Need some advice!

[NorthStar]

OK. I'm having some trouble in my first larger scale game, and I'm looking form some advice (or at least some validation that I'm doing as well as I can be).

I'm playing the Green Hell scenario, 10/1/42 though 12/31/42, as the allies with AI set to -- cough, cough, -- easy. :rolleyes: Japanese sub doctrine is historical. This scenario covers operations in both NG and the Solomons. It is currently 10/16.

Basically, I'm in good shape in NG. There are occasional raids on PM and Gila Gila, but nothing particularly damaging. I have about 40k infantry moving down the Kodoka Trail to Buna, which should be adequate to handle the garrison (I hope).

The Solomons, however are another story! The AI has two Bombardment TF's with two BB's each bombarding Lunga on a fairly regular basis. There is a carrier TF lurking noth of Lunga with two CV's and a CVL. To counter this, I have a single CV (the Hornet) and one BB. Under these circumstances, it seems suicidal to try to contest either the bombardments or the Carriers. I had about twenty PT boats in Lunga, which have been decimated (down to about eight) although they did score two torpedo hits on the Kongo, one on another BB, and one on the CA Haruna (along with a lot of .5" and 20 mm hits, but I doubt these have done much). I have managed to torpedo a few DD's and AK's with my subs (I currnely have about five stationed throughout The Slot) with no confirmed sinkings. This has cost me one S Boat sunk and a Fleet boat damaged.

So far, the Carriers have decimated a surface TF on the way to NG, a replenishment group south of Lunga, and a mining group in the Slot. Lunga is completely shut down, due to supply shortages, so its air power is not a factor.

In about five days, I will get the Saratoga and another BB (Washington, I think), wich will get me a bit closer to parity. I'm thinking my best bet is to stage some bombardment runs on Buna, and see if I can't draw the carriers into LBA range of PM. If I time it right and have my carriers on station at the same tim, I can hopefully nail the carriers, and open up some room to maneuver. If it doesn't work, hopefully I can at least nail some of the barges supplying Buna.

In that case, my only apparant option would be to try a massive supply run into Lunga (which will be more effective now that I realized I can use AP's to carry supplies, not just troops -- but that's why I'm playing on easy ). If I can get some LBA in Lunga up and running, I can avoid a pure Carrier engagement East or South of the Solomons which I expect I would come out the worse from (considering how my aircraft have performed so far!:mad: )

Or I suppose, I could continue with sub operations, try to mine some more of the slot (although I only have one DM left of the original two), use the carriers to cover the resupply, and hope that LBA from Lunga can eventually catch the carriers.

And I still don't know how to conter the bombardment forces! With my two BB's, I could match up well with either force individually -- especially if I come up agains the Kongo -- but they have been know to show up on the same night! And in any event, even if I take the carriers out, Rabal air can reach me there, and they are hitting me every few days with raids consisting of 30-40 bombers with 100+(:eek: ) escorts. Any ships in Lunga harbor are likely to be toast if they hang around for more than a few days.

Any input would be helpful here. Thanks in advance

[Burch]

Don't forget that your subs can lay mines!
Do you have any Dakotas flying supplies in to Lunga?
Have you tried rotating fighter groups in and out of Lunga to help with morale and fatigue?
Do you have SBD's on Lunga? Just one group will give you the possibility of a strike on any bombardment elements that lag due to mine damage or surface engagement.
You might also try slipping your carrier TF (once you have 2 carriers) up beneath Lunga with one carrier providing LR CAP and the others CAP set at 80-90% but be sure the jap carriers aren't in the slot at the time:eek: Loading up Lungas air defence for a day or two could manage to disrupt their strikes for several days if enough planes are shot down or damaged.

[NorthStar]

1) I haven't tried to use subs for minelaying. I should. Especially since I have a damaged sub or two floating around (pun intended) which I wouldn't want to risk in combat, but which should be OK to use for this.

2) Yes. Unfortunately, the Dakotas can't reach Lunga for Noumea, so I have two groups ferrrying supplies from Noumea to Wau (?) and two groups from Wau to Lunga. This might be over conservative on my part.

3) Right now, supplies are the problem, not the condition of the groups. But in general, a good suggestion.

4) Yes, but so far they have been monumentally ineffective. They have only made a single successful sortie (after the Konga hit a mine) and managed a single hit with a 500 lb bomb. It destroyed a 5" gun turret, but did not penetrate, so I assume it did no significant damage.

5) I want to try to avoid a pure carrier engagement unless the AI won't give me a better option.

6) Again, supplies are what are killing me at Lunga. Now that it has suddenly dawned on me that APs can be used to carry supplies as well as AKs, I think I can correct that for at least a week or so, and put 3, 4, 6 and possibly five into operation.

Any benifit in temporarily relocating the CAG's to Lunga to beef up its air power? The CAG's will get torn up more than likely, but at least Lunga is unsinkable!

By the way, I've also relocated a marine fighter squadron to the Hornet to beef up its protection. I'm still under the 110% capacity, so there should be no drawbacks to this, right?

[von Murrin]

This may take some time, but it's worth it. How many Seabee units do you have at Noumea? You could run them and a few base force units to Irau (ESE tip of San Cristobal).

Irau can be built to a size 4 airfield, and it's within F4 range of Lunga. If you feel it may be too much of a risk, send them in by APD. The real advantage here is that you can base a decent amount of F4's and P40's (from Moresby) there and use them to fly LRCAP over your CV's. All other things being equal, that should give you enough of an edge to risk a CV engagement and come out the better.

Also, at level 4, the airfield will be capable of supporting level bombers, of which your B17's can reach Shortland. Since Shortland is likely where the bombardment groups are staging out of, you can recon for them, and make sure that is indeed the case. If so, you can set your 17's to port or naval attack at 1000 feet as appropriate. They'll take some heavy losses, but it may just be enough to sink or send back for repair the major assets being used against Lunga.

Good luck in your little war whatever you do!

[Point Luck]

I would to confirm the following. When selecting mine warfare vessels the only ships that can lay mines are MSW, ML, and Subs? (and maybe a few other ship types) The real question pertains to the capabilities of the ship laying mines. Although these ships are listed as mine warfare vessels, only units that indicate that they have mines listed as part of their armament, are really the only vessels capable of laying mines (True or False). I have found very few MSW’s listing mines as part of their armament and I have not found any subs listing mines on board. I have read the manual and if this is defined I must have missed it in the manual (couple of times apparently )

[von Murrin]

Are the only type of craft that can lay mines, IIRC.

Maybe I-Boats, too? Haven't tried those.

[Burch]

With subs you have to form new task force with sub minelaying your mission then choose a sub in port. A message will appear for most boats saying that MK 10 mines have been loaded. There are a couple of subs that loadout MK 12 or 16 mines, these subs don't display a message when chosen but a look at their loadout after task force formation shows the mines present. Another minelaying note with subs, when they return from a mission they must be disbanded and reformed, as they won't load mines again otherwise.

In regards to supply, I set Cs task forces supplying Luganville with supplies and fuel from the outset, when I get Lunga I then move the Dakotas (at least 3 squadrons) there and fly in supplies this way they carry a larger load due to the shorter distance.

The use of CAG's for temporary LR CAP over Lunga is only to catch a couple of incoming strikes with a large CAP (Navy pilots in F4's will do much better than those groups on Lunga, their Exp is usually higher) This will hopefully destroy or damge several enemy planes and cost them some experienced pilots. I have used this for Lunga, Gili Gili and PM with very good results. Just remember not to stay there more than a turn or two at most so you avoid a CV v CV battle.

[NorthStar]

A number of good ideas. Which of course is why I asked!

von Murrin, very interesting idea for increasing the protection of Lunga. I keep forgeting I can create bases from whole cloth, as it were. Any idea how long it would take to get to a level two or so air field? If we're talking two or three weeks, it would probably be worth it. Too much longer than that, and I suspect the whole situation will shake itself out one way or the other before it comes on line. I may start it anyway though, just to get a feel for base building for future games.

Point Luck, I'm 90% sure you are correct -- only ships that show mines as part of its loadout can lay them. The impression I have got from other threads is that in general, MSWs and DMSs, can't lay mines: they are for sweeping only. MLs, DMs, and Subs (at least Allied S and Fleet Boats) are the only vessels that can.

Burch, the funny thing is the attacks that are hitting Lunga! For example, last night I got hit with a combined bomber raid from Rabal and the CVs that had 100 Zeros escorting 15 bombers! This seems like a ridiculously high ratio, especially since I can only get about 6-10 tired, low morale F4Fs in the air against them. And it would take an awful lot of CVs and extra bases for me to come close to matching that escort.

Still, they can hit me with as many of this type of raid as they like. That few bombers can't do any real damage, and the AI has got to be losing more than a few of the fighters just through operational accidents -- and I'll take everything I can get!

[panda124c]

B-17s can fly supply missions this will help since you should have 2-3 B-17 groups in the area.
Develope Lugonville (I think that's right) this has an Airfield (6) and a Port (5) IIRC and is within F4 and SBD range of Lunga

[Burch]

pbear,
I forgot about the B-17s. I'm not sure but the supply runs might up their experience as well. This would be an added bonus early on when there isn't anything they can bomb from the early bases:)

[Burch]

NorthStar,
I too have seen these raids on both Lunga and PM 60-120 fighters escorting as few as 4 bombers:eek:
The point is not to match the escorts 1-1 it is to throw up a large unexpected resistance, you can afford the loss in planes and pilots while the Japanese can't;)

[von Murrin]

Northstar,

If you get something like 3-4 Seabee and/or EAB units into Irau, you could probably build the airfield to level 4 in under a month.

As to absurd escorts, enough will be sent to counter your possible CAP by at least 1:2. Also, they may be flying sweep missions alongside the bombing raids. If strikes are so coordinated, you won't be able to tell the difference.

Luganville is within 17 range of Lunga, but not F4 unless it's a transfer you're thinking of. That's the major reason for building up Irau, as it's just six hexes out, well within F4 CAP range.

[Point Luck]

Photo recon works fine I have planes fly over and take pictures but I never seem to get any real intel. I there somewhere in the game that I can review the results of the photo recon?

[von Murrin]

Originally posted by Point Luck
Photo recon works fine I have planes fly over and take pictures but I never seem to get any real intel. I there somewhere in the game that I can review the results of the photo recon?

What are you looking for?

If you hold the currsor over the base after you recon, you'll be able to get info on type and number of planes, as well as port and airfield damage.

If you hold it over the LCU icon, you'll get an estimate on type and number of units, as well as numbers, guns, and vehicles if there aren't too many units.

[Point Luck]

(If you hold it over the LCU icon, you'll get an estimate on type and number of units, as well as numbers, guns, and vehicles if there aren't too many units.)


THANKS Thats the info I was looking for

[Drex]

you could still challenge their bombardment force with your two BBs reinforced with 3-4 CAs and of course 8 or more DDs but use Admiral Lee for command. I did this very thing and ran into the two bombardment TFs ,each with 2 BBs, and still Lee decimated both of them with no harm to his BBs. This double action stopped the Bombardments period. Since this was a night action the carriers never came into play. Its a gamble but how else can you stop the nightly intrusions.

[NorthStar]

Still lots of good information.

I have used B-17's in previous games to carry supplies, I'm just not sure how effective it is. Does anyone know how to convert the capacity number (I think that's what it's called) in the database into the approximate supply capacity?

I currently have a single group of Seebees on their way to Irua. Rather than risk a whole bunch of Engieers if the carriers show up, I figured I'd get one in now, try to get a level 1 aristrip built, and then bring more in using Dakotas. (I really love transporting troops by air!)

Yet another thing to make me feel stupid. Tulagi is already develped, although I'm not certain to what level, and it still has supplies. If its large enough, I'm thinking of putting some level bombers there to attack ships in Shortland harbor. Even if it's only a level 2 or 3, I think I'll base some there for a few days and take some operational losses in the attempt to do some damage. In any case, I shold transfer some SBDs and TBFs from Lunga to Tulagi, and get them operational. The only down side is that the AI has been ignoring Tulagi so far, which will probably change once he starts seeing airstikes from there. Still, that will help take some pressure off Lunga too.

Also, looks like the AI is down to three BBs now, and has them in a single group, instead of two groups with two BBs. The Konga was hit by two torpedos, a mine, and a 500 lbs bomb (non-penetrating), which I suspect was not enough to sink her (unless the Japanese Damage Control Parties had some problems) but has probably sent her back to Truk for repairs.

Once I successfully re-suply Lunga, I am strongly considering breaking off a large part of the Carrier Escorts (which include both BB's and 4-6 CAs) and try to intercept the Bombardment force. The problem is, if I let them sit in wait in Lunga, they are exposed to attack from Shortland and Rabal, and I'm not sure I can put up enough CAP (even if I keep the carriers on station) to break up the strikes and protect them. I've considered trying to run in and out at night just like the Bombardment group, but I suspect the odds of them being there at the right time are slim.

Anybody have any suggestions for sinking barges? The AI has a lot of them runing in the area between New Britain and NG, but I am having very little success interdicting them with the Level Bombers in PM and Gili Gili. Even when the bombers attack them (which appears to be rarely) they don't seem to be able to hit them. Do I need to set altitudes low for this kind of operation? I'm moving some SBDs to PM in the hopes they will be better at barge attacks, but that's all I can think of.

[von Murrin]

The airfield on Tulagi has a max size of 3. That means level bombers will be restricted to normal range with an extended range bombload. Operational losses will also be higher. Don't do it unless you really think it's worth it.

Dakotas can't transport vehicles, and that's precisely why you use Seabees. Use your APD's in a fast transport group. If you make your Irau runs from Luganville, their limited capacity won't hinder you so much.

The ultimate barge killer is the PT, and Tulagi is the perfect base for them. Failing that, P-39's and P-400's set to naval attack work pretty well, too.

Good to hear things are going better.

[NorthStar]

Good point about the vehicles. Forgot about that completely.

I have to use regular APs for the Irau run (I think) as I only have one APD in theater right now, with a second on its way from Pearl. That would take six trips (three if I wait for the second APD) to get the SeaBees over, which seems too long.

I have has some success with PTs against barges (and also against capital ships, actually, but at high cost to the PT crews), running out of Lunga. My problem now is in PM, and I've only got two more PTs available right now.

Is a low altitude setting helpful against the barges, or do the planes drop down as required?

[von Murrin]

Ah, I see. If you've lost some APD's, you can always get something like 8 of those 1500 capacity AP's and AK's, and make a TF with that (DD's too, of course). If you only load one unit at a time, you should be able to unload in a day or two at most. Just don't stick around to unload the supplies if you're worried they might get hit by CV's. Actually, you could use your 1 remaining APD as a CS convoy to Irau.

Use those P-39's at PM for barge busting. If they won't attack, see if you can't get an engineer and a base force unit into Wau. Then, all you need to do is ferry supplies in by Dakota, and move the P-39's and P-400's in. You don't have to toy with the altitude for fighter-bombers, but for level bombers, you have to set them for 100 ft. B-25J's and Havocs come to mind as good at this. If you don't have any 25J's yet, you will once you get near and into '43.

Keep us updated.