GPW v6a

[TheArchduke]

Well, I for one think we should play the game out before we make adjustments.

Concerning a better/realistic GPW coupled with a better map, boronx and me are working on that.

[Jay Doubleyou]

GPW certainly needs balancing, since German side is too weak and thus easy to stop. I will start a special thread about it where players can post their ideas.

Edit: started this thread:
tm.asp?m=1917555

[Ccr]

I am happy to sit out the game initially. I have plenty of pbems going at the moment to keep me busy!

re GPW v6a: I find that this is now overbalanced in favour of the Russians; it is very tricky for the Axis to deal fatal blows to the enemy in 1941 & the winter offensive usually sees the Axis player in a hopeless position (NW front seems to be especially well placed to dominate AGN) - perhaps all this does is faithfully reflect the historical realities! 1 on 1 I would always back the Russian player.

[mavnb]

not receive turns, orders, or any news for 2 days now.
Hotmail the problem??[&:][:@]

[Mehring]

We're currently horse trading and agreeing play balances.

[mavnb]

ok. was wondering if I was about to receive the visit of some guys saying my services were no longer required...

[Mehring]

All commanders. Your leave is cancelled. Report to your headquarters immediately!

[Mehring]

Changes to standard GPWv6a-
 
Germans have level 2 staff and fighters.
Germans have 8 medium tanks.
 
House rules-
 
To reflect Stalin's "no retreat" orders, Russia cannot use rail movement eastwards until November 1st. Historically, commanders had some tactical freedom of movement which was often used to retreat, but strategic resources were not available.
 
To reflect the German's logistical problems in the first year of the war particularly, Germany cannot use any rail transport at all, east of Estonia, Minsk and Ternapol until May 1st 1942. This is intended to represent as far as possible their over reliance upon the inadequate road network, this forced by the slow rate at which they were able to convert the Russian rail network to a West European gauge.
 
 

[mavnb]

Northwest Front ready. Was getting worried that
war was not happening.

mavnb

[british exil]

South ready.

problem is that I'm on holiday from 12-24.10 Sorry if that creates problems.
I hope that I will not be relieved of my duty.

[Barthheart]

ORIGINAL: Mehring

Changes to standard GPWv6a-

Germans have level 2 staff and fighters.
Germans have 8 medium tanks.

House rules-

To reflect Stalin's "no retreat" orders, Russia cannot use rail movement eastwards until November 1st. Historically, commanders had some tactical freedom of movement which was often used to retreat, but strategic resources were not available.

To reflect the German's logistical problems in the first year of the war particularly, Germany cannot use any rail transport at all, east of Estonia, Minsk and Ternapol until May 1st 1942. This is intended to represent as far as possible their over reliance upon the inadequate road network, this forced by the slow rate at which they were able to convert the Russian rail network to a West European gauge.

Can you explain more about how the "no rail movment' works? Is it just no strat movement by train or can't you transfer SFT's form HQ's to units?Supplies?
How do you make sure this is not done by train? Separate the trains from the HQ's? Or remove them all together and add them in later by event?

[Mehring]

Good points. What I wanted to replicate as far as possible is that apart from a few captured trains and rolling stock, there were no trains for the Germans beyond the slow moving rail gauge coversion batallions.

Supply is where this situation was most keenly felt but in AT it is beyond our control, AFAIK. I envisaged only strat movement restrictions but your mention of SF transfers- which I never considered- is very relevant. If it's ok with you guys, then, I'm for including SF transfers in the restrictions. You'll then find your road convoys more useful than ever.

[Barthheart]

I'm good with restricting teh SFT transfers as well... but how do you do that? Delete all trains? How can you tell if an SFT transfer is using trucks or trains to happen?

I've been trying to come up with at way to simulate the rail gauge changeover problem... but it involves major changes to the scenario... different supplies for Germans or Russians.... different trains.... different railroad terrain and some way to switch from one to the other.....

Anyone eles have ideas????

[Mehring]

I think you can assume that anything over around 10 hexes is being moved by trains. I suggest to form staging HQs equipped with trucks, at the railheads. Top or AG HQ could then train SFs to these, and they bump the SFs forward in trucks to their destination. 
 
I'm all ears for your rail gauge scenario though.

[Barthheart]

Ok, I think that will be workable...

Oh another thing, can you add an overall HQ for the Germans, named OKW (say 10 Staff and only trains). And have all the AG's HQ's attached to it. This will help simulate the supply problems and make it easier for the German top commander to have a single point for supplies to flow to and from. Might make the strat transfer thing work easier too.

Just thinking this through.... if the Germans have an OKW HQ then it can have the only trains to start. This means the AG HQ's will have to stop advancing at the "railheads" and will only have trucks. As the production and supplies will all go to the OKW HQ there's no worry of the AG Hq's using trains improperly. Then in 1942, the Germans can start transfering trains to the AG HQ's.

More ideas?

[Mehring]

can you add an overall HQ for the Germans, named OKW
I see! You're showing up another assumption I made, that as Russia has STAVKA, Germany must also have OKW. No problem, I'll strip trains from the AGs and add them to a new OKW or OKH HQ formation in Berlin.
 
This means the AG HQ's will have to stop advancing at the "railheads" and will only have trucks.
If they're all run on trucks, couldn't you put the staging HQs at the railheads and advance the AG HQs, if you wanted? Not sure if either version would impact upon HQ combat bonus if Army HQs are up with the fighting anyway.
 
Then in 1942, the Germans can start transfering trains to the AG HQ's.
Exactly. Just figured how to do this, as I had problems transferring trains between HQs in our practice game. You have to create a formation, fill it with trains, then move it. Only seems to shift 20 hexes a turn, less than trucks.[8|]
 
I checked the map and I think in the south, Ternapol is a bit too harsh a limit and does not agree at all with the number of  "1941 convertable" rail hexes in AGs C and N. Vinnitsa/Zhitomir/Karosten are more realistic railhead limits for AGS.

[Barthheart]

Mehring,

I got your PM with the changed scenario.

About the map labels, I have a ver 6a with the city and river names turned on. It looks pretty good. I can send it to you, but then you'd have to remake all your changes.

Let me know.

That's odd about the trains... they should be able to be transfered between units the same as any other SFT.... I'll give it a try and see what's going on.

[Mehring]

No probs, send it. Practice makes perfect [:D]

[Barthheart]

PM sent with zip. let me know if you got it.

[Jay Doubleyou]

Game is on!
Did my part of the turn and it's now at Rufus for his part.
Barthheart will do his tomorrow I think, because he is away now. After that's it's over to the Russian side.

Good luck everyone. Looking forward to it.
See you in Moscow before it gets cold..