Valkyrie any good?

[Valkyrie]

I'm sold... it's Netflix for me!

Now, let the thread die and disappear so I can quit feeling like everyone is rating ME! [:'(][:'(][:'(]

[panzers]

ORIGINAL: wdolson

Yes, it's a new movie that has been heavily advertised.  It's about the German colonel who planted the bomb in the July 1944 assasination plot against Hitler.  Tom Cruise plays the colonel.

I never thought Tom Cruise was that great an actor, though he was great in Eyes Wide Shut.  He also looks nothing like the person he's supposed to be playing.

I haven't seen the movie and probably won't until we get it on Netflix.  My SO loves going to movies, but we don't get to many and she's unlikely to fork over money for the theater experience for something like that.

Bill

Clearly, you have never seen "a few good men" One of the great acting jobs of all time in my opinion with just about everyone involved not named Demi Moore

[RyanCrierie]

Saw it yesterday, was surprisingly good, there's only really one scene in the movie where you see TOM CRUISE instead of Stauffenberg.

Lack of accents didn't bother me, they started out with Stauffenberg speaking German in a voice over narrating his diary as he writes it (in sutterlin too!) in North Africa; and then segue into English with no accents for the rest of the movie essentially.

Apparently early in the production, they tried experimenting with german accents, but dropped it after Singer decided it was not really worth the trouble/too distracting.

Anyway, while they talk in English, all the written material is in German from not only the plan for VALKYRIE itself, but also for the various materials that come over teletype/telegram during the movie.

Also a surprisingly good recreation of Der Fuhrer's Wolf's Lair and Berghof; they even go down to the smallest detail, like the troops in the woods the Wolf's lair guarding it wearing mosquito netting over their helmets -- the place WAS built on a swamp for security measures int he first place...[/align]

[SlickWilhelm]

I was pleasantly surprised at how good it was. I was not expecting much because of all the pre-release anti-hype. But it was a solid WW2 thriller. Sure, there were a few little nits to pick(Calling Cruise's character "Colonel Stauffenberg, instead of Colonel von Stauffenberg), but the lack of German accents didn't bother me as much as I thought it would. Valkyrie uses the same method used in "The Hunt for Red October" to switch quickly from German to English. Lots of realistic period detail(real JU-52's and P-40's for instance), and the cinematography is outstanding.

The casting was very good, with all actors doing a nice job, especially Tom Wilkinson as Fromm. Probably the weakest link in the cast was the guy who (under)played Hitler. Too bad they couldn't have gotten Bruno Ganz to play him!

BTW, for those who think Tom Cruise is not a great actor....watch "Born on the Fourth of July" again and see him at his best.

Bottom line: 8 out of 10 stars(using the IMDB meter).

[RyanCrierie]

Lots of realistic period detail(real JU-52's and P-40's for instance
 
They had to use real P-40s, because they had spent all of their effects budget on digitally removing Cruise's hand and fingers to mimic Stauffenberg's injuries; so they hired out the planes. [:D]

[GJK]

ORIGINAL: RyanCrierie

Lots of realistic period detail(real JU-52's and P-40's for instance

They had to use real P-40s, because they had spent all of their effects budget on digitally removing Cruise's hand and fingers to mimic Stauffenberg's injuries; so they hired out the planes. [:D]

Perhaps some grog can answer this - did the "flying tiger" model actually fight in the N. Africa campaign?

[TheOx]

Watch "Der Untergang" or Downfall instead of this. You'll thank me later.

[wdolson]

ORIGINAL: GJK

Perhaps some grog can answer this - did the "flying tiger" model actually fight in the N. Africa campaign?

The specific model that the AVG used were diverted from a British order or Tomahawks (which is the British name for the early model P-40, the B and C). The P-40D and later were called Kittyhawks by the British. Both the Tomahawk and Kittyhawk fought in North Africa with the RAF.

North African Tomahawks and Kittyhawks were painted two tone brown on top and light blue on the bottom. The AVG's aircraft were painted in a green and brown scheme on top, which was the early war British Northern Europe scheme. The late war Northern Europe scheme was gray and green.

Bill

[GJK]

ORIGINAL: wdolson

ORIGINAL: GJK

Perhaps some grog can answer this - did the "flying tiger" model actually fight in the N. Africa campaign?

The specific model that the AVG used were diverted from a British order or Tomahawks (which is the British name for the early model P-40, the B and C). The P-40D and later were called Kittyhawks by the British. Both the Tomahawk and Kittyhawk fought in North Africa with the RAF.

North African Tomahawks and Kittyhawks were painted two tone brown on top and light blue on the bottom. The AVG's aircraft were painted in a green and brown scheme on top, which was the early war British Northern Europe scheme. The late war Northern Europe scheme was gray and green.

Bill

Thank you-

I'm curious about the "Flying Tiger" war theme that was painted on the P-40 in the movie. I don't think that any were painted as such in the N. Africa campaign; would I be correct?

[GJK]

ORIGINAL: TheOx

Watch "Der Untergang" or Downfall instead of this. You'll thank me later.

Agreed. Excellent movie that blows the socks off of Valkyrie, however you can't get enough of "kill Hitler" plots....

[wdolson]

ORIGINAL: GJK
Thank you-

I'm curious about the "Flying Tiger" war theme that was painted on the P-40 in the movie. I don't think that any were painted as such in the N. Africa campaign; would I be correct?

I haven't seen the movie yet, but if there were any in North Africa painted that was, they would have been rare. Planes did get diverted that were originally intended for other places. That's how the AVG ended up with their aircraft. The Med had its share of diverted orders too, but any aircraft arriving without desert equipment and desert camo would have been modified for the environment in Egypt upon arrival, including repainting. It would have been a rare situation where a plane was pushed to the front before it was repainted.

Bill

[Prince of Eckmühl]

ORIGINAL: wdolson

ORIGINAL: GJK
Thank you-

I'm curious about the "Flying Tiger" war theme that was painted on the P-40 in the movie. I don't think that any were painted as such in the N. Africa campaign; would I be correct?

I haven't seen the movie yet, but if there were any in North Africa painted that was, they would have been rare. Planes did get diverted that were originally intended for other places. That's how the AVG ended up with their aircraft. The Med had its share of diverted orders too, but any aircraft arriving without desert equipment and desert camo would have been modified for the environment in Egypt upon arrival, including repainting. It would have been a rare situation where a plane was pushed to the front before it was repainted.

Bill

The whole shark-theme came from Lend-Lease Commonwealth p-40 deployed to North Africa.

[GJK]

Ok, learn something new every day - per wikipedia:

AVG fighter aircraft were painted with a large shark face on the front of the aircraft. This was done after pilots saw a photograph of No. 112 Squadron RAF in North Africa sporting a fierce shark mouth, which in turn had adopted the shark motif from German pilots flying Messerschmitt Bf-110 fighters in Crete. About the same time, the AVG was dubbed "The Flying Tigers" by their Washington support group, called China Defense Supplies.

[Mobius]

I saw it today. It is pretty good. I saw a History Channel program on Stauffenberg. His and Cruise's profile view are a very good match.

[V22 Osprey]

I liked the movie, very well done.

I must get it on DVD when it comes out.

[Doggie]

ORIGINAL: GJK

Perhaps some grog can answer this - did the "flying tiger" model actually fight in the N. Africa campaign?

It depends on which "flying tiger model" you mean. The P-40B used by the AVG was intended for the RAF:



But the P-40E was also used by the RAF and the AVG.



The type you're most likely to see in a movie would be the later P-40N:



Once the AVG had been incorporated into the U.S. Army Air Corps, they flew the P-40K



You'll notice obvious differences between the various types. It gets even more complicated when you throw in the 'M" and "L" versions with different engines and tail assemblies.

The so called "inferior" P-40 remained in production until the end of the war.

[JudgeDredd]

One of my favourite planes of WWII.

[wdolson]

At least one of the P-40s in the movie was an E from the Warhawk Air Museum in Nampa, Idaho.  This P-40 flies in the colors of No. 112 squadron RAF.

The P-40F had a Packard Merlin engine, but shortages of that engine forced Curtiss to go back to the Allison engine, which had similar performance at low altitude, but was a much poorer performer at altitude.  The Merlin had a bottom mounted carburetor and the Allison had the carb on top (the DB 600 series and Jumo engines were fuel injected BTW).  So Allison powered Mustangs and P-40s have a scoop on top of the cowling for the carb.  Merlin powered planes don't have the scoop because the carburetor air is drawn into the scoop under the cowling.

The P-40M had a lengthened fuselage, but the horizontal stabilizer was in the same place, so the vertical and horizontal stabilizers are staggered with respect to one another.  This was continued on the N (the N and M were very similar with different canopies).  Earlier versions of the P-40 had the vertical and horizontal stabilizers pretty much in line with one another.

There are still some old P-40s around.  Paul Allen, who was one of the founders of Microsoft has been collecting extremely rare aircraft.  He has an Oscar I and an AVG P-40 that have both been restored to flying condition.  Both were wrecks that were recovered in the last 20 years.

Additionally, the Yanks Air Museum in Chino, CA has a P-40E-1 that I believe saw combat in the early days of the war.

Bill

[Hard Sarge]

ORIGINAL: GJK

ORIGINAL: wdolson

ORIGINAL: GJK

Perhaps some grog can answer this - did the "flying tiger" model actually fight in the N. Africa campaign?

The specific model that the AVG used were diverted from a British order or Tomahawks (which is the British name for the early model P-40, the B and C). The P-40D and later were called Kittyhawks by the British. Both the Tomahawk and Kittyhawk fought in North Africa with the RAF.

North African Tomahawks and Kittyhawks were painted two tone brown on top and light blue on the bottom. The AVG's aircraft were painted in a green and brown scheme on top, which was the early war British Northern Europe scheme. The late war Northern Europe scheme was gray and green.

Bill

Thank you-

I'm curious about the "Flying Tiger" war theme that was painted on the P-40 in the movie. I don't think that any were painted as such in the N. Africa campaign; would I be correct?

not seen the movie or the Planes, but are you asking about the sharkmouths ? if so, that would be 112 Squadron, who flew in the desert with the Kittyhawks and the sharkmouth, basicly, the AVG seen a pic of 112 in a Mag (Life ?) and liked it

which if you really dig into it, most Airforces ended up with Sharkmouths on something they flew, the LW flew Bf 110s and Ju 87s with the Sharkmouth also

(also have seen Spits and La's with them added, the P-51 and later F-4 Phantoms)

[Hard Sarge]

LOL, figures, should of finished the whole post, before replying, as the it was already replied to