Next Version 2.2 patch update (May 14, 2008)

[David Winter]

Greetings.

I just thought I'd take a few minutes and touch base with everyone and let people know what's happening with the next patch for 2.2.

The Patch.
The next patch for 2.2 (no build number yet) is progressing a long very well. It has a couple of minor new features and fixes for many of the reported issues. I think the largest new feature is the play book tester. Playbooks now allow you to "force feed" a game situation into the playbook and it will tell you what play group was used for that situation and what play it returned. This should allow play book designers to get a better understanding of how their profiles will be used in the game. The Playbook tester calls exactly the same functions the rest of the game does to select a play, so the tester is WYSIWYG in this regard.

A couple of AI changes have been made as well.

I'll post a complete list of fixes and new features as the patch release gets closer. I would like to have this patch out for the end of the month, however it's already the 14th, so it will likely be pushed into June. I'll keep everyone posted on that.

Thank you again for your continued support.

David

[dreamtheatervt]

Thank you David.

[redwolf1]

Thank you for the update David - looks like some good things in store for the upcoming patch! [8D]

The 2.5 paid update sounds very interesting and has many enticing features for me. Would love some simple trades integrated into the game! I know you intend on a basic system, but please don't rush it - if the AI is poor in this regards it could a have a very detrimental impact on the leagues. Take your time, make it basic, but give it good solid AI - it will be worth the wait.

Thanks for your continued dedication.

Redwolf

[hack153]

sounds good.

[simmer]

Grrrrrrrrrrrrreat to hear.......I'm gettng ready for the up coming season.........2 months away NCAA

[micvik]

will the next version 0f 2.2 include the fix for issue of plays disapearing from groups when they are imported into another playbook?

[David Winter]

ORIGINAL: micvik

will the next version 0f 2.2 include the fix for issue of plays disapearing from groups when they are imported into another playbook?

None of my testing has reproduced that problem. If you can, please send me a playbook that shows the problem for you.

thanks

[jdhalfrack]

More of a selfish question:  will the update change the structure of the league database files?  I know I have taken my sweet ass time re-writting my editor (life has a funny way of getting in the way sometimes... sorry), but it is nearly done, and I'd hate to think it won't work for those people who have 2.5.  Just wondering.  Thanks for the reply!

JD

[elmerlee]

David:

I have no problem paying for whatever seems best included in 2.5. Without a doubt enough time has passed that you are due this.

Of course there is a "however". I spent a great deal of time in the past two weeks trying to input text files to build a real player data base. It is great that Max allows this. While trying to get this done I felt I better go back and play a few games again to to see if my formulas work.

So here is what happened in the course of two games (AI vs AI) ---------
1.Opening kickoff is a touchback. The ball is awarded to the KICKING team on the RECEIVING team 30 yard line.

2.Offensive team gets a five yard offside penalty against it on first down. They are quickly rewarded for a fist down in the team stats summary.

3.Offense scores a TD on a 45 yard pass. They DO NOT get credit for a FD (NFL PRO GAME)in the team stats.This item has been well documented for months but not fixed.

4.On the same play Offense gets double pass stat credit in team stats. Alo passer and receiver also get double credt. Yeah I know this has been reported but is it fixed.

5.Runners love to run in place behind blockers and tacklers rather than slide to an opening beside them where there is a whole. Do ball carriers look for an open spot or do they just blindly chug away?

6.When a ball carrier or receiver is tackled the ball is ALWAYS spoted at the point of his feet. This destroys the value of falling forward when tackled. It should be about at his feet when falling back but at the point of the ball (when knee hits) when falling forward. This creates a 1-2 yard difference each time. Certainly an increase in programming difficulty but very necessary to fix.

7.There are also a couple lesser things which slip my mid.

My point is this. These bugs(yes bugs) need fixed NOW and then I will be more than willing to pay for an update. Even up to full price.

Max football has come a long way in two years. But lets be honest it had a long way to come.

[Marauders]

1.Opening kickoff is a touchback. The ball is awarded to the KICKING team on the RECEIVING team 30 yard line.

I believe this is known.

3.Offense scores a TD on a 45 yard pass. They DO NOT get credit for a FD (NFL PRO GAME) in the team stats. This item has been well documented for months but not fixed.

A team should get credit for a first down on any score made from the ten yard line and out in both American pro and American college rules.

4.On the same play Offense gets double pass stat credit in team stats. Alo passer and receiver also get double credt. Yeah I know this has been reported but is it fixed.

This is known.

5.Runners love to run in place behind blockers and tacklers rather than slide to an opening beside them where there is a whole. Do ball carriers look for an open spot or do they just blindly chug away?

Ball carrier looks for an open hole. The problem here is that there is not a slow up and pick a hole animation.

6.When a ball carrier or receiver is tackled the ball is ALWAYS spoted at the point of his feet. This destroys the value of falling forward when tackled. It should be about at his feet when falling back but at the point of the ball (when knee hits) when falling forward. This creates a 1-2 yard difference each time. Certainly an increase in programming difficulty but very necessary to fix.

I have always thought the game tracked the ball. As I recall, there was a question about this long ago, but I don't have the definitive answer.

My point is this. These bugs(yes bugs) need fixed NOW and then I will be more than willing to pay for an update. Even up to full price.

I agree that a few items need to be cleaned up for 2.2, and there will be a patch. Most of these items have been looked at, and I know some have already been addressed. There are always beta team reports as well, so work is being done.

Max football has come a long way in two years. But lets be honest it had a long way to come.

From 1.2 to 2.2, I would agree. A lot has been done, and a lot has been upgraded.

As I have stated before, there are opportunity costs to anything done with a game program. We all want bugs fixed, and that is a priority. Many of us wanted better depth charts, better defenses, better stats, and other features that were added to the game with time and effort, and there is a point where we have to say that these added items deserve some added payment for the added value.

The early purchasers of Maximum Football were rewarded by not having to pay for any upgrades up to 2.2. Those who waited for 2.0 received a better game out of the box (or download). David and the Matrix Games staff want the 2.5 expansion pack to have value as well, so the thought was to update some features, add some features, and make it as easy as one can for the community to make the upgrade.

The one thing to keep in mind here is that the game will never be perfect. It will never be 100% to the rules of the NFC, NCAA, CFL, or any number of indoor rulesets. One cannot expect that and have all of the options that Maximum Football has. One should expect the programmer and beta team to do their best to make it so, and that, with some help from this community, is what David and the beta team are trying to do.

- Marauders

[elmerlee]

What exactly did you say here.

Most of your comments only repeat what I stated. "it is know" does not mean "it is fixed" for next release.

As far as the ball is concerned just LOOK AT A FEW PLAYS".

As far as your "first down comment" I stated the play was 45 yards. And your comment did what?

And so on.

[David Winter]

5.Runners love to run in place behind blockers and tacklers rather than slide to an opening beside them where there is a whole. Do ball carriers look for an open spot or do they just blindly chug away?

 
I can't say I've ever seen runners run in place, but ball carriers, while behind the LOS, run along the path provided to them when the play was designed. While behind LOS, players do not stray off the designated route.
 
If you are creating plays and the running path goes directly up the backside of a blocker, that's where the runner will go. Once the runner is across the LOS then he's on his own and can run around obstacles (blockers). So without having actually seen what it is you're describing, I can only suggest ensuring the running path of the player is going between blockers.
 
Thanks for the point list. Many look like they were previously reported and have been addressed.
 

 

[Marauders]

elmerlee asked: What exactly did you say here.

I stated that most of the issues have been reported, and some have already been addressed. I did not go back into the beta release notes to check.

Most of your comments only repeat what I stated. "it is know" does not mean "it is fixed" for next release.

It is known means it is on the list of items to look at or it has already been fixed.

As far as the ball is concerned just LOOK AT A FEW PLAYS".

Please do not shout in this forum, and please don't get short with me. As I stated, there was a question about this some time ago, but I don't recall the outcome of the conversation. It may have been a comment in passing or a side note.

I don't program the code, so this is an subject I must defer to David.

As far as your "first down comment" I stated the play was 45 yards. And your comment did what?

It was an agreement with your comment. I also added that it applied to the NCAA rules as well. It likely applies to the CFL too, but I didn't look it up.

As always, I appreciate any constructive feedback.

[David Winter]

So here is what happened in the course of two games (AI vs AI) ---------
1.Opening kickoff is a touchback. The ball is awarded to the KICKING team on the RECEIVING team 30 yard line.

 
How exactly is the touchback occurring? I'm getting the results as seen below...
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrFwgccX3TI  (not the greatest quality video in the world)
 
 
 
 

[David Winter]

ORIGINAL: jdhalfrack

More of a selfish question:  will the update change the structure of the league database files?  I know I have taken my sweet ass time re-writting my editor (life has a funny way of getting in the way sometimes... sorry), but it is nearly done, and I'd hate to think it won't work for those people who have 2.5.  Just wondering.  Thanks for the reply!

JD

There will be a couple of new tables added and a couple of new fields added to existing tables. These are required for the trade feature. The databases will be migrated forwards automatically.

Off the top of my head, I can not think of any changes I would make that would effect league play. As of today (May 19) there's nothing planned that would require a league reset.

If someone comes along with a feature request that's in high demand, and that change requires a league reset, well.. we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.. but right now, any changes should be invisible to the customer base.

[hack153]

david, do you think it will ever be possible to select multiple plays and put them into a group?  that would make playbook / profile creation a lot easier.
 
thank!!

[garysorrell]

I was always under the impression that a team did NOT get a 1st down if scoring a TD took them beyond the 1st down marker. Maybe I was mistaken.

4.On the same play Offense gets double pass stat credit in team stats. Alo passer and receiver also get double credt. Yeah I know this has been reported but is it fixed.

Im positive this has been fixed. Im not seeing it now.

6.When a ball carrier or receiver is tackled the ball is ALWAYS spoted at the point of his feet. This destroys the value of falling forward when tackled. It should be about at his feet when falling back but at the point of the ball (when knee hits) when falling forward. This creates a 1-2 yard difference each time. Certainly an increase in programming difficulty but very necessary to fix.

I see this quite a bit, but it doesnt bother me, because I know that the game doesnt necessarily work that way.
This I think is a matter of preference. I understand how it works in real life, but MaxFB is fairly straight forward. The ball was carried to X yard line by a player(RB, WR, whatever). The animation is, to some extent, window dressing. Regardless of what I see on screen, I understand the mark of the ball is what it is.

[Mykal]

quote:

4.On the same play Offense gets double pass stat credit in team stats. Alo passer and receiver also get double credt. Yeah I know this has been reported but is it fixed.

Im positive this has been fixed. Im not seeing it now.

Nope, not fixed yet, I still see it a good bit, although I have found switching of replays seems to eliminate the problem.

Mykal

[garysorrell]

I mean fixed in beta testing. Im not seeing it in the current build we have.

[Mykal]

ORIGINAL: garysorrell

I mean fixed in beta testing. Im not seeing it in the current build we have.

Kewl, sorry bro, thought you meant fixed for all of us.

Mykal