great AAR to read.
and castor, dont be so pessimistic. you sank over 500 japs ships. that wouldnt happen if you would have constant "bad luck".[;)]
The rant goes on... PBEM QUIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Moderators: wdolson, Don Bowen, mogami
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
first of all:
great AAR to read.
and castor, dont be so pessimistic. you sank over 500 japs ships. that wouldnt happen if you would have constant "bad luck".[;)]
great AAR to read.
and castor, dont be so pessimistic. you sank over 500 japs ships. that wouldnt happen if you would have constant "bad luck".[;)]
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castor troy
- Posts: 14331
- Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 10:17 am
- Location: Austria
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
ORIGINAL: bigbaba
first of all:
great AAR to read.
and castor, dont be so pessimistic. you sank over 500 japs ships. that wouldnt happen if you would have constant "bad luck".[;)]
thanks! Well, yes I sank a good number of ships already, but the moments when it comes down to important die rolls I seem to fail to hit the right ones 4 out of 5 times... [:D]
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Adnan Meshuggi
- Posts: 532
- Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2001 8:00 am
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
hm, the hitrate could be so low cause the most planes doesn´t find any target.
I had the same situation... KB kicked some americans from the map, but for 200 attacking planes, 12 bomb/torp-hits on 2 cruisers and 1 destroyer sound bad. But - after these hits these ships made their long journey to the bottom of the pacific.
But i still get upset if 200 bombers attack the same sunken destroyer, but the carrierforce in the same hex seemed to be ignored. Everything in the normal range. So i would suggest that the elite comanders and the elite pilots (knowing that they had attacked in the morning) would try to kill em... at last i think this is the thing they would try in real live...
About the game.
For breaking the rules (overstacking...) i suggest a big hit in a big a$$ with 300 med/heavies. Ignore the losses but sink KB.
I am amazed how ignorant some people are... rules to obey is only for the other side (and for them it doesn´t matter if the play the blue or red side) Myself thinks, better to end the game instead of accepting such circumstances.
Your aar is quite funny... even if i think that you are too sensitive about the "missing torpedos"...
I had the same situation... KB kicked some americans from the map, but for 200 attacking planes, 12 bomb/torp-hits on 2 cruisers and 1 destroyer sound bad. But - after these hits these ships made their long journey to the bottom of the pacific.
But i still get upset if 200 bombers attack the same sunken destroyer, but the carrierforce in the same hex seemed to be ignored. Everything in the normal range. So i would suggest that the elite comanders and the elite pilots (knowing that they had attacked in the morning) would try to kill em... at last i think this is the thing they would try in real live...
About the game.
For breaking the rules (overstacking...) i suggest a big hit in a big a$$ with 300 med/heavies. Ignore the losses but sink KB.
I am amazed how ignorant some people are... rules to obey is only for the other side (and for them it doesn´t matter if the play the blue or red side) Myself thinks, better to end the game instead of accepting such circumstances.
Your aar is quite funny... even if i think that you are too sensitive about the "missing torpedos"...
Don't tickle yourself with some moralist crap thinking we have some sort of obligation to help these people. We're there for our self-interest, and anything we do to be 'nice' should be considered a courtesy dweebespit
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
2000lb Bombs have penetration value of only 110ORIGINAL: castor troy
I´ve learnt that even 2000lb bombs bounce off BBs doing NO damage..
even 4000lb have 140
Nothing wonderfull - these are not AP bombs. The only thing can deal with BB is torpedoes... and another BB.
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
ORIGINAL: Sayar
2000lb Bombs have penetration value of only 110ORIGINAL: castor troy
I´ve learnt that even 2000lb bombs bounce off BBs doing NO damage..
even 4000lb have 140
Nothing wonderfull - these are not AP bombs. The only thing can deal with BB is torpedoes... and another BB.
that is true. i remember a UV AAR here im forum where the yamato was sunk by a single submarine torpedo. torpedos are lethal for BB.
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castor troy
- Posts: 14331
- Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 10:17 am
- Location: Austria
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
ORIGINAL: Adnan Meshuggi
hm, the hitrate could be so low cause the most planes doesn´t find any target.
I had the same situation... KB kicked some americans from the map, but for 200 attacking planes, 12 bomb/torp-hits on 2 cruisers and 1 destroyer sound bad. But - after these hits these ships made their long journey to the bottom of the pacific.
But i still get upset if 200 bombers attack the same sunken destroyer, but the carrierforce in the same hex seemed to be ignored. Everything in the normal range. So i would suggest that the elite comanders and the elite pilots (knowing that they had attacked in the morning) would try to kill em... at last i think this is the thing they would try in real live...
About the game.
For breaking the rules (overstacking...) i suggest a big hit in a big a$$ with 300 med/heavies. Ignore the losses but sink KB.
I am amazed how ignorant some people are... rules to obey is only for the other side (and for them it doesn´t matter if the play the blue or red side) Myself thinks, better to end the game instead of accepting such circumstances.
Your aar is quite funny... even if i think that you are too sensitive about the "missing torpedos"...
Well, regarding the overstacking, this is what my recon tells me but if you follow the common thinking on the forum then you have to at least half the numbers of aircraft and then we would be again within our limits. Still, I can´t figure out how it was possible to mount 400+ fighters on Cap over KB as there are several airfields, but mostly level 1. KB and all other TFs are moving North now and all the airfields seem to have been abandoned. There´s not a single airfield in range that I could attack where it would be worth it as all are empty now.
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ny59giants
- Posts: 9891
- Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 12:02 pm
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
Your at the point in the game were the Allies have to bring the war to the Japanese. He can pull back and react to your moves. I would plan to invade Timor or New Guinea to threaten his Oil/Resources. Once you get a solid beach head in this area, just wear him down. Port Moresby and Gili Gili are just side shows.
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castor troy
- Posts: 14331
- Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 10:17 am
- Location: Austria
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
ORIGINAL: Sayar
2000lb Bombs have penetration value of only 110ORIGINAL: castor troy
I´ve learnt that even 2000lb bombs bounce off BBs doing NO damage..
even 4000lb have 140
Nothing wonderfull - these are not AP bombs. The only thing can deal with BB is torpedoes... and another BB.
yeah, it´s a pity that it´s always an all or nothing thing in WITP. Those bombs bounce off and do no damage - well they do 2 or 3 sys points perhaps. There should be a routine for non penetrating bomb hits as I´m sure a BB´s captain would not be happy about 3 or 4 1000lb bombs exploding on his deck or next to the belt armor as this would cause serious damage. We have to live with how it´s modelled, but isn´t that changed in AE?
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castor troy
- Posts: 14331
- Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 10:17 am
- Location: Austria
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
ORIGINAL: ny59giants
Your at the point in the game were the Allies have to bring the war to the Japanese. He can pull back and react to your moves. I would plan to invade Timor or New Guinea to threaten his Oil/Resources. Once you get a solid beach head in this area, just wear him down. Port Moresby and Gili Gili are just side shows.
that´s exactly what I´m planning to do, but it´s impossible in Nikmod to deal with bases as you lose a dozen bombers to flak everytime so this is just something the Japanese player is laughing about. More effective flak was a good idea, but as always, players are exploiting such features in just giving every front line base (how many are "front line bases"? 12? 15?) more effective flak defenses than Berlin had it in 1944. Overstacking is a problem in every aspect of the game. [8|]#
And the argument that always is brought up about "when he overstacks somewhere, he´s understrength somewhere else" is just wrong, as there are enough AA units that every front line base can be filled up with 4 or 5 of them. With the upcoming loss of one of those front line bases, the AA units are just brought one line back to overstack the coming "front line base".
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castor troy
- Posts: 14331
- Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 10:17 am
- Location: Austria
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
good turn for us...
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 03/17/43
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Day Air attack on Koepang , at 28,77
Japanese aircraft
no flights
Allied aircraft
B-25C Mitchell x 194
Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-46-III Dinah: 1 destroyed
Allied aircraft losses
B-25C Mitchell: 2 destroyed, 13 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
56 casualties reported
Guns lost 2
Airbase hits 2
Airbase supply hits 2
Runway hits 62
Port hits 2
Aircraft Attacking:
3 x B-25C Mitchell bombing at 19000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Kiska Island , at 92,35
Allied aircraft
F4F-3 Wildcat x 45
SBD Dauntless x 45
TBF Avenger x 16
P-39D Airacobra x 16
PV-1 Ventura x 23
Allied aircraft losses
SBD Dauntless: 14 damaged
TBF Avenger: 1 destroyed
P-39D Airacobra: 1 destroyed, 2 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
143 casualties reported
Guns lost 7
Airbase hits 1
Runway hits 24
Port hits 6
Aircraft Attacking:
14 x SBD Dauntless bombing at 2000 feet
11 bombers are lost today...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on TF at 55,88 [:D]
Allied aircraft
Seafire x 18
F4F-4 Wildcat x 44
SBD Dauntless x 106
TBF Avenger x 36
No Allied losses
Japanese Ships
AP Yokohama Maru, Torpedo hits 1, on fire
AP Tofuku Maru, Bomb hits 10, on fire, heavy damage
AP Teiun Maru, Bomb hits 2, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
AP Taibun Maru, Bomb hits 3, on fire, heavy damage
AP Yamakuni Maru, Bomb hits 6, on fire, heavy damage
AP Victoria Maru, Bomb hits 1, on fire
AP Takayo Maru, Bomb hits 5, on fire, heavy damage
AK Milan Maru, Bomb hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
AP Tasmania Maru, Bomb hits 3, on fire
AK Matue Maru, Bomb hits 2, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
AP Tama Maru
AP Turusima Maru, Bomb hits 3, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
AP Tensyo Maru, Bomb hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
Japanese ground losses:
860 casualties reported
Guns lost 14
Aircraft Attacking:
4 x SBD Dauntless bombing at 2000 feet
2 x TBF Avenger launching torpedoes at 200 feet
our carriers are still in the area around Thursday Island (to draw out a Japanese attack with Betties - after one attack, retreat mode on flank speed) and our recon aircraft spotted TFs at Lae so we moved to the South coast (North West of PM) to get within 4 hexes of Lae. The enemy troop convoy just left port and ended up one hex South of Lae when we launch a big strike on the uncapped convoy. A lot of medium size APs should be history, what was once again amazing was the dud rate of our aireal launched torps, which must have been somewhere around 75% and the British didn´t launch a single of their Avenger I. Still, that was a nice one as we destroyed parts of the 19th A/div that went down with an AP that sunk immediately. The rest will probably make it to Lae to unload but there´s now troop cargo capacity worth half a division less for the Japanese. No sign of enemy activity to launch a strike against our carriers.
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Day Air attack on TF at 55,88
Allied aircraft
F4F-4 Wildcat x 2
SBD Dauntless x 15
No Allied losses
Japanese Ships
AP Turusima Maru, Bomb hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
AP Tama Maru
AP Tofuku Maru, Bomb hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
AP Takayo Maru, Bomb hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
Japanese ground losses:
123 casualties reported
Guns lost 1
Aircraft Attacking:
3 x SBD Dauntless bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on TF at 55,88
Allied aircraft
SBD Dauntless x 15
No Allied losses
Japanese Ships
AP Takayo Maru, Bomb hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
AP Tofuku Maru, Bomb hits 3, on fire, heavy damage
AP Turusima Maru, Bomb hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
AP Tatuwa Maru
Japanese ground losses:
180 casualties reported
Guns lost 5
Aircraft Attacking:
3 x SBD Dauntless bombing at 2000 feet
we lose 2 carrier based bombers and a F4F-4...
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 03/17/43
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Koepang , at 28,77
Japanese aircraft
no flights
Allied aircraft
B-25C Mitchell x 194
Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-46-III Dinah: 1 destroyed
Allied aircraft losses
B-25C Mitchell: 2 destroyed, 13 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
56 casualties reported
Guns lost 2
Airbase hits 2
Airbase supply hits 2
Runway hits 62
Port hits 2
Aircraft Attacking:
3 x B-25C Mitchell bombing at 19000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Kiska Island , at 92,35
Allied aircraft
F4F-3 Wildcat x 45
SBD Dauntless x 45
TBF Avenger x 16
P-39D Airacobra x 16
PV-1 Ventura x 23
Allied aircraft losses
SBD Dauntless: 14 damaged
TBF Avenger: 1 destroyed
P-39D Airacobra: 1 destroyed, 2 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
143 casualties reported
Guns lost 7
Airbase hits 1
Runway hits 24
Port hits 6
Aircraft Attacking:
14 x SBD Dauntless bombing at 2000 feet
11 bombers are lost today...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on TF at 55,88 [:D]
Allied aircraft
Seafire x 18
F4F-4 Wildcat x 44
SBD Dauntless x 106
TBF Avenger x 36
No Allied losses
Japanese Ships
AP Yokohama Maru, Torpedo hits 1, on fire
AP Tofuku Maru, Bomb hits 10, on fire, heavy damage
AP Teiun Maru, Bomb hits 2, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
AP Taibun Maru, Bomb hits 3, on fire, heavy damage
AP Yamakuni Maru, Bomb hits 6, on fire, heavy damage
AP Victoria Maru, Bomb hits 1, on fire
AP Takayo Maru, Bomb hits 5, on fire, heavy damage
AK Milan Maru, Bomb hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
AP Tasmania Maru, Bomb hits 3, on fire
AK Matue Maru, Bomb hits 2, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
AP Tama Maru
AP Turusima Maru, Bomb hits 3, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
AP Tensyo Maru, Bomb hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
Japanese ground losses:
860 casualties reported
Guns lost 14
Aircraft Attacking:
4 x SBD Dauntless bombing at 2000 feet
2 x TBF Avenger launching torpedoes at 200 feet
our carriers are still in the area around Thursday Island (to draw out a Japanese attack with Betties - after one attack, retreat mode on flank speed) and our recon aircraft spotted TFs at Lae so we moved to the South coast (North West of PM) to get within 4 hexes of Lae. The enemy troop convoy just left port and ended up one hex South of Lae when we launch a big strike on the uncapped convoy. A lot of medium size APs should be history, what was once again amazing was the dud rate of our aireal launched torps, which must have been somewhere around 75% and the British didn´t launch a single of their Avenger I. Still, that was a nice one as we destroyed parts of the 19th A/div that went down with an AP that sunk immediately. The rest will probably make it to Lae to unload but there´s now troop cargo capacity worth half a division less for the Japanese. No sign of enemy activity to launch a strike against our carriers.
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Day Air attack on TF at 55,88
Allied aircraft
F4F-4 Wildcat x 2
SBD Dauntless x 15
No Allied losses
Japanese Ships
AP Turusima Maru, Bomb hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
AP Tama Maru
AP Tofuku Maru, Bomb hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
AP Takayo Maru, Bomb hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
Japanese ground losses:
123 casualties reported
Guns lost 1
Aircraft Attacking:
3 x SBD Dauntless bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on TF at 55,88
Allied aircraft
SBD Dauntless x 15
No Allied losses
Japanese Ships
AP Takayo Maru, Bomb hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
AP Tofuku Maru, Bomb hits 3, on fire, heavy damage
AP Turusima Maru, Bomb hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
AP Tatuwa Maru
Japanese ground losses:
180 casualties reported
Guns lost 5
Aircraft Attacking:
3 x SBD Dauntless bombing at 2000 feet
we lose 2 carrier based bombers and a F4F-4...
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castor troy
- Posts: 14331
- Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 10:17 am
- Location: Austria
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 03/18/43
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Night Time Surface Combat, near Babo at 42,77
Japanese Ships
AK Kinkai Maru, Shell hits 10, on fire, heavy damage
Allied Ships
DD Meredith
DD Gwin
the Cowboys from Darwin sink another ship. The previously damaged small AK Kinkai Maru is history...
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TF 31 encounters mine field at Saipan (63,64)
Japanese Ships
MSW Wa 19
MSW Wa 13
MSW Wa 11
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ASW attack at 40,68
Japanese Ships
DD Shinonome
DD Akatsuki
Allied Ships
SS Grenadier, hits 4, on fire
and the enemy ASW stays more effective than ours. Grenadier retires heavily damaged to Darwin after receiving 1 hit and 3 near misses...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Koepang , at 28,77
Japanese aircraft
no flights
Allied aircraft
B-24D Liberator x 22
Japanese aircraft losses
H8K Emily: 1 destroyed
Japanese ground losses:
29 casualties reported
Guns lost 1
Airbase hits 2
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 16
Aircraft Attacking:
11 x B-24D Liberator bombing at 26000 feet
the only way we can attack enemy bases is above the max ceiling of enemy super flak guns...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Thursday Island , at 49,90
Allied aircraft
Hudson I x 4
B-25C Mitchell x 180
Allied aircraft losses
B-25C Mitchell: 1 destroyed, 21 damaged [:(] doesn´t look that bad but...
Japanese ground losses:
18 casualties reported
Guns lost 1
Airbase hits 3
Airbase supply hits 5
Runway hits 20
Aircraft Attacking:
35 x B-25C Mitchell bombing at 21000 feet
we´re attacking at high alt (max alt for the Mitchells) and today we lost 19 Mitchells in this attack for no result. 10% of the bombers lost in one attack. This is more than usual but we´re always in the range between 5 and 10%!!! [8|] Like I´ve mentioned before, making flak more effective was a good idea, but players then create super flak defenses (I´m probably doing the same sh*t in my game against Swift, but we will have to find that out in the future when he will start his real attacks - then we have to discuss a solution). The last couple of months I just didn´t want to believe it, but it´s obvious that you can´t use Mitchells for attacks on enemy bases... [8|] As a result I have "upgraded" two Mitchell BG to A-26 Havocs today!!! The Havoc pool is empty now, I would have to use Bostons instead (which are in fact the same as the Havocs) because those bombers have a max alt above 25.000 ft, which is above the ceiling of enemy flak guns. I´ve been attacking above 19.000ft and there are "only" the 75mm and 105mm flak guns firing but as you can see, with devastating effects all the time. So we have to attack above 25.000ft. The Boston and Havoc only have a max range of 6 so they are either to short legged or if they can reach the target they only drop 2x500lb bombs on extended range. Still, this is better than losing more than a dozen Mitchells with every attack...
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Night Time Surface Combat, near Babo at 42,77
Japanese Ships
AK Kinkai Maru, Shell hits 10, on fire, heavy damage
Allied Ships
DD Meredith
DD Gwin
the Cowboys from Darwin sink another ship. The previously damaged small AK Kinkai Maru is history...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 31 encounters mine field at Saipan (63,64)
Japanese Ships
MSW Wa 19
MSW Wa 13
MSW Wa 11
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ASW attack at 40,68
Japanese Ships
DD Shinonome
DD Akatsuki
Allied Ships
SS Grenadier, hits 4, on fire
and the enemy ASW stays more effective than ours. Grenadier retires heavily damaged to Darwin after receiving 1 hit and 3 near misses...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Koepang , at 28,77
Japanese aircraft
no flights
Allied aircraft
B-24D Liberator x 22
Japanese aircraft losses
H8K Emily: 1 destroyed
Japanese ground losses:
29 casualties reported
Guns lost 1
Airbase hits 2
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 16
Aircraft Attacking:
11 x B-24D Liberator bombing at 26000 feet
the only way we can attack enemy bases is above the max ceiling of enemy super flak guns...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Thursday Island , at 49,90
Allied aircraft
Hudson I x 4
B-25C Mitchell x 180
Allied aircraft losses
B-25C Mitchell: 1 destroyed, 21 damaged [:(] doesn´t look that bad but...
Japanese ground losses:
18 casualties reported
Guns lost 1
Airbase hits 3
Airbase supply hits 5
Runway hits 20
Aircraft Attacking:
35 x B-25C Mitchell bombing at 21000 feet
we´re attacking at high alt (max alt for the Mitchells) and today we lost 19 Mitchells in this attack for no result. 10% of the bombers lost in one attack. This is more than usual but we´re always in the range between 5 and 10%!!! [8|] Like I´ve mentioned before, making flak more effective was a good idea, but players then create super flak defenses (I´m probably doing the same sh*t in my game against Swift, but we will have to find that out in the future when he will start his real attacks - then we have to discuss a solution). The last couple of months I just didn´t want to believe it, but it´s obvious that you can´t use Mitchells for attacks on enemy bases... [8|] As a result I have "upgraded" two Mitchell BG to A-26 Havocs today!!! The Havoc pool is empty now, I would have to use Bostons instead (which are in fact the same as the Havocs) because those bombers have a max alt above 25.000 ft, which is above the ceiling of enemy flak guns. I´ve been attacking above 19.000ft and there are "only" the 75mm and 105mm flak guns firing but as you can see, with devastating effects all the time. So we have to attack above 25.000ft. The Boston and Havoc only have a max range of 6 so they are either to short legged or if they can reach the target they only drop 2x500lb bombs on extended range. Still, this is better than losing more than a dozen Mitchells with every attack...
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ny59giants
- Posts: 9891
- Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 12:02 pm
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
What is your Political Point situation??
I would go through about every squadron in the Darwin area to NE Australia and make sure they have the correct type of leaders. But first, I would do so with my CV squadrons. I know you have played WitP for a while, but I tend to do this every so often as it makes a big difference. [;)]
I always keep my DB/TB on my CVs at 10% naval search as it seems to help even when I have the BB/CA/CL seaplanes doing most of the heavy searching. [&:]
I would go through about every squadron in the Darwin area to NE Australia and make sure they have the correct type of leaders. But first, I would do so with my CV squadrons. I know you have played WitP for a while, but I tend to do this every so often as it makes a big difference. [;)]
I always keep my DB/TB on my CVs at 10% naval search as it seems to help even when I have the BB/CA/CL seaplanes doing most of the heavy searching. [&:]
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ny59giants
- Posts: 9891
- Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 12:02 pm
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
Have you tried sending in your 2e bombers at 6,000 or 7,000 to see if you can get below the medium and heavy AA guns?? I think they have a low end ceiling that you may be able to get below...I hope. [8|]
The advantage of the A-20 Havoc vs A-20 Bostons is their gun value. The Havoc is about 12 and thus can deal effectively with Japanese fighters. [:D]
The advantage of the A-20 Havoc vs A-20 Bostons is their gun value. The Havoc is about 12 and thus can deal effectively with Japanese fighters. [:D]
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castor troy
- Posts: 14331
- Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 10:17 am
- Location: Austria
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
ORIGINAL: ny59giants
What is your Political Point situation??
I would go through about every squadron in the Darwin area to NE Australia and make sure they have the correct type of leaders. But first, I would do so with my CV squadrons. I know you have played WitP for a while, but I tend to do this every so often as it makes a big difference. [;)]
I always keep my DB/TB on my CVs at 10% naval search as it seems to help even when I have the BB/CA/CL seaplanes doing most of the heavy searching. [&:]
I´ve just changed an Australian division to South Pacific but I still have some 700 pp left (600 will be used up for two British DDs that won´t be withdrawn at the end of the month).
There are enough pp that I can change leaders but the CV squadrons should be ok. I check them EVERYTIME my fleet CVs leave port, those checks include numbers of aircraft, Cap level for fighters, attack orders, range AND leaders. Leaders are checked only because of the leader bug, as from time to time you find a Japanese Army major in command of one of your SBD squadrons.
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castor troy
- Posts: 14331
- Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 10:17 am
- Location: Austria
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
ORIGINAL: ny59giants
Have you tried sending in your 2e bombers at 6,000 or 7,000 to see if you can get below the medium and heavy AA guns?? I think they have a low end ceiling that you may be able to get below...I hope. [8|]
The advantage of the A-20 Havoc vs A-20 Bostons is their gun value. The Havoc is about 12 and thus can deal effectively with Japanese fighters. [:D]
Yes they have a better gun value but only because of their forward firing guns in the nose - same with the B-25C and B-25J. But I have yet to see those guns making a difference in fending off enemy fighters, and I think they shouldn´t anyway.
Good tip with the MIN ceiling! [X(][X(][X(] I will give it a try with a very low experienced sqadron. Though I fear there will be around a hundred small AA guns at those bases with a hundred big AA guns, so I wonder if it will make a difference. But it´s definetely worth a try.
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castor troy
- Posts: 14331
- Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 10:17 am
- Location: Austria
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 03/19/43
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Sub attack at 40,67
Japanese Ships
CL Jintsu
DD Shinonome
DD Akatsuki
DD Yugure
DD Suzukaze
DD Yamakaze
DD Takanami
DD Akizuki
Allied Ships
SS Thresher, hits 1
Salvo of 6 torps hit CL Jintsu but they fail to detonate. Well, make your own picture if I´m lucky or my opponent is. It may be a onesided picture, but for me, my opponent hits the lucky side of the coin far more often than I do.[;)]
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TF 95 encounters mine field at Andaman Island (23,34)
Japanese Ships
MSW Hinode Maru #18
MSW Banshu Maru #8
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Day Air attack on Koepang , at 28,77
Japanese aircraft
no flights
Allied aircraft
B-25C Mitchell x 185
Japanese aircraft losses
H8K Emily: 1 destroyed
Allied aircraft losses
B-25C Mitchell: 2 destroyed, 12 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
153 casualties reported
Guns lost 3
Airbase hits 4
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 57
Port hits 1
Port supply hits 1
Aircraft Attacking:
3 x B-25C Mitchell bombing at 19000 feet
7 bombers lost today
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Koepang , at 28,77
Japanese aircraft
no flights
Allied aircraft
B-24D Liberator x 41
Japanese aircraft losses
No Japanese losses
No Allied losses
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 4
Aircraft Attacking:
20 x B-24D Liberator bombing at 26000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Dili , at 31,77
Allied aircraft
P-38G Lightning x 77
B-17E Fortress x 96
No Allied losses
Japanese ground losses:
50 casualties reported
Airbase hits 3
Airbase supply hits 2
Runway hits 19
Aircraft Attacking:
32 x B-17E Fortress bombing at 26000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack at 40,67
Japanese Ships
CL Jintsu
DD Shinonome
DD Akatsuki
DD Yugure
DD Suzukaze
DD Yamakaze
DD Takanami
DD Akizuki
Allied Ships
SS Thresher, hits 1
Salvo of 6 torps hit CL Jintsu but they fail to detonate. Well, make your own picture if I´m lucky or my opponent is. It may be a onesided picture, but for me, my opponent hits the lucky side of the coin far more often than I do.[;)]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 95 encounters mine field at Andaman Island (23,34)
Japanese Ships
MSW Hinode Maru #18
MSW Banshu Maru #8
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Day Air attack on Koepang , at 28,77
Japanese aircraft
no flights
Allied aircraft
B-25C Mitchell x 185
Japanese aircraft losses
H8K Emily: 1 destroyed
Allied aircraft losses
B-25C Mitchell: 2 destroyed, 12 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
153 casualties reported
Guns lost 3
Airbase hits 4
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 57
Port hits 1
Port supply hits 1
Aircraft Attacking:
3 x B-25C Mitchell bombing at 19000 feet
7 bombers lost today
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Koepang , at 28,77
Japanese aircraft
no flights
Allied aircraft
B-24D Liberator x 41
Japanese aircraft losses
No Japanese losses
No Allied losses
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 4
Aircraft Attacking:
20 x B-24D Liberator bombing at 26000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Dili , at 31,77
Allied aircraft
P-38G Lightning x 77
B-17E Fortress x 96
No Allied losses
Japanese ground losses:
50 casualties reported
Airbase hits 3
Airbase supply hits 2
Runway hits 19
Aircraft Attacking:
32 x B-17E Fortress bombing at 26000 feet
-
castor troy
- Posts: 14331
- Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 10:17 am
- Location: Austria
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 03/20/43
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 31 encounters mine field at Saipan (63,64)
Japanese Ships
AP Yamakuni Maru, and is sunk
MSW Wa 19
MSW Wa 13
MSW Wa 11
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 46 encounters mine field at Truk (63,78)
Japanese Ships
MSW Eguchi Maru
MSW Choun Maru #7
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 95 encounters mine field at Victoria Point (25,39)
Japanese Ships
MSW Hinode Maru #18
MSW Banshu Maru #8
after over a year where three of my minelayer subs were operating with great success, my opponent decided that it would be worth sending out MSW to deal with the sub laid mines... [:D] One of my mine layer subs has been recently hit by a Helen...
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Day Air attack on Gili Gili , at 56,94
Japanese aircraft
no flights
Allied aircraft
F-5A Lightning x 3
B-24D Liberator x 87
Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-46-III Dinah: 1 destroyed
Japanese ground losses:
133 casualties reported
Guns lost 3
Airbase hits 12
Airbase supply hits 5
Runway hits 51
Aircraft Attacking:
27 x B-24D Liberator bombing at 26000 feet
for the moment, those attacks by 4Es are the way to go, the only way where we don´t lose over a dozen bombers with every attack...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Kiska Island , at 92,35
Allied aircraft
F4F-3 Wildcat x 45
SBD Dauntless x 49
TBF Avenger x 16
P-39D Airacobra x 33
PV-1 Ventura x 35
Allied aircraft losses
SBD Dauntless: 7 damaged
P-39D Airacobra: 3 damaged
PV-1 Ventura: 6 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
276 casualties reported
Guns lost 8
Airbase hits 3
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 33
Aircraft Attacking:
18 x P-39D Airacobra bombing at 2000 feet
months of bombing, months of being cut off, 5000+ bomber attacks of far, still it is not possible to wear down the enemy flak defenses... another example where the Japanese can just sit there watching the flak kills going up and up and up...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 31 encounters mine field at Saipan (63,64)
Japanese Ships
AP Yamakuni Maru, and is sunk
MSW Wa 19
MSW Wa 13
MSW Wa 11
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 46 encounters mine field at Truk (63,78)
Japanese Ships
MSW Eguchi Maru
MSW Choun Maru #7
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 95 encounters mine field at Victoria Point (25,39)
Japanese Ships
MSW Hinode Maru #18
MSW Banshu Maru #8
after over a year where three of my minelayer subs were operating with great success, my opponent decided that it would be worth sending out MSW to deal with the sub laid mines... [:D] One of my mine layer subs has been recently hit by a Helen...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Gili Gili , at 56,94
Japanese aircraft
no flights
Allied aircraft
F-5A Lightning x 3
B-24D Liberator x 87
Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-46-III Dinah: 1 destroyed
Japanese ground losses:
133 casualties reported
Guns lost 3
Airbase hits 12
Airbase supply hits 5
Runway hits 51
Aircraft Attacking:
27 x B-24D Liberator bombing at 26000 feet
for the moment, those attacks by 4Es are the way to go, the only way where we don´t lose over a dozen bombers with every attack...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Kiska Island , at 92,35
Allied aircraft
F4F-3 Wildcat x 45
SBD Dauntless x 49
TBF Avenger x 16
P-39D Airacobra x 33
PV-1 Ventura x 35
Allied aircraft losses
SBD Dauntless: 7 damaged
P-39D Airacobra: 3 damaged
PV-1 Ventura: 6 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
276 casualties reported
Guns lost 8
Airbase hits 3
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 33
Aircraft Attacking:
18 x P-39D Airacobra bombing at 2000 feet
months of bombing, months of being cut off, 5000+ bomber attacks of far, still it is not possible to wear down the enemy flak defenses... another example where the Japanese can just sit there watching the flak kills going up and up and up...
-
castor troy
- Posts: 14331
- Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 10:17 am
- Location: Austria
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 03/21/43
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ASW attack at 50,99
Japanese Ships
SS RO-63, hits 4
Allied Ships
DD Phelps
DD Porter
DD Flusser
DD Reid
DD Perkins
DD Cushing
DD Shaw
DD Case
DD Lamson
CA Salt Lake City
4 near misses for RO-63...
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Day Air attack on Dili , at 31,77
Allied aircraft
B-17E Fortress x 103
No Allied losses
Japanese ground losses:
42 casualties reported
Airbase hits 1
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 10
Aircraft Attacking:
36 x B-17E Fortress bombing at 26000 feet
the results against Dili aren´t looking like I would expect them to...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Kiska Island , at 92,35
Allied aircraft
F4F-3 Wildcat x 45
SBD Dauntless x 49
TBF Avenger x 16
P-39D Airacobra x 33
PV-1 Ventura x 31
Allied aircraft losses
SBD Dauntless: 1 destroyed, 16 damaged
P-39D Airacobra: 5 damaged
PV-1 Ventura: 2 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
197 casualties reported
Guns lost 4
Airbase hits 1
Runway hits 17
Port hits 1
Port supply hits 1
Aircraft Attacking:
17 x P-39D Airacobra bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ASW attack at 50,99
Japanese Ships
SS RO-63, hits 4
Allied Ships
DD Phelps
DD Porter
DD Flusser
DD Reid
DD Perkins
DD Cushing
DD Shaw
DD Case
DD Lamson
CA Salt Lake City
4 near misses for RO-63...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Dili , at 31,77
Allied aircraft
B-17E Fortress x 103
No Allied losses
Japanese ground losses:
42 casualties reported
Airbase hits 1
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 10
Aircraft Attacking:
36 x B-17E Fortress bombing at 26000 feet
the results against Dili aren´t looking like I would expect them to...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Kiska Island , at 92,35
Allied aircraft
F4F-3 Wildcat x 45
SBD Dauntless x 49
TBF Avenger x 16
P-39D Airacobra x 33
PV-1 Ventura x 31
Allied aircraft losses
SBD Dauntless: 1 destroyed, 16 damaged
P-39D Airacobra: 5 damaged
PV-1 Ventura: 2 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
197 casualties reported
Guns lost 4
Airbase hits 1
Runway hits 17
Port hits 1
Port supply hits 1
Aircraft Attacking:
17 x P-39D Airacobra bombing at 2000 feet
-
castor troy
- Posts: 14331
- Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 10:17 am
- Location: Austria
RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 03/22/43
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Time Surface Combat, near Rangoon at 29,34
Japanese Ships
PC Matsuwa, Shell hits 3, on fire, heavy damage
AK Akagi Maru
AK Uzan Maru
AK Tekkai Maru, Shell hits 15, on fire, heavy damage
AK Ushio Maru
AK Oyama Maru
AK Amaho Maru
AK Tran Ninh
AK Jinmu Maru
AK Eisho Maru
AK Shoko Maru
AK Jinbu Maru, Shell hits 11, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
AK Teikin Maru
AK Ryuzan Maru
AK Yoko Maru
AK Katsurahama Maru
AK Taibu Maru
AK Gyoku Maru
Allied Ships
CL Glasgow
CL Newcastle
DD Mustin
DD Russell
a small cruiser sqadron was sent to Rangoon to deal with this TF that was sitting there not disbanded for weeks, for what reason ever. In fact this was a high risk mission, not worth the couple of ships damaged or sunk but we only got intel of about 40 enemy bombers at Rangoon (with 400 enemy fighters).
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Koepang , at 28,77
Allied aircraft
B-25J Mitchell x 11
Allied aircraft losses
B-25J Mitchell: 4 destroyed, 3 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
13 casualties reported
Guns lost 1
Airbase hits 1
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 9
Aircraft Attacking:
5 x B-25J Mitchell bombing at 1000 feet
okay, the test on low level attack showed clearly that this is not the way to go. In the end 7 Mitchells were lost to flak. 7 out of 11...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Kiska Island , at 92,35
Allied aircraft
F4F-3 Wildcat x 24
SBD Dauntless x 39
TBF Avenger x 16
P-39D Airacobra x 25
PV-1 Ventura x 30
Allied aircraft losses
SBD Dauntless: 7 damaged
TBF Avenger: 3 damaged
P-39D Airacobra: 3 destroyed, 4 damaged
PV-1 Ventura: 2 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
174 casualties reported
Guns lost 1
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 31
Port hits 1
Port supply hits 1
Aircraft Attacking:
13 x P-39D Airacobra bombing at 2000 feet
I´ve got the strange feeling that flak fire will never ever be silenced. That´s just not possible in Nikmod and the losses are getting more and more severe. I guess so far over 100 aircraft were lost. [8|] Nik cured the uber Cap (the consequences will be seen as soon as we really get our offensives going, but he also definetely created uber Flak now).
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Time Surface Combat, near Rangoon at 29,34
Japanese Ships
PC Matsuwa, Shell hits 3, on fire, heavy damage
AK Akagi Maru
AK Uzan Maru
AK Tekkai Maru, Shell hits 15, on fire, heavy damage
AK Ushio Maru
AK Oyama Maru
AK Amaho Maru
AK Tran Ninh
AK Jinmu Maru
AK Eisho Maru
AK Shoko Maru
AK Jinbu Maru, Shell hits 11, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
AK Teikin Maru
AK Ryuzan Maru
AK Yoko Maru
AK Katsurahama Maru
AK Taibu Maru
AK Gyoku Maru
Allied Ships
CL Glasgow
CL Newcastle
DD Mustin
DD Russell
a small cruiser sqadron was sent to Rangoon to deal with this TF that was sitting there not disbanded for weeks, for what reason ever. In fact this was a high risk mission, not worth the couple of ships damaged or sunk but we only got intel of about 40 enemy bombers at Rangoon (with 400 enemy fighters).
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Koepang , at 28,77
Allied aircraft
B-25J Mitchell x 11
Allied aircraft losses
B-25J Mitchell: 4 destroyed, 3 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
13 casualties reported
Guns lost 1
Airbase hits 1
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 9
Aircraft Attacking:
5 x B-25J Mitchell bombing at 1000 feet
okay, the test on low level attack showed clearly that this is not the way to go. In the end 7 Mitchells were lost to flak. 7 out of 11...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on Kiska Island , at 92,35
Allied aircraft
F4F-3 Wildcat x 24
SBD Dauntless x 39
TBF Avenger x 16
P-39D Airacobra x 25
PV-1 Ventura x 30
Allied aircraft losses
SBD Dauntless: 7 damaged
TBF Avenger: 3 damaged
P-39D Airacobra: 3 destroyed, 4 damaged
PV-1 Ventura: 2 damaged
Japanese ground losses:
174 casualties reported
Guns lost 1
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 31
Port hits 1
Port supply hits 1
Aircraft Attacking:
13 x P-39D Airacobra bombing at 2000 feet
I´ve got the strange feeling that flak fire will never ever be silenced. That´s just not possible in Nikmod and the losses are getting more and more severe. I guess so far over 100 aircraft were lost. [8|] Nik cured the uber Cap (the consequences will be seen as soon as we really get our offensives going, but he also definetely created uber Flak now).
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RE: The rant goes on... Pzjg Hortlund vs Castor Troy
Hey CT,
Just kind of skimming your AAR. To a degree, I feel your pain on bombing vs. a heavily defended base (for months on end). I lose about 40 planes per turn across the map, just in "routine" base suppression" runs. But I accept the mechanics for what they are. Bilbow has been frustrated by the pace of operations, and I'm frustrated by the speed in which things can be repaired. Six in one hand, a half dozen in the other.
That being said, I've found that, esp given the already reduced bomb-loads of planes in CHS (looks like what you're playing), it's often not worth the bother to attack at extended range with Medium bombers, particularly if it's CAP'd. Your heavy bombers can usually fair ok when returning from extended range because of their durability. But in the case of my B-25s which only carry 4x 500# regulary, and 2x 500# at extended range, I ask the question, if it's really that important to drop (only) a pair of 500# bombs on that base 7 hexes away.
But this is where it's actually useful to find the right plane for the job. If you've got a target that is 8 hexes away, can either use
B-25 w/ 2x 500# bombs at extented range or
A-29 w/ 4x 250# bombs at normal range
There's really no difference between the two. But it really makes a difference to whack a target with twice the bombload, so if you actually have the option, you might as well use A-29s to hit the more distant base, and keep the B-25s reigned in to normal range.
-F-
Just kind of skimming your AAR. To a degree, I feel your pain on bombing vs. a heavily defended base (for months on end). I lose about 40 planes per turn across the map, just in "routine" base suppression" runs. But I accept the mechanics for what they are. Bilbow has been frustrated by the pace of operations, and I'm frustrated by the speed in which things can be repaired. Six in one hand, a half dozen in the other.
That being said, I've found that, esp given the already reduced bomb-loads of planes in CHS (looks like what you're playing), it's often not worth the bother to attack at extended range with Medium bombers, particularly if it's CAP'd. Your heavy bombers can usually fair ok when returning from extended range because of their durability. But in the case of my B-25s which only carry 4x 500# regulary, and 2x 500# at extended range, I ask the question, if it's really that important to drop (only) a pair of 500# bombs on that base 7 hexes away.
But this is where it's actually useful to find the right plane for the job. If you've got a target that is 8 hexes away, can either use
B-25 w/ 2x 500# bombs at extented range or
A-29 w/ 4x 250# bombs at normal range
There's really no difference between the two. But it really makes a difference to whack a target with twice the bombload, so if you actually have the option, you might as well use A-29s to hit the more distant base, and keep the B-25s reigned in to normal range.
-F-
"It is obvious that you have greatly over-estimated my regard for your opinion." - Me
