Rules Clarification List

[Shannon V. OKeets]

I am closing in on fully understanding all the possible sequences of events for instigating naval movement. Due solely to the ablity of players to intercept naval movement, a backlog of naval moves can accumulate, which in programming terms is a push down stack. That's very easy to program and once understood at this abstract level, it's also easy to think about while writing related code.

But I have one question about naval interceptions.

Suppose a Japanese naval group moves into a sea area occupied by both the US and CW, both of whom are at war with Japan. Do both the US and CW players get an opportunity to intercept (this is how I read the rules), or should the decision be given to one player to decide on behalf of his side (this is how it was coded in CWIF)?

[Froonp]

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

I am closing in on fully understanding all the possible sequences of events for instigating naval movement. Due solely to the ablity of players to intercept naval movement, a backlog of naval moves can accumulate, which in programming terms is a push down stack. That's very easy to program and once understood at this abstract level, it's also easy to think about while writing related code.

But I have one question about naval interceptions.

Suppose a Japanese naval group moves into a sea area occupied by both the US and CW, both of whom are at war with Japan. Do both the US and CW players get an opportunity to intercept (this is how I read the rules), or should the decision be given to one player to decide on behalf of his side (this is how it was coded in CWIF)?

I think that this is moot as rule says :
********************************
As long as that face-down unit remains in the sea-box, you can make further interception attempts in that sea area against other task forces during the same impulse without having to turn over another unit. If that unit is in the sea-box during naval combat, it also allows you to attempt to start a naval combat there without having to turn another unit face-down (see 11.6). If the face-down unit aborts or is destroyed, you would have to turn over another unit to make another interception attempt or to start a combat in that sea area.
********************************

In that, what makes me think that it is moot is that it says "against other task forces during the same impulse without having to turn over another unit". So even if after the US have tried to intercept, the CW wants to intercept too, he will only be able to intecept another TF.
I understand it that there is only 1 intercept attempt per sea area per side (Allies / Axis), in the same way as there is only 1 naval combat attempt per sea area (after the moves) per side (Allies OR Axis), there is not even one per side.

Also, it says :
********************************
Interception attempt fails
If the interception attempt fails, the moving force continues as if nothing had happened.
********************************

So, if the interception fail, no one get the opportunity to intercept it again, the "moving force continues as if nothing had happened".

The End of interception part also says that after the fight is over, the moving TF resumes moving.

So the answer is : The decision be given to one player to decide on behalf of his side.

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: Froonp

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

I am closing in on fully understanding all the possible sequences of events for instigating naval movement. Due solely to the ablity of players to intercept naval movement, a backlog of naval moves can accumulate, which in programming terms is a push down stack. That's very easy to program and once understood at this abstract level, it's also easy to think about while writing related code.

But I have one question about naval interceptions.

Suppose a Japanese naval group moves into a sea area occupied by both the US and CW, both of whom are at war with Japan. Do both the US and CW players get an opportunity to intercept (this is how I read the rules), or should the decision be given to one player to decide on behalf of his side (this is how it was coded in CWIF)?

I think that this is moot as rule says :
********************************
As long as that face-down unit remains in the sea-box, you can make further interception attempts in that sea area against other task forces during the same impulse without having to turn over another unit. If that unit is in the sea-box during naval combat, it also allows you to attempt to start a naval combat there without having to turn another unit face-down (see 11.6). If the face-down unit aborts or is destroyed, you would have to turn over another unit to make another interception attempt or to start a combat in that sea area.
********************************

In that, what makes me think that it is moot is that it says "against other task forces during the same impulse without having to turn over another unit". So even if after the US have tried to intercept, the CW wants to intercept too, he will only be able to intecept another TF.
I understand it that there is only 1 intercept attempt per sea area per side (Allies / Axis), in the same way as there is only 1 naval combat attempt per sea area (after the moves) per side (Allies OR Axis), there is not even one per side.

Also, it says :
********************************
Interception attempt fails
If the interception attempt fails, the moving force continues as if nothing had happened.
********************************

So, if the interception fail, no one get the opportunity to intercept it again, the "moving force continues as if nothing had happened".

The End of interception part also says that after the fight is over, the moving TF resumes moving.

So the answer is : The decision be given to one player to decide on behalf of his side.

The problem that might arise is the US player saying he wants to intercept using one of the CW units[;)].

I am going to let all major powers that could intercept do so. If they all decline, then so be it. If one of them says Yes, then I'll ignore what the others might have to say. The major power that says Yes has to use one of his units to perform the interception.

This might seem minor, and is irrelevant when one player plays all the major powers on a side, but I am allowing for 6 players in a game. So it might come up.

[Froonp]

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
The problem that might arise is the US player saying he wants to intercept using one of the CW units[;)].

I am going to let all major powers that could intercept do so. If they all decline, then so be it. If one of them says Yes, then I'll ignore what the others might have to say. The major power that says Yes has to use one of his units to perform the interception.

This might seem minor, and is irrelevant when one player plays all the major powers on a side, but I am allowing for 6 players in a game. So it might come up.

I think it is a good solution.
Maybe have a single prompt for intercept for each player, and if there is only one player, only one prompt ? With Flags in the dialog (or in the game's Main form) to help know who is deciding.

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: Froonp

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
The problem that might arise is the US player saying he wants to intercept using one of the CW units[;)].

I am going to let all major powers that could intercept do so. If they all decline, then so be it. If one of them says Yes, then I'll ignore what the others might have to say. The major power that says Yes has to use one of his units to perform the interception.

This might seem minor, and is irrelevant when one player plays all the major powers on a side, but I am allowing for 6 players in a game. So it might come up.

I think it is a good solution.
Maybe have a single prompt for intercept for each player, and if there is only one player, only one prompt ? With Flags in the dialog (or in the game's Main form) to help know who is deciding.

Yes.

[Froonp]

I wanted to pass to you all the information that the latest version of the FAQ has been published to the ADG's website :
http://www.a-d-g.com.au/download/WiFFE_ ... v_2008.pdf

Here is also a list of changes to the FAQ file since the start.
http://pagesperso-orange.fr/froon/WiF/W ... v_2008.txt

Here is the Sum up of the changes since Version 1.1 (16 Aug. 2008) :
- 7 questions added (Q11.16-29, Q13.6-9, Q13.7-23, Q14.2-1, Q18.1-1, Q22.4-19, Q22.4-50),
- 1 question with a sub question added (Q22.4-31),
- 1 modified answer (Q18.2-11) without changed meaning.
- 0 modified answer with changed meaning.

[Shannon V. OKeets]

I am down deep in the minutiae of returning carrier air units to carriers.

Carrier air units return to carriers from two places in the sequence of play:
1 - from an air mission that they flew over land (e.g., a ground strike), and
2 - from a naval air combat.

If the air unit is aborted due to a combat result, it (one unit) is immediately returned to a carrier. However, when an air mission is completed, or a naval combat round concludes, there can be multiple air units returning to carriers simultaneously.

My question is: How much leeway does the owning player have in deciding which carrier an air unit returns to?

Here are some possibilities:

a - a carrier air unit must return to the carrier from which it flew the mission; if that carrier was destroyed during the naval air combat, the carrier air unit is destroyed.

b - a carrier air unit must return to the carrier from which it flew the mission, unless that carrier was destroyed during the naval air combat; in which case it can return to any carrier in the same sea box section.

c - a carrier air unit must return to the carrier from which it flew the mission, unless that carrier was destroyed during the naval air combat; in which case it can return to any carrier in the same sea area (regardles of sea box section).

d - a carrier air unit can return to any carrier in the same sea box section from which it flew its mission.

e - a carrier air unit can return to any carrier in the same sea area from which it flew its mission (regardless of sea box section).

[lomyrin]

I read the rules as the case 'd ' above.  RAW mentions CV planes returning to different carriers in the same seabox section as a rebase mission, and I see that as no different from any plane rebasing (returning to base) after a mission has been flown.
 
This can become pretty complicated if it is not allowed, perticularly if the 2 planes per CV option is on.
 
Lars 

[Froonp]

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

I am down deep in the minutiae of returning carrier air units to carriers.

Carrier air units return to carriers from two places in the sequence of play:
1 - from an air mission that they flew over land (e.g., a ground strike), and
2 - from a naval air combat.

If the air unit is aborted due to a combat result, it (one unit) is immediately returned to a carrier. However, when an air mission is completed, or a naval combat round concludes, there can be multiple air units returning to carriers simultaneously.

My question is: How much leeway does the owning player have in deciding which carrier an air unit returns to?

Here are some possibilities:

a - a carrier air unit must return to the carrier from which it flew the mission; if that carrier was destroyed during the naval air combat, the carrier air unit is destroyed.

b - a carrier air unit must return to the carrier from which it flew the mission, unless that carrier was destroyed during the naval air combat; in which case it can return to any carrier in the same sea box section.

c - a carrier air unit must return to the carrier from which it flew the mission, unless that carrier was destroyed during the naval air combat; in which case it can return to any carrier in the same sea area (regardles of sea box section).

d - a carrier air unit can return to any carrier in the same sea box section from which it flew its mission.

e - a carrier air unit can return to any carrier in the same sea area from which it flew its mission (regardless of sea box section).

14.2 states that :
"Carrier planes return to the sea-box section they flew from. "

And 14.4.1 says that
"When a carrier plane that flew from a CV returns to base, it must return to a CV it can fit on in the same sea box section it flew from. It can’t return to another major power’s CV. If there is no CV it can return to, it is destroyed (PiF option 28: any pilot is destroyed too)."

So it means the answer is d.

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: Froonp

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

I am down deep in the minutiae of returning carrier air units to carriers.

Carrier air units return to carriers from two places in the sequence of play:
1 - from an air mission that they flew over land (e.g., a ground strike), and
2 - from a naval air combat.

If the air unit is aborted due to a combat result, it (one unit) is immediately returned to a carrier. However, when an air mission is completed, or a naval combat round concludes, there can be multiple air units returning to carriers simultaneously.

My question is: How much leeway does the owning player have in deciding which carrier an air unit returns to?

Here are some possibilities:

a - a carrier air unit must return to the carrier from which it flew the mission; if that carrier was destroyed during the naval air combat, the carrier air unit is destroyed.

b - a carrier air unit must return to the carrier from which it flew the mission, unless that carrier was destroyed during the naval air combat; in which case it can return to any carrier in the same sea box section.

c - a carrier air unit must return to the carrier from which it flew the mission, unless that carrier was destroyed during the naval air combat; in which case it can return to any carrier in the same sea area (regardles of sea box section).

d - a carrier air unit can return to any carrier in the same sea box section from which it flew its mission.

e - a carrier air unit can return to any carrier in the same sea area from which it flew its mission (regardless of sea box section).

14.2 states that :
"Carrier planes return to the sea-box section they flew from. "

And 14.4.1 says that
"When a carrier plane that flew from a CV returns to base, it must return to a CV it can fit on in the same sea box section it flew from. It can’t return to another major power’s CV. If there is no CV it can return to, it is destroyed (PiF option 28: any pilot is destroyed too)."

So it means the answer is d.

Thanks.

[Froonp]

A new version of the FAQ for WiF FE is available since yesterday at ADG's website. This is version 1.3.
http://www.a-d-g.com.au/download/WiFFE_ ... l_2009.pdf
It goes from 389 to 411 questions.
The new or modified questions are highlighted by a tan background color that you can't miss. There is also at the last page (40) a short history of the file, that lists the new question numbers.

[micheljq]

ORIGINAL: Froonp

A new version of the FAQ for WiF FE is available since yesterday at ADG's website. This is version 1.3.
http://www.a-d-g.com.au/download/WiFFE_ ... l_2009.pdf
It goes from 389 to 411 questions.
The new or modified questions are highlighted by a tan background color that you can't miss. There is also at the last page (40) a short history of the file, that lists the new question numbers.

Great thanks a lot.