Another test run

[harley]

ORIGINAL: Dixie

I never used to have much success with the bomber stream escort type intruders. I always seem to get far more success with lone fighters patrolling over the NJG airfields, especially the ones around the area east of the Ruhr (IIRC) for some reason. Maybe the fact that one patrol area can cover 2-3 AFs at a time?


EDIT: Good to see BC doing some damage as well [:D]

Bwhahahahahahahahaha!

I don't think it's quoted, be I loves the .sig image!

[joey]

The more I see of this game; the more I like. I love what has been done with night warfare. I just wish I could play.............

[Dixie]

ORIGINAL: harley

Bwhahahahahahahahaha!

I don't think it's quoted, be I loves the .sig image!

Good to see someone likes it [:)]

Back to the original for now [:(] BTW, I'm hoping this is not released at the same time as AE, or I'll have no time or money left...[:D]

PS: Are we there yet [;)][:'(]

[Hard Sarge]

I like it also Dixie

just in case, I finished the battle and won,

started to see something I wanted to work on, so stopped showing stuff, I made a data change, and it don't look like it took to well

[GShock]

I wanted to ask something...does the player have any chance to alter the course of the war with these raids, in other words, how does victory get achieved...because u only talk about targets destroyed and kills/losses but not about what happens during the war. Do player missions actually influence the war or this sort of air warfare ends just there?

[Hard Sarge]

Well, yes, you can stop Aircraft production, or fuel production, and what that does to the war effort

you can pound ground troops, or try and stop AFV production

in the old game, I was the only one who ever broke the defences in Normady, and caused the breakout to happen before June was over, we overran France and won the war in Aug of 44

but the main goal, so to say, is to break the LW, so you can break the Production that allows the war to keep going, if you do a good job here, you help there

not sure if that answers your question

[GShock]

It surely does, thanks. New one: Can play as Allies or Germans i suppose?

[Hard Sarge]

yes, it is kind of a odd game that way, playing as the Off player (Axis in BoB/Allied in BTR) you plot your raids, plot your turn, and then sit back and watch

as the defender (RAF in BoB, Axis in BTR) you react to the turn

[kaybayray]

Hey Sarge,

Looks great! Thanks for the info. Sounds like you guys are fixing a lot of things up. Looking at the screenshots it looks like you have made some changes in the number of waypoints that can be plotted. Is that true?

Have a few questions about some things you may have or will change.

Have you changed the numbe of plotable waypoints?

How about altitude changes from waypoint to waypoint? Thought that might be nice to be able to customise a mission with that respect. Especially since the weather does play a significant part of this game.

How about the time compression controls, have you made some changes to that? I am speaking about how fast time passes while you are running a turn. There are times when I would like to be able to slow it down a lot so that I can see what is going on. It can get confusing to keep track of what is happening between ETO and MTO for example while a turn is being run.

How about Recalls for Allied Bomb and Fighter groups? I believe I read on a post that this would be added. Is this true? I have to tell you this is one of my biggest sources for frustration in the original game. Cant stand to watch Bomb groups fly away unescorted and get ground up because their escort was either late or could not launch due to weather. I mean how about allowing to make an in-mission Rally point change to correct for these kinds of events.

How about breaking down the night units to smaller sizes in a much more user friendly way? Are you guys planning on correcting that? IMO it is a bit difficult and clunky the way the original game has you break Intruder and Elint units down to the size that you want when you are trying to plot night missions.


Well just a few questions there. Thanks again for this information. Really cool what you got going. Great that you share these test results with us. Would like to hear some AAR's for the current beta if you could allow that.... perhaps you and Harley can filter out what you dont want let out to the general public. Just an idea.

Since picking up the original game I really understand how difficult your task is. This is a very complex game IMO and I dont envy you the hard work you guys are doing fixing it up and improving on it.

I have been running through a few campaigns and I will post some more on my "Advice" thread once I have something to discuss. Mostly I am just fiddling around trying things... not to mention blowing it for the Allied forces.. LOL [:D]

Later,
KayBay

[Hard Sarge]

ORIGINAL: kaybayray

Hey Sarge,

Looks great! Thanks for the info. Sounds like you guys are fixing a lot of things up. Looking at the screenshots it looks like you have made some changes in the number of waypoints that can be plotted. Is that true?

Have a few questions about some things you may have or will change.

Have you changed the numbe of plotable waypoints?

Yes

How about altitude changes from waypoint to waypoint? Thought that might be nice to be able to customise a mission with that respect. Especially since the weather does play a significant part of this game.

on the wish list, not worked on

How about the time compression controls, have you made some changes to that? I am speaking about how fast time passes while you are running a turn. There are times when I would like to be able to slow it down a lot so that I can see what is going on. It can get confusing to keep track of what is happening between ETO and MTO for example while a turn is being run.

no, time system is still the same

How about Recalls for Allied Bomb and Fighter groups? I believe I read on a post that this would be added. Is this true? I have to tell you this is one of my biggest sources for frustration in the original game. Cant stand to watch Bomb groups fly away unescorted and get ground up because their escort was either late or could not launch due to weather. I mean how about allowing to make an in-mission Rally point change to correct for these kinds of events.

well, I think the issue is the type of game system, once the Off player hits start, then he is just a watcher, so kind of HARD to let him jump to give orders once the turn is running

How about breaking down the night units to smaller sizes in a much more user friendly way? Are you guys planning on correcting that? IMO it is a bit difficult and clunky the way the original game has you break Intruder and Elint units down to the size that you want when you are trying to plot night missions.

don't really follow here, NI and Elint either use one, or half of what is left of the squadron

Well just a few questions there. Thanks again for this information. Really cool what you got going. Great that you share these test results with us. Would like to hear some AAR's for the current beta if you could allow that.... perhaps you and Harley can filter out what you dont want let out to the general public. Just an idea.

Since picking up the original game I really understand how difficult your task is. This is a very complex game IMO and I dont envy you the hard work you guys are doing fixing it up and improving on it.

I have been running through a few campaigns and I will post some more on my "Advice" thread once I have something to discuss. Mostly I am just fiddling around trying things... not to mention blowing it for the Allied forces.. LOL [:D]

Later,
KayBay

[TechSgt]

Night Intruders;

FOR NI missions I prefer to use the single plane over an airfield. This is the most productive at eliminating Axis a/c. The drawback is that it is one plane/one mission. Since I'm limited to plotting 199 missions!

The Stream Intruder missions I use just like your message. Escort or Area sweeping.

Using an Intruder Escort type mission, I think of it as the more planes flying, the less likely the Germans -- using Tame Boar Tactics -- will lock on to a bomber.

Occasionally, I will send out a stream mission to appear as a Mosquito Night Bombing mission. This gets the Axis a/c up and flying. Then I put single intruders over their airfields, usually four a/c per airfield, spaced about 10 minutes apart. Occasionally, the stream will bag a few a/c, but the singles always seem to get some. Total of 13 missions used.

[TechSgt]

ORIGINAL: kaybayray

Hey Sarge,
...

How about Recalls for Allied Bomb and Fighter groups? I believe I read on a post that this would be added. Is this true? I have to tell you this is one of my biggest sources for frustration in the original game. Cant stand to watch Bomb groups fly away unescorted and get ground up because their escort was either late or could not launch due to weather. I mean how about allowing to make an in-mission Rally point change to correct for these kinds of events.

...
Later,
KayBay

As an Allied player,

When I first played the game, everything you said was something that bothered me, too!

But, the more I've played, I found this "rule" is what makes weather's effects the most important factor for the Allies, period.

Everything I've read about this campaign has stated how much the weather impacted Allied air operations, strategic and tactical.

Nothing like beating the Axis for a couple of days running, then have the weather go bad, and watching the Axis rebuild its forces. Aaaargh!!!


I have to tell you this is -- STILL -- one of my biggest sources for frustration, too!!!

[kaybayray]

Hey TechSgt,
Yeah I agree about the weather being a big impact. I lived and worked in Europe several years and lots of cloudy/wet periods and few stretches of sunny clear conditions. I dont mind not being able to fly the missions due to weather. Just frustrating not to be able to stand down a mission if the weather is too bad to fly it.

As for the Night Intruder missions. I am still struggleing with getting good results here. Otherwise I am doing well with BC. My understanding is that if I send a NI group or AC to a point on the map (which for me is usually an airfield I think is operating night fighters) and they orbit at that point until fuel forces them to RTB. What I am seeing is most of my groups just tag the point and RTB immediately. If anybody can tell my why they dont stay this would clear up another source of frustration for me. Oh, yes they have IMO plenty of Range to spend at least a few minutes over the target.

For example, I send a group of 3 or 6 NI to a LW base and they have >200 mile range to run this mission... well to me I figure they can orbit at least a few minutes. But no, they tag the mission point and head for home. I figure the only thing remaining is Morale. I never send any unit out with <50 for any kind of mission. I never send any NI missions out with <70 morale and the typical is >80. So it would be greatly appreciated if somebody would clue me in here because I am sure it is something I dont understand or am not aware of.

Anyways,
Glad to hear all the great news guys. Keep at it, this is gona be a Beaut when you ship it.

Later,
KayBay

[Hard Sarge]

if you are sending 3 to 6 planes, you are sending out a Stream mission, and that means, they fly to point and then return to base, one after another

if you send out a single plane, then it is a intruder and will patrol the target point

[kaybayray]

DOH !!!! I hate it when I do stupid things like that [:D]

Hey thanks much Sarge.... I will be rackin up the kills now >> WOOOO [8D]

My game doesnt have the BOB on it so when you guys finish the Matrix version I will be exploring a whole new game. [8D]


And a thanks to everybody else who enlightens us "ignant foos" blundering in the dark about this game. This board is always a good source to figure out what I am doing wrong in a game or how to improve my game.

Thanks All [&o]

Later,
KayBay

[TechSgt]

Hard Sarge;

Since we're on this subject of night intruders...

Single NI missions stay over the target till they get a fuel bingo, then return back to the launch point in a straight line! Right over "every heavy flak gun" in Germany.

How about in BtR, they follow the return flight path as plotted?

[Hard Sarge]

depends on if damaged or hurt

also, best way is to plot the first part of the return path to clear the area, the game will try to follow the first part of the path if it can

with the expanded waypoints, it helps alot of plotting around corners

[TechSgt]

ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge

that is a odd one, we did some stuff to it and are still looking at ways to make it not happen as much

the hassle is, it is at times, more noticeable, then normal losses, so it ends up looking worse then it is

so say you lose 80 planes today, and see 4 messages that the CO got shot down, you see and remember those 4, but sort of forget about the other 76 planes that were lost

it is something we are still looking at

remember though, each pilot is assigned a plane at the start of the day, so, if plane A is in combat, and it has the CO in it, it may end up getting shot down, or be the one doing the shooting, the game does not pick a plane and then assign a pilot to it when it is lost

and one trouble is, the CO could be the guy who made the first pass, and now is running low on fuel, or has some damage, so he breaks off and heads for home, now he runs into the enemy, it is no long 16 planes, or 48 planes or what not, but one or two, so the odds have just gotten alot higher, something bad could happen to him

which it does look like Bombers seem to get the CO attacked first, so am not sure if that is just luck of the roll, or if there is something else going on

and to the bad, alot of the CO were lost

Finally, relocated this message about the CO/Ldr problem ...

One item I've discovered is that the commander always flies whenever a unit is assigned a mission. This is most noticable with Recon, RCM, & Intruders which fly singles alot.
Plot a single plane mission for a unit a number of days in a row. The commander will fly each one, regardless of his mission count or his fatigue level.

Even units, with more pilots than a/c, will swap around some of the "lesser" pilots, but the commander is flying every mission. It would seem that the more missions flown, the greater the chance of a KIA/MIA/WIA.

How is a unit's pilots being assigned to planes, at the end of a turn?
Plus, how are those planes then being assigned to the next mission?

Lastly, if a CO/Ldr is WIA# and then returns to the unit, why is he not put back as commander?