CMx1 vs PCK

[PoorOldSpike]

Geordie quote- you were never exonerated for your cheating at the Blitz, you were admonished..
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Ha ha ha Jack, if that was true tell us why I haven't been thrown out of the club?
After all, they threw you out a while back for something or other didn't they?..

[Erik Rutins]

Ok, this thread has gone way off topic. This forum is not the place to discuss personal business like this that clearly belongs elsewhere. If you want to discuss things involving Blitz internal matters, discuss it at the Blitz.

Everyone else, please try to keep this on topic and please recall that this is meant as a civil and constructive compare/contrast thread for CM and PCK, nothing more.

If this discussion continues on its course, I will have to lock this thread, which I would rather not have to do.

Regards,

- Erik

[PoorOldSpike]

To get back on topic- When Matrix put me on their Press Reviewers List a few months ago and sent me free games I swore to myself they'd have my total loyalty and support and I did  big reviews of PCK around the wargaming community including many screenshots such as these at Blitz- 

http://www.theblitz.org/message_boards/ ... ?tid=47338

But inevitably (as with any game) there were one or two things I didn't like and said so, which immediately drew a response of childish name-calling from some PCK fans as we've seen.

PS- Sorry guys, but if you're looking for reviewers who only say nice things, you're gonna have ter get yerself another boy..

[Geordie]

ORIGINAL: Poor Old Spike

To get back on topic- When Matrix put me on their Press Reviewers List a few months ago and sent me free games I swore to myself they'd have my total loyalty and support and I did  big reviews of PCK around the wargaming community including many screenshots such as these at Blitz- 

http://www.theblitz.org/message_boards/ ... ?tid=47338

But inevitably (as with any game) there were one or two things I didn't like and said so, which immediately drew a response of childish name-calling from some PCK fans as we've seen.

PS- Sorry guys, but if you're looking for reviewers who only say nice things, you're gonna have ter get yerself another boy..

To my knowledge, your not a member of the press and never have been. I also seemed to miss the bit where you reviewed the game fully, do you have a link?

Compared to CM, PZC is a different beast, sure a T-34 has to look like er, a T-34, but thats about it in comparison for me. Some things I like in CM. The full minute turn as opposed to an orders and reaction turn phase. I can get used to that though. Some things I like better in PZC, for instance I think the armour is modelled better.

Ive played over a thousand CM games versus another human and about 2 PZC games. Im sure that when Ive played many more PZC games I will be able to tell you a lot more about the game.

If your only fret here is a 90% trees off toggle, then you should enjoy the game.

[PoorOldSpike]

Geordie quote- To my knowledge, your not a member of the press and never have been. I also seemed to miss the bit where you reviewed the game fully, do you have a link?
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You've got a short memory mate, you had your socks blown off by my sensational PCK review at Gamesquad in April, here's what you said-

"POS. Id just like to thank you for the analysis and screenshots here, from your tests and reviews I think I will be getting this one...Good stuff and keep it coming"

Link-
http://www.gamesquad.com/forums/showthr ... 778&page=8

[Mobius]

ORIGINAL: Geordie
To my knowledge, your not a member of the press and never have been. I also seemed to miss the bit where you reviewed the game fully, do you have a link?

POS made a nice review of PCK on Gamespot I think.
One of the things he mentioned that was not to his liking was that there was no way turn off the trees to check on things in the woods. Most players like me agreed with this.

One of the fixes was Matrix added the F12 key most trees removed toggel. Applying artistic license they felt that 90% off good enough to see things hidden in the woods while giving a hint that there were trees about. Most players like me agreed.

That’s all there is to it. A matter of taste.

[Mad Russian]

To bring this thread back on topic let me update some things since I last posted here.

Since a good number of posts early on, in this thread, were by me with questions about the differences let me bring you up to date on what I see now, months later. My last post in this thread was back on March 25th.

Since that time I've gotten both PC:OWS and PC:K. I've played almost constantly in both the CM and PC game systems. I have  A LOT of CM commitments that were in place before I decided to buy and support PC.

Here is what I see as a gamer that routinely travels back and forth between the two systems.

1) They are very different systems. Anyone that is looking for a CM clone in PC will be disappointed. This has been pointed out before. It's true. The combat and gaming models are very different.

CM is like a game of chess where you are in control of everything. There is no command structure. You are God and you determine every move for everybody. This is micromanagement down to the lowest degree.

PC is like a team sport. The system isn't so much about micromanaging all your forces. Although the system will allow it in most cases it's not necessary.

2) The game impulses are very different. CM is a single 1 minute turn. PC has two 40 second impulses.  After playiing this for a very short amount of time I find that I rarely make a change in the reaction phase (the 2nd 40 second impulse) but play it more like a single 80 second turn.

3) The game interfaces different. At first it was hard to get PC what I wanted it to do. But once I learned to set the zoom levels and give platoon orders it takes me no time at all to do a turn. In CM I rarely give platoon orders. When I do mass orders in CM I normally get an entire grouping not just a platoon. Both work well. I actually prefer the way PC works in the game at this point. When playing CM I miss more of the PC options.

4) The graphics are better in PC but both are adequate and not why I play the games.

5) The editor in CM beats the PC editor hands down. There is a Map Maker being worked on and it looks very capable even if it will be more complicated than the CM version.

6) Map size again is in CM's favor. 3+ km in some cases to only a 1km square area for PC.

7) Tank combat is good in both games.

8) Infantry, engineers and artillery has a better model in CM than PC.

9) Destructible buildings and terrain are availabel in CM but not PC.

10) Aircraft and AA seem about the same to me.

11) Support for the games is all in PC's favor. Mention that there are issues with the game and the Matrix group will try to do something about it. Now you may not get 100% of what you are looking to get changed but at least you will get discussion with it. Not so with CMx1.

12) Continuing games in the series. PC is growing and CMx1 is not.

13) Back coded games in the series. All PC games have the most current options, graphics and coding. Each CM game is independant and all have somewhat different coding.

14) CM has bases to help track your troops in heavy cover. PC has "floating coins". At first this was an issue for me. I couldn't track my guys well enough in trees. But with the F12 option and getting used to the icons I have no preference as to whether I see colored bases or icons.

Whether you will like one over the other is a question of your gaming styles and what you are looking for.

If you have in the past been an ASL, Close Combat or Combat Mission gamer then you should look at this game series and see if it appeals to you. You may well find it does.

Good Hunting.

MR

[PoorOldSpike]

I have no plans to re-install and play PCK until a "trees fully-off toggle" patch comes out, and that's all there is to it..

[Mad Russian]

ORIGINAL: Poor Old Spike

I have no plans to re-install and play PCK until a "trees fully-off toggle" patch comes out, and that's all there is to it..

Your choice. But since you didn't even pay for your copy of PCK that's not much of a loss is it?

Good Hunting.

MR

[Geordie]

ORIGINAL: Poor Old Spike

I have no plans to re-install and play PCK until a "trees fully-off toggle" patch comes out, and that's all there is to it..

Then thats just picky in the extreme as if you cant play it at 90% off your just being stubborn.

Is this the sole reason?

Ah well, at least you dont need to spam up the forum till then.....

[JMass]

ORIGINAL: Poor Old Spike

I have no plans to re-install and play PCK until a "trees fully-off toggle" patch comes out, and that's all there is to it..

You could re-install PCK at 90%...
[:D]

[PoorOldSpike]

Well guys seeing as this is the CM v PCK debate, let me point out a CMBB Tourney thread over at Blitz just hit the 10,000 views mark, that works out at 1000 views per week since it began 10 weeks ago.
Not bad for 6 year old game..



http://www.theblitz.org/message_boards/ ... ?tid=46784

[falco148]

ORIGINAL: JMass

ORIGINAL: Poor Old Spike

I have no plans to re-install and play PCK until a "trees fully-off toggle" patch comes out, and that's all there is to it..

You could re-install PCK at 90%...
[:D]

Hee hee.......lol.

- falco.

[falco148]

ORIGINAL: Poor Old Spike

Well guys seeing as this is the CM v PCK debate, let me point out a CMBB Tourney thread over at Blitz just hit the 10,000 views mark, that works out at 1000 views per week since it began 10 weeks ago.
Not bad for 6 year old game..



http://www.theblitz.org/message_boards/ ... ?tid=46784

This is supposed to prove something?? (other than bolstering your enormous ego).

- falco.

[Mad Russian]

ORIGINAL: Poor Old Spike

Well guys seeing as this is the CM v PCK debate, let me point out a CMBB Tourney thread over at Blitz just hit the 10,000 views mark, that works out at 1000 views per week since it began 10 weeks ago.

Not bad for 6 year old game..

While I agree that this thread is about comparing CM with PC, I don't see what your post has to do with comparing them. Unless, you want to come back in 5 years and see how things are progressing then. I would think in 5 more years we won't be talking about CMx1 much at all.

Good Hunting.

MR

[Mraah]

ORIGINAL: Poor Old Spike

Well guys seeing as this is the CM v PCK debate, let me point out a CMBB Tourney thread over at Blitz just hit the 10,000 views mark, that works out at 1000 views per week since it began 10 weeks ago.
Not bad for 6 year old game..

WOW !!

That could mean you have 1000 people viewing the thread once per week ...
... or 100 people viewing the thread 1.4286 times per day ...
... or 1 really bored person viewing the thread 142.86 times per day ...

As much as I love statistics ... viewing stats isn't an exact science.

By the way, I had to check this thread twice so there's an extra view that doesn't count ... if anyone is keeping track.

Rob

EDIT NOTE : Oops ... I checked this thread 3 more times ... so we got 3 extra that don't count ... sorry to ruin the stats ... sigh.

[Marc von Martial]

Okay guys, we asked it once already. Stop this crap, all of you.

[madorosh]

This article may be of interest as far as platform comparisons go:

http://tacticalwargamer.com/articles/pl ... s_cmbb.htm

[z1812]

Hi All,

Thank you M.D. for posting the link to the article above. It was quite informative and for the most part sums up the differences between PCK and CMx1 objectively.

regards John

[Prince of Eckmühl]

Gamers ought to be grateful that someone took the time to do this. The article is very well laid out, and the illustrations do wonders in detailing some of the graphical differences between the two games. Very nicely done.

I agree that just about anything that a gamer gets his hands on will feel incomplete when compared to CMBB or CMAK because of the titles' staggering level of content, so many vehicles being included. In this regard, PzC suffers from the same limitation as CMSF. Obviously, where PzC offers an advantage over the new CM2 games is that modders can create new vehicles, whereas the only way to add to the "countermix" with CMSF is to shell out the bucks for any new modules that Battlefront may offer.

In regard to that last point, I'm not completely sure that folks are gonna be satisified with what BF offers them, regardless of improvements in gameplay that are evidenced as the CM2-engine matures. The bar may have been set too high in this respect, content-wise. We'll see.

PoE (aka ivanmoe)