Lorks-a-lordy, my Empire is on fire! GBL vs 1EyedJacks - Nemo's mod

[goodboyladdie]

USN AVD Heron, leading a combined US/Dutch ASW force in the Java Sea, was sunk by 2 torpedoes from RO-63. Mike's RO boats are proving to be very dangerous and hard to sink. The first 2 four stackers to complete their ASW upgrade at Colombo have sailed for Batavia to try to generate more success.

Singapore was raided and I lost a B-17D, 2 Martins and an A-20 on the ground as well as a Catalina. All units withdrew except the Catalinas. Large raids on Brunei will be carried out tomorrow to reinforce the success (1 further oil hit today - damage now 65).

Manila, Clark and Bataan were hit. There was no serious damage, but I lost a PBY and a B-25 in return for 2 Bettys. 5 Martins out of Kuching fell to the CAP over Miri while attempting to hit shipping. They have withdrawn to Palembang.

The Penang fortress unit arrived at Aden. I can't move it because the 9.2" guns are too heavy so it will just beef up Aden's defences. I think it happened because the unit is mistakenly Chinese. Has this been fixed in the later version Nemo?

[goodboyladdie]

1 Mary and 5 Nates were destroyed over Nanchang by my LRCAP. There was no Kunming raid today - I think they proved too costly [:D].

AK Hiyama Maru was hit by a bomb from an IL-4C near the Pescadores. The IL-4C unit has had to stand down as morale had dropped to 16.

A Jap deliberate attack at Wenchow again failed to dislodge the 9th Provisional Corps (1007/26 Jap casualties to 15/1 Chinese). I will have to be careful not to lose this unit as it is large and effective and is gaining valuable experience.

Another item for Nemo: The New Mexico class BBs seem to have asymmetric AA. I expect it will be sorted in the next upgrade, but thought I'd best check you were aware. Has it been fixed in the later version?

[goodboyladdie]

I just checked Tracker and from 6/42 the problem with the New Mexico class is solved...

[witpqs]

That fortress unit has been porked since way back in RHS. I lobbied for a change, but was simply told that the correct arrival location should be able to hold out longer (and then the unit would arrive where it belongs). It's wasn't Chinese then IIRC, so that must be a later error.

[goodboyladdie]

ORIGINAL: witpqs

That fortress unit has been porked since way back in RHS. I lobbied for a change, but was simply told that the correct arrival location should be able to hold out longer (and then the unit would arrive where it belongs). It's wasn't Chinese then IIRC, so that must be a later error.

Thanks mate. Thank God there are no supply sinks in this mod!

[goodboyladdie]

19/01/42

Colon and Perth both expanded their airbases to size 5 today.

With my new aggressive defence plan in mind I have made a few changes in Hawaii. 28th BS, which have built up their experience to 65 flying B-24 recon missions to Wake, re-equipped with the B-19. The B-24s went to 436th BS to allow them to build up their experience on the same missions. The B-17Es of the 436th went to 31st BS, who were very glad to see the back of their B-18s. I am moving the newly arrived BBs New Mexico and Mississipi to PH with a CL and 4 DDs as escort. All four Pac Flt CVs will escort them and will remain at PH afterwards. I figure I can always run away again if my heavy bombers do not manage to hurt the KB on the way in... 20th PS with their P-39Ds, which are a Pac Flt unit but start in SF, have embarked onto USS Lexington to be ferried into Fortress Pearl Harbor. The West Coast yards are so full of cripples and upgrading transports that I will need to take advantage of the fact that the PH yards are free for my Northampton class upgrades next month.

West Virginia, with 64 system damage, has sailed with 2 DDs and a couple of AOs for the South Atlantic repair yards. AS Pelias is moving from SF to San Diego, which will become my main sub repair facility on the West Coast (1 AS is already there). 111th Regiment is loading at SF for Palmyra. 4 large British AKs arrived at San Francisco with 40,000 tons of resources from Melbourne. Now they are there I realise that the West Coast does not seem to need the resources.

[goodboyladdie]

K XV missed the already heavily damaged Thames Maru and Anglo Dutch ASW forces attacked RO-63 in the Java Sea. They did not get any good hits in as far as I can tell.

Rangoon, Singapore, Clark, Manila and Battan were bombed again. Another 2 raids went after ground troops at Clark. Singapore and Rangoon are damaged. Mike lost at least 7 bombers in these raids. 2 Brunei oil centres were hit but damage is only 66 so they must have hit ones that have already been damaged. Hitting anything from 32,000 ft while being distracted by Jap fighters stalling below must be difficult...

2 more Dutch M139s out of Kuching were lost over Miri. I didn't realise I had put 2 units in there. They have moved to join the other unit at Palembang and will attempt a raid on the airfield at Johore Bharu.

In the Philippines, Mike has moved troops into Lucena (see screenie). If he manages to dislodge me there I will have to retreat quickly into Manila so next turn I will probably commit some reserves. M139s from Bataan and the B-25s from Manila will bomb the Japs at Lucena.

[goodboyladdie]

The Dutch Samarind Base Force arrived at Geraldton in Western Australia today.

At Aden RFA Appleleaf started loading fuel. She will head to Colombo as a replenishment task force. A small TK is loading oil for Calcutta. Afterwards she will head to Chittagong to start moving the 17,000 tons there to Calcutta. 17, 135 and 136 sqns arrived with Hurricane Is. They embarked for Bombay. At Bombay 28 Sqn (Fk 51s) and 605 sqn (Hurri Is) moved to Chittagaong and Diamond Harbour respectively. 36 Sqn (Vildebeest) and 60 sqn (Buffs) - refugees from Malaya - are unloading at Madras. RAAF 1 sqn has moved their Hudsons to Ledo to gain experience with recon missions over the Jap unit that moved out of Rahaeng towards Ye this turn. Jap units from Tavoy finally reached Ye. No 67 sqn pulled their rather useless Buffs back to Dacca.

Here are today's arrivals...

[goodboyladdie]

1st Lt Draper of the AVG got his 5th, 6th and 7th kills over Nanchang today. 1 Nell, 4 Bettys, 1 Mary and 3 Nates were lost in return for a Chinese Lancer. Angels appeared over Nanchang too...

3000 tons of supplies from Seattle arrived at Petropavlovsk.

The Japs at Shanghai expanded the airfield ther to size 9.

[goodboyladdie]

20/01/42

Cairns port and airfield both increased to size 3.

40,000 tons of supplies started unloading at PH. 2 Porter class DDs detached from the escort to disband at PH. 1 Farragut class DD detached to join the replenishment group based at PH. The long range defence forces commenced operations. The B-19s are set to 12,000 ft and 24 hexes, the B-17Es to 9,000 ft and 24 hexes. ML Oglala sailed to lay mines at Lanai. The 67th PS, flying Mosquito Night Fighters, flew in to PH from SF to join the CAP. They will operate in daylight as a counter to any Angel raids. Admiral Chester Nimitz replaced Husband Kimmel as CINCPAC.

At San Francisco 2 "Steel" AKs were taken in hand for conversion to AR. They should be available in 182 days. 2 13,000 ton TKs began loading Oil for Sydney and SS Cuttlefish finally completed repairs and sailed to mine Iwo Jima. She will return to PH. The newly arrived C2 AKs (see last screenie with the China news) need to upgrade.

The cruisers San Francisco and Honolulu sailed with the DD Dewey from Seattle to PH.

The severely understrength 40th Division has completed unloading at Suva. It is approximately one third strength so supplies will need to be pumped in. Many enemy ships are sighted at Truk and Palau, types unclear.

[goodboyladdie]

Tabor Island was occupied by the Japs. I haven't got a clue where that is...

Martin 139s out of Palembang bombed Johore Bharu airfield unnopposed. An inexperienced (48 average) reserve unit from Soerabaya has flown in to join in tomorrow. Damage was light. At Brunei, the raid was larger than normal as I had about 4 B-17D/E units available (I have been resting them or putting them on Naval Attack when below 50 morale) and there were 4 oil and 1 airbase hits. 78 oil centres are now damaged.

Manila, Clark and Bataan were bombed. A Betty was knocked down at Manila. M 139s and B-25s hit the Jap 7th and 16th Divisions at Lucena, but Lucena fell. This is a big problem as all units at Clark can now be cut off from Manila. Clark is being evacuated. A couple of units are going to Bataan, but the bulk will go to Manila, IF they can get there before the Japs. A Division and a tank bn will stay behind as a regard to prevent Mike just walking in while the other units try to escape. If he still has not crossed into Clark next turn and the other units are away safely, they may follow. I am tempted to keep them there to force Mike's units coming down from the North to shock attack.

Ye, in Burma also fell. 254th Tank Brigade moved out of reserve at Calcutta. They will proceed to Chittagong to beef up the defences against any future amphibious attack.

[goodboyladdie]

The recent top scoring Ace has now been shot down and wounded. Losses over Nanchang were quite severe. The defensive fire from the Angels was a bit on the deadly side. 1 Nell and 2 Bettys were exchanged for 2 P-40Es and 3 Chinese Lancers. Next turn I will spread out my ambushes. The main AVG will attempt one East of Honan, Lancers will attempt one North of Amoy, and I-16 mod 4s will attempt one South of Honan.

A Jap outflanking move is underway South East of Nanchang. I am abandoning Wenchow and moving units back West. The reserves I have coming back from Ichang to Changsha will attempt to secure Nanchang's Southern flank. In the field the Chinese seem to be easy meat, so I am hoping that numbers will even out these battles in the open...

[goodboyladdie]

21/12/42

USS Oglala will lay mines at the now fully repaired Johnston Island. Palmyra is now 0/39/1 and Christmas Island is now 0/49/90. The DMs from SF will lay mines at Los Angeles. 11th Air Force HQ is loading at SF for Anchorage. USS Curtiss will be my only real convoy air cover until my CVEs turn up. She is down to sys 8 (see screenie).

An AK is loading 10000 tons of supplies at the South Atlantic hex for Suva. In Australia the first reinforcements are almost on the good roads/railroads into Darwin. My only real effort to defend Northern Australia will be to protect Darwin and it's approaches. Western and Eastern Australia are more important and a better defensive proposition.

[goodboyladdie]

There were no hits scored by today's much smaller Brunei raid. Manila, Clark and Bataan were again visited by the Japanese. Damage was light and at least 2 Bettys were downed. Jap troops South of Manila were bombed by B-25s from Manila and M 139s from Bataan. Half of the units escaping Clark arrived in Manila. The Japs are no longer in Davao (see screenie). I do not know why. The 8th Pp Base Force became the latest unit to start evacuating from Manila by sub.

I am tempted to send the Dutch Strike Force from Kendari to bombard the Japs on Mindanao, but think it is too far into Betty range to be worth the risk. ML 3 1e-VLG-V completed their move from Kuching and disbanded into ML 4-2e-VLG-IV at Amboina. 11 B-339 fighters are now on strength. 733 Sqn FAA flew into Singapore with their Beauforts. M 139s from Palembang once again bombed Johore Bharu AF.

[goodboyladdie]

2 more upgraded USN 4 stackers left Colombo for ASW duties out of Batavia. 488 Sqn (NZ) converted to The Hurricane I from the Buff at Colombo. Comparing stats, there does not seem to be much of an advantage. I always thought the Hurricane was substantially better than the Buff? (see screenie)

B-17s out of Calcutta will attempte to bomb HI at Hanoi. RAF 107th BF, who have already retreated once, received orders to leave Moulmein and head for Cox's Bazaar.

Edit Weren't the first Hurricanes sent to the Far East Hurricane IIAs? They turned up with 12 machine guns and armour IIRC. Although they had a better Merlin than the Mk1 performance was degraded by the Vokes air filter (they had been intended for the Middle East). A local modification was the removal of the 4 outboard .303 machine guns to restore some performance. I feel Nemo has shortchanged the Allies here. Mk Is definitely had armour too...

[goodboyladdie]

I having been bombing Jap forces who are over my side of the river NW of Nanchang since the start. Today a Nate CAP was present. 3 Nates fell, as did 1 P-43A. 2 SB-2s were damaged. A Jap deliberate attack on a guerilla unit just over the river failed, even though my guys were completely outnumbered.

The map show this situation, plus my reaction to the Jap offensive.

[Nemo121]

GBL,

Well its all about making a choice. My choice was whether to give the Allies Hurricane IIas or Hurricane Is. My thinking was that as the Hurricane IIa was a poorer dogfighter ( less speed and manoeuvrability in WiTP terms) and had no more firepower ( once locally modified ) that the Hurricane I was a better plane for the Allies to receive. The Allies DO get the Hurricane IIc in September 42 and that's a beauty with increased speed, firepower ( 4 x 20mm cannon ), manoeuvrability etc.
 
So, my choice was between the I which would be more useful fighting Zeroes and the IIa which had no better firepower ( thus was no better vs bombers ) and was slower ( thus much worse vs Zeroes). Yes the IIa had armour but when you are hit by cannon fire from a Zero that armour doesn't save you much.
 
As for the I not being armoured... Well, virtually all planes had a little armour somewhere. Even some of the Japanese planes we think of as "paper-thin" had armour. E.g. the G4M had armour around the engines and pilot in some of its early models. So just because the plane has a zero in the armour column doesn't mean it had no armour. However it may not have had SUFFICIENT armour to warrant an armour rating of ONE.
 
So, the Hurricane I had armour but it wasn't, IMO, sufficient to give it an armour rating of ONE.
 
Overall though the Allies do pretty well in terms of firepower and armour in this mod as I assume that the increased formidability of late-war Japanese fighters and mid-war Japanese bombers causes the Allies to go to all-cannon fighters and to speed development of war-changing planes like the Corsair. There is a lag though and so in the early days you do have to make do with some fairly poor planes. OTOH the Spits and Mig-3s you have are, by a wide margin, better than anything the Japanese have at war's start. Concentrate them in a crucial sector and you will gain air superiority in that sector easily enough.
 
As re: the Buff vs the Hurri. The only major difference is the speed. Those extra 24 miles an hour make the difference between being competitive with the Zero ( assuming equal pilot experience ) in a Hurricane vs being a KIA statistic in the Buff.
 
Obviously people can disagree with me on the Hurricane I armour call etc but at least I applied the same thinking to all planes so armour ratings are consistent throughout the mod.

[goodboyladdie]

ORIGINAL: Nemo121

GBL,

Well its all about making a choice. My choice was whether to give the Allies Hurricane IIas or Hurricane Is. My thinking was that as the Hurricane IIa was a poorer dogfighter ( less speed and manoeuvrability in WiTP terms) and had no more firepower ( once locally modified ) that the Hurricane I was a better plane for the Allies to receive. The Allies DO get the Hurricane IIc in September 42 and that's a beauty with increased speed, firepower ( 4 x 20mm cannon ), manoeuvrability etc.

So, my choice was between the I which would be more useful fighting Zeroes and the IIa which had no better firepower ( thus was no better vs bombers ) and was slower ( thus much worse vs Zeroes). Yes the IIa had armour but when you are hit by cannon fire from a Zero that armour doesn't save you much.

As for the I not being armoured... Well, virtually all planes had a little armour somewhere. Even some of the Japanese planes we think of as "paper-thin" had armour. E.g. the G4M had armour around the engines and pilot in some of its early models. So just because the plane has a zero in the armour column doesn't mean it had no armour. However it may not have had SUFFICIENT armour to warrant an armour rating of ONE.

So, the Hurricane I had armour but it wasn't, IMO, sufficient to give it an armour rating of ONE.

Overall though the Allies do pretty well in terms of firepower and armour in this mod as I assume that the increased formidability of late-war Japanese fighters and mid-war Japanese bombers causes the Allies to go to all-cannon fighters and to speed development of war-changing planes like the Corsair. There is a lag though and so in the early days you do have to make do with some fairly poor planes. OTOH the Spits and Mig-3s you have are, by a wide margin, better than anything the Japanese have at war's start. Concentrate them in a crucial sector and you will gain air superiority in that sector easily enough.

As re: the Buff vs the Hurri. The only major difference is the speed. Those extra 24 miles an hour make the difference between being competitive with the Zero ( assuming equal pilot experience ) in a Hurricane vs being a KIA statistic in the Buff.

Obviously people can disagree with me on the Hurricane I armour call etc but at least I applied the same thinking to all planes so armour ratings are consistent throughout the mod.

Hi Nemo

Thanks very much for taking the time to explain your thinking. The armour call is a little odd as the Hurri I had the same amour plate as the Buff and the early Spits, but it's your mod and I am enjoying everything about it (except the designer class CLAAs - I cannot get them to compute. They would sink in any heavy sea!). The IIA and IIC have similar performance and agility (especially when stripped down to the 8 gun fit). The only difference I can factor in to justify your assertion is that the IICs arrive without the unnecessary tropical air filter fitted and that seems very reasonable to me. Once again, thanks for being so attentive and helpful.

Very best regards

Carl

[Nemo121]

GBL,
 
Designer class CLAAs. I actually used a ship modelling programme to test them out. Now I may be wrong about gun mount weights etc and I couldn't get the programme to account for all the side AAA as anything other than barbette mounts so I'll be the first to admit that the modelling mightn't be perfect but my findings were as follows:
 
1. Assuming that the side-mounted guns were actually arrayed in 2 major banks along the length of the ship, first bank being barbettes revetted into the side of the ship a la Fuso etc ( but with good clearance for elevation ) and that the second bank were "on the deck" ( aka, a traditional gun mounting ) and assuming that you could replace two forward 8 inch turrets with 3 quadruple 3.9inch each ( which when you look at the footprints of the 8 inch turret vs a double 3.9inch ( since I assumed that the 3.9 inch arrangement would be 2 x 2 in terms of horizontal and vertical spacing and not 4 x 1 ) ) and that the pagoda-like bridge was replace by a sort of barbican arrangement allowing gun revetments then the spacing of guns etc is taken care of.
 
2. Would it have been the size of a CA? NO!!! You have to look at their durability and realise that at 75 durability these ships are NOT CAs they are, essentially, pocket battleships with nothing but AAA armament. Each costs 2/3rds as much as a front-line IJN BB and they have to be viewed through that prism.
 
3. So, assuming a 21,000 ton displacement are these ships possible and would they be able to stay afloat and fight? Yes.
 
4. Would I like to take them into heavy seas ? No but I don't think it would have been too much worse than some of the other ships the Japanese built. I seem to recall one of their DDs actually just breaking apart in heavy seas in the 30s and a lot of their DDs being rebuilt as a result.
 
5. Are they as top-heavy as you might think? No. Building a 2/3rds BB without main gun armament and all that sort of stuff actually frees up a LOT of weight for other stuff and no matter how many 3.9 inch guns you put on board you find it very difficult to use up all that free weight. Think of them as a 2/3rd scale Mutsu or Nagato without main guns but with AAA festooned into every nook and cranny.
 
 
I'm no expert on ship design. I'd know a lot more about tank design. But I took a Nagato class BB, scaled it down, stripped out the main and secondary armament, reduced the armour in some areas and kept it in others and then festooned it with AAA. The programme calculates speed etc etc and also seakeeping and while it wasn't as good as the Nagato the seakeeping wasn't all that bad either. It certainly made me think that the Designer Class COULD have kept afloat and fought if someone had been single-minded and crazy enough to build one.
 
I think the 15 Durability "Forum" Class CLAAs ( based on an enlarged DD design ) are much more in keeping with what the USN and RN did to build AAA ships. The Forum class CLAAs are basically the Japanese copying the West while the Designer class are really more along the lines of BCLAAs ( Light Battlecruiser Anti-Aircraft ) and were designed after reading Kaigun again and being impressed by the Japanese desire to always build "the biggest and best". This led me to think that if someone proposed building true CLAAs someone else would come along and say "What we need are BCLAAs as these will be bigger, more survivable and more lethal than any 2 or 3 CLAAs."
 
 
When push came to shove though the Designer class were a fun "what if". The Japanese cannot build everything I put in their build queue and I just assumed that if players didn't like them they'd stop building them and concentrate on more of the fairly conventional DDs and CLAAs and proper CLs I put in. Each to their own and all that. That's the guiding light behind my mod.... I wanted to put together something which would:
a) be different and fun.
b) be competitive in 1944 and 45
c) could be played a whole lot of different ways
d) REALLY put the focus on the economy and had lots of little traps for Japanese players who looked at all the goodies and thought "Gees, I can do anything." I think a good example of what can happen when the Japanese player over-stretches is currently being demonstrated in the game I took over against Damian. He over-extended and now he's about 1 week away from losing almost all of Burma and a fair bit of Vietnam in July 42.
 
 
Question: If you could give me the figures for armour rating for the Hurri I vs Spit version in the game I will look at it and consider changing. It is always possible that I had poor data when making the decision and your data might be different.
 

[ny59giants]

Carl,
Why are you wasting time using your DM's to mine Los Angeles?? Do you think Mike is going to invade the USA anytime soon?? [;)]