Carrier Force - Matrix Games

[Ike99]

Which is a shame, becuase Justin and Mike are working on amazing game.

Change these two names to Gary and Joel and then you might be talking an amazing game.

Otherwise we got what we got...and that´s nothing.

[RGIJN]

ORIGINAL: Chad Harrison


With the NDA, obviously I may have said too much already, but I just wanted to attempt to be one calming voice here.

Cut them some slack. CF has not been forgotten.

Hope this helps.

Chad

Thanks for posting here chad. But as you can see things have heated up. And IMHO I think it´s not too much to expect at least some little info/update/feedback from Justin (Tankerace) after all what we contributed to his thread and all the announcements made about Carrier Force so far.
That´s everything I call for. But I can´t even remember his last post at all... So don´t wonder if we got to assume it´s a dead project hence.

Or am I wrong?

If not go and tell ´em what´s up here. They could shed some light on it. Of course this is not your business, even more so considering the NDA issue.

[Chad Harrison]

ORIGINAL: RGIJN

Thanks for posting here chad. But as you can see things have heated up. And IMHO I think it´s not too much to expect at least some little info/update/feedback from Justin (Tankerace) after all what we contributed to his thread and all the announcements made about Carrier Force so far.
That´s everything I call for. But I can´t even remember his last post at all... So don´t wonder if we got to assume it´s a dead project hence.

Or am I wrong?

If not go and tell ´em what´s up here. They could shed some light on it. Of course this is not your business, even more so considering the NDA issue.

Thanks for understanding RGIJN. I know that the hostile attidude of one is not shared by everyone else here. After all, this is a game that we all are looking forward too. But like any software, delays happen and unforseen code limitations and complications come up delaying a project.

Let me drop Justin a line and see if we can get some information regarding CF in here.

[Ike99]

Thanks for understanding RGIJN. I know that the hostile attidude of one is not shared by everyone else here.

Yeah maybe, or maybe I said in the open what everyone else is saying here in private and thinking.

Let me drop Justin a line and see if we can get some information regarding CF in here.

Yes, and while your dropping that line ask him where was he in the night carrier bombing debate? The question was asked how CF was going to adress this issue.

Erik Rutkins was on there.

Joel Billings was on there.

They were talking about it.

Where was he?

The thread had 8,000+ hits. Seems the community was interested in it. Why weren´t they? Why didn´t they adress the issue? Why were they not talking about how CF was handling this issue and find out how the community felt about it?

The question was asked to them.

The question again was asked on the what would you like to see in CF thread, again no responce.

Why has their CF thread not been touched in a year despite all the questions and comments??

They have some explaining to do I think if this is a active project...and I do not think it is.

[Chad Harrison]

ORIGINAL: Ike99

Yes, and while your dropping that line ask him where was he in the night carrier bombing debate? The question was asked how CF was going to adress this issue.

With such openly hostile, rude and self-righteous posts, I dont know how you expect anyone to ever reply to you.

[RGIJN]

[font="Trebuchet MS"]started the thread, not another war. So I´d recommend to calm down and keep quiet as long as "the developers" develop their response. Meanwhile, we´re just pretty excited to read something new.

But of course it should not take another year to respond!!! Since the weekend is looming, there is plenty of time for them to show up and for us to enjoy playing UV... [8D][/font]

[Chad Harrison]

There were a series of posts by Justin (Takerace) back in July 2007. You can find the link to the thread here:

Carrier Foce Thread (Old)

ORIGINAL: Tankerace

The reason CF is not listed under a coming soon and in development forum is mainly because I haven't asked for one yet. The more time Mike, I, or any of the beta testers spend answering questions, then the less time we have to work on the game.

CF, in its current form is actually very stable. I call it "semi-playable" because it is not finished, nor is it anywhere near "ready for release" and it most definately is not finished and ready for beta testing. As a UV style game, it is playable. As what we want for Carrier Force as its own game, we still have a lot of work to go.

Once CF enters the true beta stage, and we have a ballpark release date I will ask for CF forum to be created - but not before then. It has been my experience - namely, War Plan Orange, that as soon as the forum opens the public expects a release anywhere from 2 weeks to 2 months from that date. It is not so much a fear of hindering the game's progress, but of stirring up the public over an "imminent" release that is still months away. And then being swamped with "This is Vaporware" "Matrix is Bad" blah blah posts.

I point you to the Guns of August forum. I don't know how many "This is vaporware!" posts I've read in that forum, because that forum was around since it was in Alpha. It was active when I was designing WPO back in late 2004, and the game just came out this month. I don't intend for the same thing to happen here, so I will wait until the game is in Alpha OR until there are so many CF posts in this forum (as was the case with WPO in the WitP forums) that Matrix creates a forum to deal with it of their own accord.

I would be happy to answer any pertinent questions - but keep in mind that as the game is in Alpha stage and things are subject to change, I may or may not comment on everything (this is just a disclaimer basically, lol).

As producer of Carrier Force, maybe I can answer a few questions. Carrier Force IS under development, and is moving forward. At this stage, as Mike said, it is still in Alpha testing, but is relatively playable right now. No release date is set right now, but I can confirm it is not vaporware.

Actually I can verify that CF is NOT the only game being produced that doesn't have an in development forum. I can think of two others of the top of my head. I know one is hush hush, dunno about the other.

Again, asking a question won't delay CF. Being deluged might (at least if Mike is answering them all, and that is what HE has told me). Also, with regards to CF testers, we have about 12 actually, almost all of whom post regularly (though I suspect mainly in the WitP forums). Given that the testers have all agreed to respect my wishes regarding Non disclosure, you'll do better just asking me or Mike Wood a question.

Again, I have no problem answering questions. But I do not (again, like with WPO) have a desire to play rumor control.

After reading these 1.5 year old posts, I can say that Justin has much more wisdom than me in what to say and when. WPO proved to be a great learning lesson for him and I would recommend re-reading his comments above. It actually answers a lot and is still valid today.

Again, hope this helps.

Chad

[Ike99]

With such openly hostile, rude and self-righteous posts, I dont know how you expect anyone to ever reply to you.

Some people, correction, some customers might consider it rude, hostile, self righteous, etc. for a blah, not worth my keystrokes.[8|]

Ike-Doubtful they even read the other thread on CF or will read this one unless someone PM them about it.

Chad-Let me drop Justin a line and see if we can get some information regarding CF in here.

Thanks for proving me right.

[RGIJN]

ORIGINAL: RGIJN

[font="Trebuchet MS"]started the thread, not another war. So I´d recommend to calm down and keep quiet as long as "the developers" develop their response. Meanwhile, we´re just pretty excited to read something new.

But of course it should not take another year to respond!!! Since the weekend is looming, there is plenty of time for them to show up and for us to enjoy playing UV... [8D][/font]

ONCE MORE . . .

Chad - don´t repeat those ancient posts. The long spacing since those days are the reason for this thread here. I was asking for true and present, actual and current info from the CF team.
Let´s just see what happens!

IKE - calm down and let them show up. If they don´t, our presumptions will get proved right. (what I do not hope!)

[Ike99]

Also Chad, if you´re an active playtester for carrier force why do you need to ask Justin for information on carrier force?

Hmmmm...

Is it because your not actively play testing anything because CF is not a active project?

Vaporware.

[Ike99]

ONCE MORE . . .

Chad - don´t repeat those ancient posts. The long spacing since those days are the reason for this thread here. I was asking for true and present, actual and current info from the CF team.
Let´s just see what happens!

IKE - calm down and let them show up. If they don´t, our presumptions will get proved right. (what I do not hope!)

OK RGIJN, I think I proved my point.

I´m sure Justin will be on (After his PM[;)]) here saying how he is feverishly working on Carrier Force but I think the opposite should be obvious to all.

I´m done.

[Nomad]

I need to remember to be quiet. [&:]

[SuluSea]

Ike , I think it's clear for most to see your tone in this thread towards the developer is over the top.

I want Carrier Force as bad as the next person, I've asked for information in the forums and they weren't addressed, a month or so ago I PM'd one of the developers asking about info and have recieved no reply. I'm disapointed as well as the next person about the lack of info but there's a right way and wrong way to go about asking things.

[Ike99]

Ike , I think it's clear for most to see your tone in this thread towards the developer is over the top.

I want Carrier Force as bad as the next person, I've asked for information in the forums and they weren't addressed, a month or so ago I PM'd one of the developers asking about info and have recieved no reply. I'm disapointed as well as the next person about the lack of info but there's a right way and wrong way to go about asking things.

I´m not over the top. They´re over the top.

[Chad Harrison]

Thats the first time I have ever had to use the green button . . .
 
For everyone else, I have been in contact with Joel and Justin and they are aware of this thread and that you are all looking for a status update of CF. With the NDA and all, this is obviously out of my power.
 
Thanks again for all your patience.
 
Hopefully we will be playing CF PBEM soon enough [:D]
 
Thanks
 
Chad

[decaro]

ORIGINAL: Ike99

I´m not over the top. They´re over the top.

Over the "flat" top?

Ike, I know your life isn't on hold waiting for this game, and not only have I been waiting for CF, but BftB as well.
Well, maybe next Xmas.

I've also had similar qualms re CF because it wasn't listed on the Matrix "In Development" section, but I was assured -- some time ago -- that it was (very) quietly being developed.

[Ike99]

Chad Harrison-Thats the first time I have ever had to use the green button . . .

Congradulations.

However this address nothing of what I said and it does not excuse the lack of feedback and the disregard for the community.

These actions are not acceptable in any customer/provider relationship that I know of.

For everyone else, I have been in contact with Joel and Justin and they are aware of this thread and that you are all looking for a status update of CF. With the NDA and all, this is obviously out of my power.

uh huh...¨Joel¨

Like I said, without Gary or Joel this project is dead in the water. It´s like the Bismark spinning in a circle with a broken rudder never to reach port. They, or one of them will be the driving force behind Carrier Force if there is any.

We have seen what happened when this project was handed over from them to others 2 years ago.

Thanks again for all your patience.

Thanks Joel for finding out what the hell was going on with this project and getting it back on course.

Thanks for responding to the PM´s I have, and others have sent you. Thanks for participating on the Night Carrier bombing thread.

It lets us, as customers know you do not take our business/money for granted. I wish I could say the same about others but I can´t.

Without knowing either you or Gary was actively involved in this project I wouldn´t touch it given the example others have set around this project. I know where the talent is coming from.

Hopefully we will be playing CF PBEM soon enough.

Only if Joel or Gary is involved in it, otherwise I seriously doubt it.

Tankerace-Once CF enters the true beta stage, and we have a ballpark release date I will ask for CF forum to be created - but not before then.

From what you posted here, Carrier Force went from Alpha, to Alpha in 2 full years after Joel handed it over.

[Ike99]

Over the "flat" top?

Ike, I know your life isn't on hold waiting for this game, and not only have I been waiting for CF, but BftB as well.
Well, maybe next Xmas.

I've also had similar qualms re CF because it wasn't listed on the Matrix "In Development" section, but I was assured -- some time ago -- that it was (very) quietly being developed.

Joe, you´re missing the point.

It´s not the fact that CF isn´t on the developers list or is delayed. It´s this total disregard of their very own thread for a year of CF and PM´s to them about the game. Their lack of participation here. That´s what the point is and why I have a problem and say it is vaporware and others are saying that privately.

What else can one think?!

If you go to the Battle of Britian/Bombing the Reich game you will see it is also delayed BUT, you will also see Hard_Sarge and the other developers on that forum keeping close ties with the community, making post, comments, taking questions,etc. Being active.

I can see the developers are commited to their project and it will be released and they´ll support it after release. I feel secure buying the game from what I am seeing from that team.

With Carrier Force, No.

I see nothing. I see a CF thread that hasn´t been touched in a year and more than one person, myself included who they did not reply to in PM. That they have not been active on here, at all.

I have no faith here and even if they do release something eventually with this attitude I seriously question the quality of the product we will see and what the support level will be after release.

Interesting Justin made this comment...

I point you to the Guns of August forum. I don't know how many "This is vaporware!" posts I've read in that forum, because that forum was around since it was in Alpha.

I went to that forum and what did I see? Third post down.

And Why will I not be BUYING this game ???? Because I can not get a simple answer to a question I posted before X-mass..........

Man........ Frank and Matrix tech support is really going down Hill FAST............(

AP514

Sounds like what we are seeing here to me. I can see the pattern.

If a developer doesn´t support their product before release why would anyone seriously expect them to support it after release? If they get released at all.

[Prince of Eckmühl]

Hey Ike, I found your hooch: [:D]

http://www3.ocn.ne.jp/~mashiyu/

[borner]

Flat top?  good board game, but almost unplayable. God Bless computer tech!!!!
 
I also would love to see a CF update, and if some of the issues with UV ( my personal favorite is allied fighter strength, will be addresses)