Quick Combat dilemna

[decaro]

For the few of us who haven't ventured into Detailed Combat, Quick Combat certainly moves the game along, but there's a price to pay when playing the Union vs. something called the Confederate defensive bonus (?).

Short of playing on the simplest levels, are there any other settings/options to help diminish this bonus?

[Conny D]

Afaik you can only diminish the defenders' morale bonus for detailed combat. By opening ACWConstants.txt and changing the value for 'DetailedCombat_DefenderMLBonus' to 0 f.e. Guess changing this parameter won't affect quick combat. No idea otherwise.

[decaro]

If that's true, then this game doesn't really "work" if it can't model combat correctly w/QC.

It looks like I'm back to the simpler levels, which is a shame.

I wonder what PBEM players do about QC? I can't believe they're using detailed combat.

[Erik Rutins]

Quick Combat works well for me in PBEM. What problem exactly are you having?

[decaro]

I don't do PBEM, but this is my problem w/QC from my first post:

"For the few of us who haven't ventured into Detailed Combat, Quick Combat certainly moves the game along, but there's a price to pay when playing the Union vs. something called the Confederate defensive bonus (?)."

Even at 2:1 odds w/the best rifles money can buy, the Union has a terrible disadvantage on unfriendly soil, at least at the 1st Sgt level.

[morganbj]

Detailed battle is a whole lot of fun.  Why not give it a try?  You can certainly win most of the battles there if you're at 2:1 odds.
 

[decaro]

Perhaps some day, but that's not the point; Detailed or Quick, both combat types should work well (though not necessarilly the same).

[Joram]

You have to constantly fight skirmishes to build up the morale of your troops and you will soon be able to win with your combined manpower/rifle/morale advantage.   But it takes awhile.  Second, you need to really outthink the computer strategically and drain his troops through attrition and cutting out their supply lines.  I've cut off whole armies when the AI gets a little bit too careless.   I've been able to win as Union using QC only but not necessarily following purely historical strategies. 

[moose1999]

Numbers and rifles alone won't break the CSA - especially in the east in the first years of the war.
Your units need to increase their morale through combat (i.e. defeats) and training.
And you need to buy them some attributes too.
Often I'm much more successful and fight a lot more battles in the west, so after the first year I usually have a handful of well-trained divisions out there and I can then move these to the east.
Or strike at the soft belly of the CSA through Kentucky, forcing the AI to divert forces from either the Mississippi or the East Coast.
Usually he won't cut down his forces in the east, but that just gives me an easier time on the mississippi - not a bad tradeoff.

[decaro]

ORIGINAL: Joram

You have to constantly fight skirmishes to build up the morale of your troops and you will soon be able to win with your combined manpower/rifle/morale advantage.   But it takes awhile. 

This usu. takes too long; before I realize it, it's 1865, yet another Confederate bonus.

ORIGINAL: Joram
Second, you need to really outthink the computer strategically and drain his troops through attrition and cutting out their supply lines.  I've cut off whole armies when the AI gets a little bit too careless.   I've been able to win as Union using QC only but not necessarily following purely historical strategies. 

Anaconda Plan? Again, I run out of time as I slowly work my way South along the River. As for draining his troops, if I go for Emancipation -- arguably the whole point of the Civil War -- the AI gets new units from everywhere.

[decaro]

ORIGINAL: briny_norman

...Your units need to increase their morale through combat (i.e. defeats) and training.
And you need to buy them some attributes too.

Those defeats decrease my National Will, from which I never seem to recover.
Exactly which attributes do you buy? Do you buy them for both options, i.e., sharpshooters X 2?

[Joram]

Well, not necessarily the anaconda plan as it was envisioned but yes, the end result is the same.   You pretty much have to make some probing assaults through naval invasions to draw off some of the confederate forces.  They are especially skittish about New Orleans (rightfully so as it has some great industry) and if you're lucky you can reduce the forts there before they draw enough forces to kick you out.  If they go after your invasion full bore, then you usually would have enough troops out west to beat up on the remnants.  Engineers and artillery are a must to quickly siege places.  Out west you have your gunboats as useful artillery pieces, add a couple engineers too and you should go through the forts rather quickly.

[Erik Rutins]

If you're playing with the Advanced rules, the Union starts off with some big disadvantages in both detailed and quick combat. You need to overcome those before you can start beating the CSA in offensive battles. For Quick Combat:

- Build plenty of Academies early on to train up your Command Staff Ratings
- Never start a fight unless all your units are fully supplied AND have good disposition
- Look in the Appendices and choose research upgrades based on their effect on QC
- Get rid of containers with ratings that are abysmal and build new ones
- Make sure you create a Division/Corps/Army hierarcy ASAP with the best Army and Corp containers you can build so that they start training each other up
- Use the best leaders you can find
- Never force march unless you have to
- Don't attack the CSA on good defensive terrain for them if you can avoid it
- Move slowly and strategically as you advance, fortify EVERYTHING you take with a Level 1 Fort (can be built in 1 turn) to give yourself a defensive bonus when the CSA counter-attacks.
- Use amphibous attacks to keep the CSA from being able to concentrate everything on your land armies, make them defend their coastline as well.
- Read the QC chapter and re-read it a few times to really understand how the various effects work. Guns don't increase your chance of winning (salvo/countersalvo bonus), they just increase the casualties you cause.
- Salvo and Counter-Salvo bonuses are the key as they also determine how often you end up taking/causing morale checks, which ends up winning the battle
- Build plenty of artillery to cause extra casualties and knock your opponent's quality down over time
- Try to conserve your forces, look for small fights early on that can gain you some experience at relatively low risk

Regards,

- Erik

[decaro]

Thanks guys, I hope these tips work for me as I don't want to go back to the lesser levels.

[moose1999]

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

ORIGINAL: briny_norman

...Your units need to increase their morale through combat (i.e. defeats) and training.
And you need to buy them some attributes too.

Those defeats decrease my National Will, from which I never seem to recover.
Exactly which attributes do you buy? Do you buy them for both options, i.e., sharpshooters X 2?

Well, not all attributes are worth doubling up - but I personally find the sharpshooter ability worth it (when playing detailed battles, anyway) - it gives me a unit that I can use to snipe at generals and artillery, which is good as the rebs have a lot of great generals and a couple of powerful artillery units in the east too.
As Eric said, try to pick smaller battles in the beginning (these are easier to come by in the west) and try to fight in terrain that doesn't favor your enemy too much. Best thing would be to force him into fighting an offensive battle against you on terrain that favors the defender (e.g. many forts).
I often try to advance into an empty province and then hope the CSA will attack me there - thereby negating their defence bonus.

[Mad Russian]

ORIGINAL: briny_norman

I often try to advance into an empty province and then hope the CSA will attack me there - thereby negating their defence bonus.

You don't negate the enemy bonus if that empty province is enemy owned. In QC the owning side of the province is always the defender if I understand it correctly.

Good Hunting.

MR

[moose1999]

My memory might fail me here (I'm getting old...) but it is my recollection that the defense bonus goes away if you occupy a province - i.e. take all forts and cities in the province and make the province turn to your colour.
You don't have to conquer the whole state, as I remember it.
So if you move into an empty province (without forts, cities or enemy units) the province will be yours in the next turn and the enemy won't have the defense bonus when he counterattacks - unless he moves into the province on the very same turn you do.
That's what makes forts so usefull - they give you at least one turn (usually more) to attack an invading enemy and still retain your defense bonus.
Makes the south so very difficult to beat in some provinces in the east and on the Mississippi as they contain multiple (and powerful) forts, so the defense bonus is very difficult and time-consuming to get rid of.
At least that's how I remember it... [;)]

[Erik Rutins]

ORIGINAL: briny_norman
My memory might fail me here (I'm getting old...) but it is my recollection that the defense bonus goes away if you occupy a province - i.e. take all forts and cities in the province and make the province turn to your colour.
You don't have to conquer the whole state, as I remember it.

That's correct.

So if you move into an empty province (without forts, cities or enemy units) the province will be yours in the next turn and the enemy won't have the defense bonus when he counterattacks - unless he moves into the province on the very same turn you do.

Right.

That's what makes forts so usefull - they give you at least one turn (usually more) to attack an invading enemy and still retain your defense bonus.

Yep - move in and build a Level 1 Fort before they can counter-attack.

Makes the south so very difficult to beat in some provinces in the east and on the Mississippi as they contain multiple (and powerful) forts, so the defense bonus is very difficult and time-consuming to get rid of.
At least that's how I remember it... [;)]

Indeed, if well-garrisoned, some of these are almost invulnerable, but it becomes hard for the South to garrison everything as time goes on.

[GShock]

I think i found the best values for a really challenge playing 1861 campaign as CSA at standard level of difficulty but giving +1 power to USA.

The ai is very aggressive and beats the defenses, runners get caught frequently and you're always on the gambling with impressment. To the top of it, since the AI is so aggressive, it does, for the first time since i play FoF, attack and take the whole mississipi.

[Mad Russian]

ORIGINAL: briny_norman

My memory might fail me here (I'm getting old...) but it is my recollection that the defense bonus goes away if you occupy a province - i.e. take all forts and cities in the province and make the province turn to your colour.
You don't have to conquer the whole state, as I remember it.
So if you move into an empty province (without forts, cities or enemy units) the province will be yours in the next turn and the enemy won't have the defense bonus when he counterattacks - unless he moves into the province on the very same turn you do.
That's what makes forts so usefull - they give you at least one turn (usually more) to attack an invading enemy and still retain your defense bonus.
Makes the south so very difficult to beat in some provinces in the east and on the Mississippi as they contain multiple (and powerful) forts, so the defense bonus is very difficult and time-consuming to get rid of.
At least that's how I remember it... [;)]

That's my understanding as well.

Whoever owns the province is the defender. No matter how long you've been sitting there.

Good Hunting.

MR