Bradford Kay on cadres:
I do not recommend this use of PP.
In PBEM be sure that the house rules are well understood. Pulling one sub's worth of troops out to begin a "seedling" unit is certainly gamey. (Likewise taking ungarrisoned bases with one sub's worth of troops and a typical House Rule no-no.) Bypassed garrisons in the DEI that are wasting away, baseforces in the Philippines once the aircraft have been destroyed or withdrawn, isolated units with no supply lines, etc. I think can be rationalized as an emergency evacuation, especially if the Allied player is dedicating multiple subs and multiple runs until the only things left behind are vehicles and sound detectors. Enemy action can always interrupt the evacuation so only a fraction of the troops escape.
Ah, yes, a beautiful city. That was my next stop after Bourg d'Oisons. I'm sure that you can guess why I came in via that route... You're quite lucky to be living there.
Unfortunately I had someone try to steal my camera from my hotel room in Grenoble (I had it on a table by a window that he was reaching through but I woke up and scared him off). That will be forever linked in my mind with Grenoble, but I realize that could have happened anywhere that I was so stupid as to leave my handlebar bag (with camera, passport, wallet, etc) near an open window.
Well, it sound like you were in "Tour de France" . Were you part of a support team, or a rider ?
Maybe i'm just talking to a champion ??????[&o]
And sorry for the robbery-try . I know French have LOTS of defaults, but i apologize for every that has cause you troubles...
First:
Evacuate the PI planes and the armour units. If you load the Armour units on turn two, and devide the transport TFs, most of them will make it through to Darwin.
then:
Evacuate the rest of the PI units
then:
Evacuate the DEI units - BUT don't forget that the first unit you evacuate is the Buffola unit that has "upgrade to Hurricane". If this unit gets destroyed (what happened to me in a PBEM), you won't be able to upgrade your DEI fighters unitl the Kittyhawk III appears (in CHS).
then:
transfer West Coast Units to other command structures...
Ahem.
Everybody seems to forget : i've just beginnned a week ago !!
Of course the advices are good, and knowing a big part on history, types of planes, and so on, help to understand; but i can't pretend i "ride" the game-engine. And so a part of the advice i've received on this forum are a bit "dark" for me...i must try to play a bit, before "getting it".
But once more, thanks for everyone who gave me ideas (so i can realize mine where not at all in the way the veterans gave me)...
Bradford Kay on cadres:
I do not recommend this use of PP.
In PBEM be sure that the house rules are well understood. Pulling one sub's worth of troops out to begin a "seedling" unit is certainly gamey. (Likewise taking ungarrisoned bases with one sub's worth of troops and a typical House Rule no-no.) Bypassed garrisons in the DEI that are wasting away, baseforces in the Philippines once the aircraft have been destroyed or withdrawn, isolated units with no supply lines, etc. I think can be rationalized as an emergency evacuation, especially if the Allied player is dedicating multiple subs and multiple runs until the only things left behind are vehicles and sound detectors. Enemy action can always interrupt the evacuation so only a fraction of the troops escape.
I'me playing versus AI, not PBEM, but this is exactly what is happening: i try to evacuate some base, some troops, some fuel...but as soon as betty are in the sky, it's hell !!
i've already lost many AK and a few TK to try to get out troops and supplies....it hurt much.
And now there's a CV TF in Java Sea...i think reason would be to "Brave Sir Robin", but i got a CA, 4 CL and 7 DD , and as historicaly in ABDACOM, i'd like to try something......
First:
Evacuate the PI planes and the armour units. If you load the Armour units on turn two, and devide the transport TFs, most of them will make it through to Darwin.
then:
Evacuate the rest of the PI units
then:
Evacuate the DEI units - BUT don't forget that the first unit you evacuate is the Buffola unit that has "upgrade to Hurricane". If this unit gets destroyed (what happened to me in a PBEM), you won't be able to upgrade your DEI fighters unitl the Kittyhawk III appears (in CHS).
then:
transfer West Coast Units to other command structures...
Ahem.
Everybody seems to forget : i've just beginnned a week ago !!
Of course the advices are good, and knowing a big part on history, types of planes, and so on, help to understand; but i can't pretend i "ride" the game-engine. And so a part of the advice i've received on this forum are a bit "dark" for me...i must try to play a bit, before "getting it".
But once more, thanks for everyone who gave me ideas (so i can realize mine where not at all in the way the veterans gave me)...
What is "dark" for you?
PI = Pillipine Islands
DEI = Dutch East India
Without any doubt: I am the spawn of evil - and the Bavarian Beer Monster (BBM)!
There's only one bad word and that's taxes. If any other word is good enough for sailors; it's good enough for you. - Ron Swanson
First:
Evacuate the PI planes and the armour units. If you load the Armour units on turn two, and devide the transport TFs, most of them will make it through to Darwin.
then:
Evacuate the rest of the PI units
then:
Evacuate the DEI units - BUT don't forget that the first unit you evacuate is the Buffola unit that has "upgrade to Hurricane". If this unit gets destroyed (what happened to me in a PBEM), you won't be able to upgrade your DEI fighters unitl the Kittyhawk III appears (in CHS).
then:
transfer West Coast Units to other command structures...
Ahem.
Everybody seems to forget : i've just beginnned a week ago !!
Of course the advices are good, and knowing a big part on history, types of planes, and so on, help to understand; but i can't pretend i "ride" the game-engine. And so a part of the advice i've received on this forum are a bit "dark" for me...i must try to play a bit, before "getting it".
But once more, thanks for everyone who gave me ideas (so i can realize mine where not at all in the way the veterans gave me)...
What is "dark" for you?
PI = Pillipine Islands
DEI = Dutch East India
Well, theses one i understand, but expression like "iirc" or things like that, i don't. But when i say "dark" for me, i was talking about the game system [;)]
I made a successful stand in Java vs AI in the v.1.804 stock WITP. I pulled as many LCUs to Rangoon as JA land advance allowed me, denuded rest of India to ports, shipping them to Rangoon to make the stand on the river line and city to the south of it. Rest of LCU in Malaya delayed, but were then too weak to hold Singapore very long. But holding Rangoon is a key for later, but must have air support. I kept all UK/CW air at Singapore in naval attack/escort mode until the air base damage became too bad, then withdrew LB and F to Rangoon, but took Swordfish, some Hudsons south to add to DEI air. All P.I. air withdrew to DEI, exc for a sqdrn of F left in Bataan for sacrifice defense/attrition. Exc for B17s [sent to Darwin with pol points], I conc all Allied/DEI air at Palembang, Batavia and Soerbaja, with some forward RC and LB in Borneo as long as no land attk threatened. The objective in all this is attrition of IJN transports, which are not well escorted at this stage of game. Keeping the LB in naval will increase experience fairly quickly from their initially abysmal performance, helped by the torpedo bombers (UK and Dutch), which can kill. Base units must be also concentrated to make this happen and I concentrate the LCU in the same ports, fortifying and mining with SS and the few ML [these have to pull out soon]. All warships have to leave Singapore southward and make for Batavia/Soerabaja, join ABDA Fleet and then evade initial IJN air and surface attacks, waiting for IJN/JA to commit transports to attack a vital port [again only defending Java and So Sumatra for keeps]. The PT boats [US and Dutch] are also held close for action, such as at Batavia or Palembang. I made no effort to save any Allied LCUs from the P.I.
I suspect I was just lucky, but NEI air sank Ryujo and beat up a CA in the Java Sea; The Betties from Tainan did not come south because I piled every Chinese corps [AI is timid in China] I could spare into Canton and swept all JA out of SW China, even beseiged Hanoi [forces initially from SW China, then 5 corps from Yenan - 4 more corps to Rangoon front], and AI kept the air in Formosa to hit them. The Chinese LCU gain much experuience just doing bombardments and resisting JA assaults; works if you bring enough corps together and later, with their 99 experience, they form a death star LCU.
[font="times new roman"]By 18Mar42, Singapore and Manila-Bataan fell, but Java-Sumatra remained in allied hands, with a weak JA force ashore at Palembang and one town lost in Sumatra. AI must be really confused. The PoW SAG savaged a convoy to Palembang and the Dutch/CW air operating out of Java did great attrition on IJN convoys, largely unescorted or weakly escorted. Most of Borneo was lost and two towns in Celebes, but Makassar still held against a weakened IJN naval inf unit. Amboina was lost but Timor remained in Allied hands, about to be reinforced with air base units, the most critical shortage in all the game. I think my later successes in Rangoon-Burma and successful defense of Rabaul upset AI reinf of NEI after they took the losses, and exc for a weal landing at Koepang, nothing else was lost. This made for a huge difference in JA resources, because eventually the Java air bases dominated JA resource bases in Borneo/Celebes, with good attrition of IJN AK/AP and forays by KB did nothign to redress as I made the attacked base inactive and no accompanying phib assault came exc a weak one at Kopaeng. [/font]
[font="times new roman"][/font]
[font="times new roman"]I doubt this works in PBEM, but it is a modified Sir Robin leading to conc in Java and So Sumatra.[/font]
Well, theses one i understand, but expression like "iirc" or things like that, i don't. But when i say "dark" for me, i was talking about the game system [;)]
IIRC is an abreviation for "If I recall correctly". (It means "I think I am correct, but I am not sure.")
IMO means "In my opinion".
ASAP means "As soon as possible".
CHS is a modified version of the game.
"Stock" means the game as it comes from Matrix, without modification.
Bienvenue a WITP!
Well, theses one i understand, but expression like "iirc" or things like that, i don't. But when i say "dark" for me, i was talking about the game system [;)]
IIRC is an abreviation for "If I recall correctly". (It means "I think I am correct, but I am not sure.")
IMO means "In my opinion".
ASAP means "As soon as possible".
CHS is a modified version of the game.
"Stock" means the game as it comes from Matrix, without modification.
Bienvenue a WITP!
Fine !!! i'm on the way to understand more post here [:D]
I suspect I was just lucky, but NEI air sank Ryujo and beat up a CA in the Java Sea;
I was able to get the same result in a PBEM. The dutch airforces on Java can put up a good defense, especially if you include some of the RAF and USAAF suqadrons out of Malaya and the Philippines (as historically occurred).
Well, theses one i understand, but expression like "iirc" or things like that, i don't. But when i say "dark" for me, i was talking about the game system [;)]
IIRC is an abreviation for "If I recall correctly". (It means "I think I am correct, but I am not sure.")
IMO means "In my opinion".
ASAP means "As soon as possible".
CHS is a modified version of the game.
"Stock" means the game as it comes from Matrix, without modification.
Bienvenue a WITP!
Fine !!! i'm on the way to understand more post here [:D]
I suspect I was just lucky, but NEI air sank Ryujo and beat up a CA in the Java Sea;
I was able to get the same result in a PBEM. The dutch airforces on Java can put up a good defense, especially if you include some of the RAF and USAAF suqadrons out of Malaya and the Philippines (as historically occurred).
Sadly, the dutch squadrons seems to be very tired...they avoid attacking a CV TF in Java Sea, and although they were good at hitting AK a few weeks ago, now they just miss everything. The FG in Manilla had been badly severed, and only a few planes are on transit toward Java, looking for base they can land on !
Rangoon is a hot spot. AVG made a good work in the first 3 weeks, but numerous loss had forced them to get back in order to rest. Now, Hurricanes are coming, and doing good job, but i think it won't be enough; Blenheim coming from Dacca try to supply the town, as no ship can get in (already 3 sinken AK tried to supply the town, in vain).
Swordfish had been evacuated on CVL hermes, and DD Thanet, badly damaged (88sys!!) is en route for Trincomalee with a chunk of HQ Malaya...Vildebeest had made a good job against AK in Khota Bahru and Johore Bahru in the first weeks of war; evacuated in Palembang, they now miss their mission, as the dutch squadrons...
But Dutch subs are GREAT !! (sorry, must be my ancestor blood speaking!), they hit, and hit, and hit AK ! Some even make it by gun in the night !!. Even if it would not stop jap invasion, it keep their navy loss nearly as high as mine ! Yooooh !
Now begginging 20 january 42....
For the first year of the war, your Dutch and British subs are one of your best weapons. The US "S" class subs are decent as well, but with the mostly dud Mk 14 torpedoes, the rest of your US subs are really only effective in the transport and Mine laying role.
Defending Rangoon in force is nomally not a good idea against a live opponent.
In my last game as the Japanese, my Allied opponent tried the same thing stripping India of most of its ground units and shipping them to Rangoon. They were never seen again! With a stock map, Rangoon is a death trap for any Allied units left there when the Japs arrive. Ed also tried to defend on the river along the border. The Japanese 80+ experience Divisions had no problem crossing the river against the 50 experience Allied units and pocketing the defending Allies. Major disaster for the Brits as most of the Indian/British Army was destroyed within 4 hexes of Rangoon.
Going into this game I had no plans to invade India but changed my mind since no one was defending there any more. It took a few months but India was captured up to karchi and the base in front of it. The surrender of so many ground units in Burma also had a major effect on the victory point levels.
ORIGINAL: Ken Estes
I made a successful stand in Java vs AI in the v.1.804 stock WITP. I pulled as many LCUs to Rangoon as JA land advance allowed me, denuded rest of India to ports, shipping them to Rangoon to make the stand on the river line and city to the south of it. Rest of LCU in Malaya delayed, but were then too weak to hold Singapore very long. But holding Rangoon is a key for later, but must have air support. I kept all UK/CW air at Singapore in naval attack/escort mode until the air base damage became too bad, then withdrew LB and F to Rangoon, but took Swordfish, some Hudsons south to add to DEI air. All P.I. air withdrew to DEI, exc for a sqdrn of F left in Bataan for sacrifice defense/attrition. Exc for B17s [sent to Darwin with pol points], I conc all Allied/DEI air at Palembang, Batavia and Soerbaja, with some forward RC and LB in Borneo as long as no land attk threatened. The objective in all this is attrition of IJN transports, which are not well escorted at this stage of game. Keeping the LB in naval will increase experience fairly quickly from their initially abysmal performance, helped by the torpedo bombers (UK and Dutch), which can kill. Base units must be also concentrated to make this happen and I concentrate the LCU in the same ports, fortifying and mining with SS and the few ML [these have to pull out soon]. All warships have to leave Singapore southward and make for Batavia/Soerabaja, join ABDA Fleet and then evade initial IJN air and surface attacks, waiting for IJN/JA to commit transports to attack a vital port [again only defending Java and So Sumatra for keeps]. The PT boats [US and Dutch] are also held close for action, such as at Batavia or Palembang. I made no effort to save any Allied LCUs from the P.I.
I suspect I was just lucky, but NEI air sank Ryujo and beat up a CA in the Java Sea; The Betties from Tainan did not come south because I piled every Chinese corps [AI is timid in China] I could spare into Canton and swept all JA out of SW China, even beseiged Hanoi [forces initially from SW China, then 5 corps from Yenan - 4 more corps to Rangoon front], and AI kept the air in Formosa to hit them. The Chinese LCU gain much experuience just doing bombardments and resisting JA assaults; works if you bring enough corps together and later, with their 99 experience, they form a death star LCU.
[font="times new roman"]By 18Mar42, Singapore and Manila-Bataan fell, but Java-Sumatra remained in allied hands, with a weak JA force ashore at Palembang and one town lost in Sumatra. AI must be really confused. The PoW SAG savaged a convoy to Palembang and the Dutch/CW air operating out of Java did great attrition on IJN convoys, largely unescorted or weakly escorted. Most of Borneo was lost and two towns in Celebes, but Makassar still held against a weakened IJN naval inf unit. Amboina was lost but Timor remained in Allied hands, about to be reinforced with air base units, the most critical shortage in all the game. I think my later successes in Rangoon-Burma and successful defense of Rabaul upset AI reinf of NEI after they took the losses, and exc for a weal landing at Koepang, nothing else was lost. This made for a huge difference in JA resources, because eventually the Java air bases dominated JA resource bases in Borneo/Celebes, with good attrition of IJN AK/AP and forays by KB did nothign to redress as I made the attacked base inactive and no accompanying phib assault came exc a weak one at Kopaeng. [/font]
[font="times new roman"][/font]
[font="times new roman"]I doubt this works in PBEM, but it is a modified Sir Robin leading to conc in Java and So Sumatra.[/font]
With one of those mods, when the Japanese defeat the effort, are the Brits/Indians retreating to India in some order or are they trapped and soon to die?
ORIGINAL: rtrapasso
Defending Rangoon in force is nomally not a good idea against a live opponent.
Depends on the mod - it is suicidal in stock, but the map is different in CHS/Big B/RHS which allows for a defensive effort.
Defending Rangoon in force is nomally not a good idea against a live opponent.
Depends on the mod - it is suicidal in stock, but the map is different in CHS/Big B/RHS which allows for a defensive effort.
With one of those mods, when the Japanese defeat the effort, are the Brits/Indians retreating to India in some order or are they trapped and soon to die?
Depends on how able the attacker is, and how able the defender is... and some luck... done right, i think the Allies could retreat to India.
For the first year of the war, your Dutch and British subs are one of your best weapons. The US "S" class subs are decent as well, but with the mostly dud Mk 14 torpedoes, the rest of your US subs are really only effective in the transport and Mine laying role.
I use the US subs as "watch" in the pacific, as there is only Pearl as level 10 port (for mine laying).
There is only two brits subs in Ceylan, and they are laying much mines in Malacca strait (already 4 AK took a mine).
I've got problems guessing where the AK TF of the japs (AI) are going (move very upsetting !), and my dutch subs are rarely at the good places ...but nether the less, from time to time, a "big fish" guet in a AK; i should provide much awards ! there's a list of Top Pilots, but i would have like to see the same for ships or subs, as i think one dutch (KXV) is responsible of nearly 7AK and a PG sink.
Defending Rangoon in force is nomally not a good idea against a live opponent.
In my last game as the Japanese, my Allied opponent tried the same thing stripping India of most of its ground units and shipping them to Rangoon. They were never seen again! With a stock map, Rangoon is a death trap for any Allied units left there when the Japs arrive. Ed also tried to defend on the river along the border. The Japanese 80+ experience Divisions had no problem crossing the river against the 50 experience Allied units and pocketing the defending Allies. Major disaster for the Brits as most of the Indian/British Army was destroyed within 4 hexes of Rangoon.
Glups, too late, Rngoon fell on january 25 ( 8 march in history), three indian brigades and few supports units try to retrat threw jungle and Irrawady river. But japs (AI, it's my first game) are already on a more direct route toward Akyab and Imphal....i fear the renforts come too late for these places, and my Blenheims in Dacca don't bomb the japs ground units... Last stand will be on the Bhramaputre !! And after this line, well, i suppose if India fall, the japs will have enough victory points in 1943 to gain a automatic victory.
Well, it's not yet, i should keep fighting , and i keep saying :WHAT A GREAT GAME !!!!!![:)]
