Road question

[balto]

I am still goofing around as Prussia in 1803 with Advanced Economy, trying to get a handle on this freaking awesome game.

10.2.1. If the level or Roads is higher then the Development level of something you want to develop, the Development time is halved. I was checking that out with the following test, and the 'halving' feature did not work. Can someone tell me what I am missing.

Warsaw and Plotsk both have 4 Men and both have Factory level 2. Factory level 2 requires 12 labor. I put all the labor in Development that is possible and the rest in Textile. They both take 3 turns to complete Factory level 3, which makes sense because 4 Men x 3 turns = 12 Labor.

The problem is Warsaw has level 2 Road (same level as Factory, so no benefit); Plotsk has level 5 Road (hogher level then Factory, so should get benefit). So Plotsk should have done it half the time.., but it had no effect.

Am I missing something?

[Franck]

Bump,
I'm interested in this subject

[ericbabe]

I checked and there was a little bug in this routine-- it was comparing new level +2 to roads rather than new level to roads.  Thanks.

[balto]

[font="times new roman"]I really really am still goofing around as Prussia in 1803 with Advanced Economy, trying to get a handle on this freaking awesome game.  I hope I am not being annoying with these Economy tests.[/font]
[font="times new roman"] [/font]
[font="times new roman"]This time I was testing the to see if the Farm was increasing output.[/font]
[font="times new roman"] [/font]
[font="times new roman"]Farms are supposed to increase Food and other stuff 10%. [/font]
[font="times new roman"] [/font]
[font="times new roman"]Danzig and Konigsberg both have 4 Men and both have Factory level 4. [/font]
[font="times new roman"] [/font]
[font="times new roman"]Danzig has Farm level 4.  Konigsberg has Farm level 2.  So Danzig should produce 20% more Food then Konigsberg[/font]
[font="times new roman"] [/font]
[font="times new roman"]I put all of the labor in Agriculture that is possible and the rest in Development for both Danzig and Konigsberg.[/font]
[font="times new roman"] [/font]
[font="times new roman"]The problem is Danzig produced 16 Food and Konigsberg produced 18 Food.  So instead of Danzig producing 20% more food because of its 2 extra Farms, it produced 12.5% less.[/font]
[font="times new roman"] [/font]
[font="times new roman"]Am I missing something?[/font]

[jnpoint]

Interesting - I hope you are wrong, otherwise the game has a great problem, and need a patch very soon.

[Hard Sarge]

hassle is your wrong (your missing something

each province has limits and numbers, a province that is good at making Timber, may still only give you 3 or 4 timber even if everybody is working on timber, and a province that is not good at making Timber may give you 7 or 8, with the same settings,

it is better at making something else but still has a lot of woods around, you can not go by just numbers (there is a lot more under the hood, then just I got 3 here and 3 there so they should be the same, there are alot of other factors in there that gives you the totals you can or should get)

Ralighs old guide to provinces should help and I am sure someone else will make another one something like that for the newer provinces

[balto]

Hard Sarge, I have a feeling you are right because this seems very wrong.  But could you elaborate?  It also seems that you are using Timber not Food.., I used Food.., you are throwing around numbers such as 3, I am throwing around Food numbers at 16 and 18.
 
Neither one of the Provinces I used is good at making Food.., so that variable is out the window.  Please help to understand because if there is more under the hood, if I could just have a hint at what I am missing, I would be grateful.

[Hard Sarge]

well, you would have to look at the provinces to see what I mean

you have max or starting levels for each of the goods you can make, building upgrades will improve this, also the number of pop you have and the number of labor that is assigned to each of these builds/production types

so in your case, the one province may have a higher starting level of food that can be grown, then the other province, even though they both have the same amount, or different amounts of upgrades built in that province

(hmmm)

so, say, province one has a starting level of 25 food, and province two has a starting level of 20, one may have 2 farms and 4 Pop, but it can grow 25 food, while two has 4 farms and 4 Pop, it can only grow 20

(two may have more/better farms, it just does not have as much good land as one does)

(and there is more to it then that, just trying to keep it simi simple)

during testing there were tons and tons of questions and answers about how it works, should work and all of that

Really, wait until you start playing with Textiles, that will drive you nuts

[Hard Sarge]

well, you would have to look at the provinces to see what I mean

sorry at times I am bad at trying to explain things and tend to get the person more confused, I think you know what I am talking about, so forget to give the right details

as I was saying before, look at Ralighs guide to CoG, I believe he goes into some of this info on the provinces

with in the game files, you can look at some of the provinces, some of it is code some of it is just numbers, but it all means something

[Hard Sarge]

tt.asp?forumid=202 

[Russian Guard]

Another way of looking at this - it seems that your assumption is that all provinces are the same at some base level, and so ones with more Farms and Pop should produce more Food than one with less Farms and less Pop (for example).

But it doesn't work that way; Provinces have a variable base level of ability to porduce each item, based upon historical data as to that region's production, and modifiers that affect their ability to produce these items in greater quantities. A few of these factors can be modded in the txt files, I believe.

It does make it harder to "numbers crunch" and see exactly what's happening.

[jnpoint]

ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge

hassle is your wrong (your missing something

each province has limits and numbers, a province that is good at making Timber, may still only give you 3 or 4 timber even if everybody is working on timber, and a province that is not good at making Timber may give you 7 or 8, with the same settings,

it is better at making something else but still has a lot of woods around, you can not go by just numbers (there is a lot more under the hood, then just I got 3 here and 3 there so they should be the same, there are alot of other factors in there that gives you the totals you can or should get)

Ralighs old guide to provinces should help and I am sure someone else will make another one something like that for the newer provinces

If that is true, how can I then know, what is best to build in that province? I only have the numbers!

[Ironclad]

Its listed on the Development (Province Management)screen beneath the labour allocation section.

[Ironclad]

Actually trial and error is not a bad way to go. If you have two provinces where iron is the preferred resource, compare their iron production when you fill each of their iron sliders to the same level of labour. If one gives you 15 iron and the other 3, you may want to use the latter for another resource you are short of where it gives you a decent return for labour deployed. The need for food often makes agriculture a frequent second choice (particularly if you have few "agricultural" provinces. Sometimes labour will be a suitable second choice expecially in provinces with a significant number of men. Sticking with the example, if you are desperate for iron and have few "iron" provinces you may need to concentrate them all on iron production, even where some give a very low rate of return.

If you over produce by taking advantage of high rates of production for the same resource across a number of provinces with that specialiam it can be traded for those items you are short of.

[balto]

Excellent input.  Hard Sarge Russian Guard and Ironclad so the three top resources are those 'hidden' strengths?'  That would make sense then because Konigsberg has more food as one of its three "Top Resources."
 
But if that is the case.., then what the heck does the "BEST RESOURCE" mean that is within the Province Box: Konigsberg's is Textile and Wool; Danzig is Luxuries and Timber? 
 
To summarize each province has its best three BASE production resources listed AND then one of two BEST RESOURCES?  Am I getting this now? 
 
Thanks a million

[Ironclad]

Just to clarify that when I was using the words "preferred resource" or "specialism" this was just my shorthand for the best resource. By second choice I simply meant whatever you choose to concentrate most of your labour on instead if you decide not to concentrate on that best resource. Even then it probably still makes sense to use some of the surplus labour on the best resource unless this is needed for the development slider or another resource category which is urgently required.

[balto]

Hi Ironclad, not sure what you are saying, but I think you are commenting on the game term BEST RESOURCE.  Not sure.
 
But what about the three "BASE productin Resources?"  Are they what HardSarge and RussianGuard were talking about? 

[Ironclad]

Yes, I was referring to the game term BEST RESOURCE. I will leave your other question for HS or RG.

[morganbj]

Wait until my economic guide is done in a few weeks.  All this will be explained sufficiently enough to play the game using the Advanced Economy.

[madgamer2]

When you use the simple economy is it this difficult? The eco/building part of FoF is what drove me to stop playing that game. As much as I love the period and scope of the game I have to be able to understand and be able to play that part of the game. If I can't at least understand the basic concepts and necessary things I must do it sort of nullifies the fun of the game for me (SIGH)

Madgamer