Just get it right.

[brian brian]

I thought reviewers would only review games given to them free?

[Gravit]

If Matrix needs more playtesters then by all means put out a playtest recruitment thread and charge everyone the cost of the game to playtest and allow them to download the files privately.  If more playtesters are needed and there are folks willing to pay to playtest then great, work out a side deal and let them in. I was suckered into EIA by purchasing it before I dove through all the threads thinking that neither ADB nor Matrix would ever steer me wrong.  I was wrong and remain quite disappointed in ADB for allowing this to occur.

[Froonp]

ORIGINAL: Gravit

If Matrix needs more playtesters then by all means put out a playtest recruitment thread and charge everyone the cost of the game to playtest and allow them to download the files privately.  If more playtesters are needed and there are folks willing to pay to playtest then great, work out a side deal and let them in. I was suckered into EIA by purchasing it before I dove through all the threads thinking that neither ADB nor Matrix would ever steer me wrong.  I was wrong and remain quite disappointed in ADB for allowing this to occur.

I believe that ADG has nothing to do with the release of EiA. They were not asked their authorisation this is all a Matrix Games decision.

[powell30]

I think it would be an excellent idea providing caveats are applied. Signed up to privacy policy, private downlaoded area and private issues/bugs posting area. On that basis i would pay to 'pre purchase' the game and post back feed back/issues. Others on here have detailed other conditions that must also apply. I understand Froops and others issues but if the purchase and downloads are kept as 'beta' sales i see no issues only plus points

[brian brian]

yeah, go with the regular NDA the regular beta-testers already sign up for. I am not a fan at all of the NDA for the paper game, and not even all that much for the computer game, since I have never understood the point of it beyond Harry wants it that way. It's not like we are testing a new hydrogen-cold-fusion-free-energy-car-of-the-future or something, or there is someone out there hovering on the horizon trying to steal the bounce combat system for their WWII wargame. But I'm not trying to open that issue, it is how it is. I would buy and sign immediately if I could. I think I could play through about half of one game this winter, not sure if I would be a huge help finding bugs, but I would love to help any way I could.

[Michael the Pole]

ORIGINAL: brian brian

yeah, go with the regular NDA the regular beta-testers already sign up for. I am not a fan at all of the NDA for the paper game, and not even all that much for the computer game, since I have never understood the point of it beyond Harry wants it that way. It's not like we are testing a new hydrogen-cold-fusion-free-energy-car-of-the-future or something, or there is someone out there hovering on the horizon trying to steal the bounce combat system for their WWII wargame. But I'm not trying to open that issue, it is how it is. I would buy and sign immediately if I could. I think I could play through about half of one game this winter, not sure if I would be a huge help finding bugs, but I would love to help any way I could.

Agree completely...a NDA at this level is perhaps one degree more useful than a screen door on an exterior hatch on a klingon battlecruiser (I invite examination of my profile, if you wonder about my bona fides.)
As for the French (the only people in history who have managed to lose a civil war), going into any serious endeavor without the support of the French is like going hunting without your accordion.
I say launch now, with a large font warning page that the gameis unfinished.

[Zap]

For Europeans You could always put the disclaimer/advisory in the various languages to be assured of less confusion. That is, of course if they can read their own language

[Zenra]

I am torn as well - both sides of this discussion make good points, but having said that I must be honest and admit that I would immediately and gladly pay for a "gamma" version as soon as it is made available... [8|]

[bredsjomagnus]

That is, of course if they can read their own language

 
Öhhh. Nä, vi bor alla i grottor och har mycket svårt att läsa och skriva?

[Grapeshot Bob]

ORIGINAL: EUBanana
I'm torn.  On the one hand I want to play it (assuming its playable).  And it might (might) hasten its arrival if it is released in a semi-finished state.  Games have been released in the past (Star Wars Galaxies?) in a semi-finished state and done OK in the long run.  I'd buy it, even if it was buggy, so long as it was at least vaguely playable.  If it was PBEM only I'd buy it.

If you would like to see the effect of such reasoning please head over to the Empires in Arms Forum.

The people who bought that little gem are roughly divided between the hard-core grognards who begged to have the game released "Just so they could play PBEM" and the general gaming public who want the developers drawn and quartered. In case you are wondering, I'm one of the latter group.

You could warm your house for a year with all the heat in that forum.

I blew over $60 to be what is basically a beta tester. It's been a year and the game is still quite buggy.

Not happy.



GSB

[JagWars]

I blew over $60 to be what is basically a beta tester.

We are all beta testers for every computer game ever produced. I have purchased hundreds and am yet to see one that is bug free or could not do with significant further developement. In fact, I am not sure that I own a computer game that is bug free, including those that have had multiple pathes available after initial release.

Computer wargame AI is abominal. The AI plays like a child; it attempts to maximize the use of the rules and attempts to punish the human player when he appears to have failed to realize the ramifications of a rule. The AI is incapable of analyzing the tactical suituation and realizing the human opponents tactical choices. The AI is rather like someone first moving from checkers to chess. They are still focusing upon taking their opponents tokens rather than reacting to their opponents tactically.

EiA is a good example of this. Move one of your corps out infront of your depots by a few spaces and leave the depot undefended. The AI will will weaken its main force by breaking up a near by ememy corps and filling in the empty territories between the forward corp and the depot and then take the depot. It will not recognize that you have other Corps with which to follow up and kill off the little ants it has deposited around the mapboard.

I see a lot of statements about EiA and comparing its release to an early release of WiF. While EiA had some bugs (but again all computer games do), for me the bigger issue was the poor user inter-face. It was a struggle just to set up your units, corps, fleets to start the game. Additionally, the AI is probably the poorest that I have seen in ten years. Its resemblance to the boardgame is very poor creating a disconnect for those accustom to the board game.

WiF, on the other hand, from what I have seen so far, is fuctionally much more intuitive (although I hope that the placement, movement, allocation of CPs is better than the former CWiF). The relationship to the original board game appears very good. For those familiar with the boardgame, I donot beleive that they will be dis-oriented when they first begin to play the computer version.

[iamspamus]

Eh-hmmmm. Have you been on the EiANW forum...? Yeah, people would do that...[:D]

Jason

ORIGINAL: SamuraiProgrammer

Finally, I don't think that someone will pay for the game simply so they can complain louder.

[SamuraiProgrmmr]

ORIGINAL: iamspamus


Eh-hmmmm. Have you been on the EiANW forum...? Yeah, people would do that...[:D]

Jason

ORIGINAL: SamuraiProgrammer

Finally, I don't think that someone will pay for the game simply so they can complain louder.

You might be right!

Most of that forum sounded like a Lite Beer (TM) commercial


PBEM!

AI!

PBEM!

AI!

TCP/IP!

PBEM!

AI!

PBEM!

AI!

Can't it be both or all three?

SHUT UP! <from three directions>


MERRY CHRISTMAS TO ALL !!!!!!