WIR and the unit icons seemed to merge into the map (e.g. green US units on a green forest hex ). I have edited unit icons and map tiles to give a WIR look, which is much easier on the eye and more familiar Grigsby fans. Secondly, to simulate the political control over forces, 'political points' have to be amasssed, before some actions can be plotted. For the German player this represents the lack of flexibility they suffered. This accurately represents the historical situation, but if retained, dooms you to suffer the same historical defeat. An WF editor is available so that 'political points' can be changed, you can either award so many that they no longer have a restrictive affect, or experiment to get a compromise (the goldilocks effect - just right to your taste). The same thing affects the Allies, such as in the use of strategic air power on the battlefield, but the restriction is not so severe, as the Allies have so much of everthing. This package is still Western Front ver. 1.0, but with more flexibility. I need some help to get the files on a site where they can be downloaded, not having experience of doing this before. [:)]

[Mad Onion]

I can host it. Just send it on madonion1@interia.pl and tommorow it will be available.

[Mad Onion]

Ok I have some files from Rasputitsa on my server and here they are:
www.ambernet.com.pl/download/xzx.rar
Enjoy!

[Rasputitsa]

The files posted by mad onion' on my behalf are to update the graphics for Western Front, the remaining files for editing the game and revising the OOB for the D-Day scenario should follow later. [:)]

[Georgy Zhukov]

when a new version of west front 3.3 rasputitsa? or when a new game of the west and east front uniteds in one game [:)] is possible this? or when a new game for gary gripsby con new engine of these great games? i like this,thanks.

[Rasputitsa]

There is no 'new' version of Western Front, only the original ver 1.0, which is now freely available at sites such as 'Underdogs'. War in Russia progressed to ver 3.3 with the programming work of Arnaud Bouis and the others you can see on the credit screen when you startup WIR. Graphics changes came from some of the people on this Forum. This process didn't happen for WF, there is no updated programming, all I have done is collected what I could find on the Web, produced by other groups. There is a WF editor (like the one for WIR), Order of Battle file to correct the D-Day Overlord scenario and I have updated the graphics to make WF look similar to the current WIR. I don't think anyone will consider reprogramming WF, which is in outdated computer code and took years to get WIR to ver 3.3. Gary Grigsby is working on a new Eastern Front game, but I fear that it will not be like WIR. His present games are very large and take forever to play. WIR and what we can salvage from WF probably will never be repeated. I have been looking for somewhere to host the WF files I have. They have been sent to 'Mad Onion' (his link in this thread has only some of the files), also 'Flanker Leader' who hosts files and I am waiting for 'Dave Wolf' to came back online, to place them on his WIR resource site. [:)]

[Georgy Zhukov]

gary grigsby working in a new game of east from are great news,but not be like WIR are bad news[&:].
i like a new war in russia with better grafics or a game with the two fronts,the east and west from.
for my war in russia and west front are very good games,excellent sistem battle,detail order of battle and realistic order of battle (divisions,brigades,regiments,batallions etc) with historical units names.
i want a new war in russia.
thanks for you information,rasputitsa,i like a new version west front same war in russia.

[DeadInThrench]

ORIGINAL: Rasputitsa

I don't think anyone will consider reprogramming WF, which is in outdated computer code and took years to get WIR to ver 3.3.

Hmmmm..... I am not sure about this but I believe that there is a bigger issue with WF than the code.

As I understand it.... Grigsby originally did a game called WiR. Then... he started working with SSI and put out the same game, upgraded, and it was called 'Second Front'. Then, he took essentially the same system and put Western Front together for SSI.

Then, as I understand it, he got the rights back from SSI for WiR... or something like that... and put out WiR as it exists now (albeit the Matrix Edition of the same).

But, I don't think he ever got the rights back for WF... and that means UbiSoft (or whomever) who got the rights to all SSI games (also including Norm Koger's Age of Rifles)... as I understand it... owns the code and... they are just sitting on all these old titles.

So, I don't see these games ever being updated because of this. Otherwise, Matrix could work out an agreement with anyone interested in doing an update for free (I could handle that... if I had the time), and these games would probably all get upgraded.

DiT

[DeadInThrench]

ORIGINAL: Rasputitsa

Gary Grigsby is working on a new Eastern Front game, but I fear that it will not be like WIR. His present games are very large and take forever to play. WIR and what we can salvage from WF probably will never be repeated.

Hmmm... yeah... tell me about it <g>.

Someone stopped by here from 2x3 some time ago and.... stated quite specifically that they were about to start work on a new eastern front game... and it would NOT be a replacement for WiR.

So, relative to the possibilities.... my best guess is that it will be a regimental level game with the divisional support units included in HQs (to avoid the 'ants' problems that exist in TOAW)... and handled much like similar units are in WiR.

I guess it is possible they will do a divisional level game but, that is kinda close to the level of WiR now. Also, it is at least conceivable of a batallion level game (can you imagine Barbarosa at the batallion level?? The monster game to end all monster games!), but I would not expect that.

So, probably regimental level and probably various smaller scenarios than the campaign games.... Smolensk '41/PanzerGruppe Guderian... type deals but.... even something like Case Blue.... would end up as a monster game... if done at the regimental level.

I have always found Grigsby games the best to my liking but.... yeah, with WiTP and apparently here.... going to the monster variety.... and so... well, if they go off in a different direction than the past.... well... whatever... I don't have the time myself for the monster games.

DiT

P.S. Hmmmm... maybe they WILL do it at the batallion level <g>.

[Rasputitsa]

I first played WIR on my Atari 8bit computer (in the UK it cost the equivalent of $150 back then), with graphics so basic that I had to make my own paper map and used units from the 3rd Reich board game to see what was going on. I thought that when PC became available, Gary Grigsby with SSI, brought out Second Front and Western Front, then re-issued an improved Second Front, renamed as WIR (this is why the WIR map file is MAP.SF). Western Front was never developed, but WIR went to ver 2.??, before they were all effectively abandoned. WIR then got a second life when it was worked up through ver.3.0, to the present ver. 3.3, over many years of hard work by many contributors, witnessed on this forum. Finally Matrix took it up and it lives as a free download. I don't know what the copyright status of SF and WF is, but they are effectively 'abandonware', available as a free download from sites such as 'Underdogs'.

Seeing how difficult it was to get WIR up to ver 3.3, I can't see anyone with the required knowledge spending that amount of effort on WF. What we have is work done some years ago and found on the Net. I have a WF editor with 'readme' instructions (useful to adjust playability), revised OOB to correct unit names and availability in the D-Day scenario. Additionally, I did spend some time in updating the WF unit icons and map tiles to produce a WIR look for WF, but I do not have the skills, or time, to do much more. I also would like to see a France 1940 variant and as Flanker Leader has adapted AFV, aircraft Icons and made changes to unit capabilities for WIR, he may have a better idea of what could be done for a WF1940. I would like to place what I have on any site able to host and see if any more can be done. [:)]

[DeadInThrench]

Hmmm.... I was out of strategy wargames after Second Front and Western Front were released and, checking things, yes you are correct re the original WiR being put out by SSI.

Still..... as I understand it UbiSoft (or somebody) eventually got the rights to all SSI games and that is why nothing can be done with them. For some unknown reason, apparently WiR was an exception to this.... not sure why.

DiT

[Rasputitsa]

People have been and are doing adaptions to, mainly WIR (that's how it got to ver 3.3), but also WF. I seem to remember these games were effectively turned over for general use and a statement being made that the editor program was being released to make it possible for community use (like handing over the car to the kids and giving them the keys [;)]).

The main thing is, that apart from adaptions possible with the graphics and game adjustments through the editor , I can't see anybody being prepared to develop the main code of the game. The limitation (and it's a BIG one) is finding people able and prepared to do it. All I wanted to do was improve the graphics, which I have done and to use what little is already available to make WF a more playable game. I am happy with that, knowing that, realistically, that is all that is possible. [:)]

[DeadInThrench]

If I could get my hands on the source code.... and it is in C.... I would have no problem making minor changes for those still interested in playing WF. If it is instead in Pascal or Basic.... probably couldn't do it (well, Pascal MAYBE).

Would not be interested in a big rewrite though.

DiT

P.S. Actually, I have converted various programs from DOS to XP level..... could do that but, why bother unless there is someone that can redo the artwork... because that is the main thing.