Brave WIF boardgamers

[willycube]

I have read the rules, read the posts and I am amazed how you WIF boardgamers played this game. I am assuming that when you make a wrong move in Mwif computer game eg. put one of your assets in the wrong sea box etc. Mr. Okeets will have some kind of an electrical charge go through the computer and zap you, maybe even send you to an ER in the hospital which will guarantee that you will never make that mistake again WHEW! How did you people play this game, did you make mistakes that werent caught by either side or maybe with six players in the game not noticing an error. Looking up tables on dice rolls etc. wow! Were you able to play others who may not have been in your house with some kind of mail [guess not] or were all games played in someones home, did alot of you play solitare and was that a decent way to play this game for your enjoyment, how did you find other players? Were they neighborhood people or friends from another town or city and you got together for a game once in awhile? How could you remember these rules, would you look them up while playing the game? I am truly interested how you gentlemen did this.

Willy

[Franck]

Huh, I never write much here... But I played 3 games in my life. One PBEM.

The rules are really easy to learn once you get the hang of it.

[Vincenzo_Beretta]

I played WiF only once (the "Fascist Tide" scenario), but I really liked it. And having other experienced players at the table helped me learn the rules and develop strategies that made sense even if I was a noob. Maybe playing as Italy added a layer of role-playing to the experience [;)]

As usual, it is not difficult at all if you have some helpful friends around. Many games take time to learn simply because you have to look for a rule again and again, wereas with a friend you just have to ask - then, after the first game, reading the rules becomes easier because you now use them just to clarify things and fill gaps. I guess that, in the PC version, part of the "friend" role will be assumed by the program - via the tutorial and the impossibility to do actions not allowed by the rules.

[Sewerlobster]

ORIGINAL: willycube
I have read the rules, read the posts and I am amazed how you WIF boardgamers played this game. I am assuming that when you make a wrong move in Mwif computer game eg. put one of your assets in the wrong sea box etc. Mr. Okeets will have some kind of an electrical charge go through the computer and zap you, maybe even send you to an ER in the hospital which will guarantee that you will never make that mistake again WHEW! How did you people play this game, did you make mistakes that werent caught by either side or maybe with six players in the game not noticing an error. Looking up tables on dice rolls etc. wow! Were you able to play others who may not have been in your house with some kind of mail [guess not] or were all games played in someones home, did alot of you play solitare and was that a decent way to play this game for your enjoyment, how did you find other players? Were they neighborhood people or friends from another town or city and you got together for a game once in awhile? How could you remember these rules, would you look them up while playing the game? I am truly interested how you gentlemen did this.
Willy

My circle of friends are wargamers. Since we were in our early teens (I'm 43), we played games of Third Reich, Starfleet Battles, and yes World in Flames. I certainly would not have recommended WiF to someone who had never played a wargame before as it is obviously a little more complex then Tactics or Afrika Corps. But this is definitely a playable game and so I'll answer some of your questions.

We always played this game in one of our homes as there are just too many in turn decisions to make Play by Mail realistically possible (good luck to Steve on getting a computer to do it -- I'm impressed). We'd play 3 or 4 turns a sitting and the leave the game set up for the next time.

And mistakes? heck I own 172 wargames and have yet to play one mistake free. Usually the first 2 or 3 games are riddled with rule misinterpretations. We even revel in them -- accusing our opponents of "cheating to win". I really think MWiF will help because it won't let you misinterpret a rule - what is coded shall be. In fact I'm certain I and those of my group will learn some rule we've been using incorrectly because of MWiF. As for strategic mistakes, they are what make the game.

World in Flames is an excellent solitaire experience. The scale, the nature of WWII and this game's initiative system lend to allowing the solitaire player to play both sides quite easily. The Axis have the initiative at the start and so long as you set up the Allies as you would versus a real opponent it's a great play.

And goodness yes we would look up rules while we played. After the first game or two, you'll remember all of the common rules pretty easily. But in every game you'll to go to the rules for something, just to refresh.

If you don't have a circle of grognards as friends, don't despair. You not only have this forum, which will soon be chock full of "MWiF game opponents wanted" posts, but you can try your local hobby shop to find a gaming group (play whatever they're playing) or go to a gaming convention where you can see fanatics wage war on each other.

If all else fails, try the game solitaire and ask questions on this forum as you get stuck. Answering rule and gaming questions is the next best thing to playing for us old wargamers.

[borner]

WiF is very playable, but not for the half-hearted. To play WiF, you also need a group of 3-5 players availabe all day at least once a weekend, and someone who does not mind giving up a very large room, or two, in the house for a year.  [8D]

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: SewerStarFish

ORIGINAL: willycube
I have read the rules, read the posts and I am amazed how you WIF boardgamers played this game. I am assuming that when you make a wrong move in Mwif computer game eg. put one of your assets in the wrong sea box etc. Mr. Okeets will have some kind of an electrical charge go through the computer and zap you, maybe even send you to an ER in the hospital which will guarantee that you will never make that mistake again WHEW! How did you people play this game, did you make mistakes that werent caught by either side or maybe with six players in the game not noticing an error. Looking up tables on dice rolls etc. wow! Were you able to play others who may not have been in your house with some kind of mail [guess not] or were all games played in someones home, did alot of you play solitare and was that a decent way to play this game for your enjoyment, how did you find other players? Were they neighborhood people or friends from another town or city and you got together for a game once in awhile? How could you remember these rules, would you look them up while playing the game? I am truly interested how you gentlemen did this.
Willy

My circle of friends are wargamers. Since we were in our early teens (I'm 43), we played games of Third Reich, Starfleet Battles, and yes World in Flames. I certainly would not have recommended WiF to someone who had never played a wargame before as it is obviously a little more complex then Tactics or Afrika Corps. But this is definitely a playable game and so I'll answer some of your questions.

We always played this game in one of our homes as there are just too many in turn decisions to make Play by Mail realistically possible (good luck to Steve on getting a computer to do it -- I'm impressed). We'd play 3 or 4 turns a sitting and the leave the game set up for the next time.

And mistakes? heck I own 172 wargames and have yet to play one mistake free. Usually the first 2 or 3 games are riddled with rule misinterpretations. We even revel in them -- accusing our opponents of "cheating to win". I really think MWiF will help because it won't let you misinterpret a rule - what is coded shall be. In fact I'm certain I and those of my group will learn some rule we've been using incorrectly because of MWiF. As for strategic mistakes, they are what make the game.

World in Flames is an excellent solitaire experience. The scale, the nature of WWII and this game's initiative system lend to allowing the solitaire player to play both sides quite easily. The Axis have the initiative at the start and so long as you set up the Allies as you would versus a real opponent it's a great play.

And goodness yes we would look up rules while we played. After the first game or two, you'll remember all of the common rules pretty easily. But in every game you'll to go to the rules for something, just to refresh.

If you don't have a circle of grognards as friends, don't despair. You not only have this forum, which will soon be chock full of "MWiF game opponents wanted" posts, but you can try your local hobby shop to find a gaming group (play whatever they're playing) or go to a gaming convention where you can see fanatics wage war on each other.

If all else fails, try the game solitaire and ask questions on this forum as you get stuck. Answering rule and gaming questions is the next best thing to playing for us old wargamers.

When things were looking very bad for one side, they would spend more time reading the rules, looking for some reason to declare the entire game flawed because an 'importnat' rule had been misplayed.[:D] but this was true for all board games, not just WIF.

[Ullern]

ORIGINAL: willycube

I have read the rules, read the posts and I am amazed how you WIF boardgamers played this game. I am assuming that when you make a wrong move in Mwif computer game eg. put one of your assets in the wrong sea box etc. Mr. Okeets will have some kind of an electrical charge go through the computer and zap you, maybe even send you to an ER in the hospital which will guarantee that you will never make that mistake again WHEW! How did you people play this game, did you make mistakes that werent caught by either side or maybe with six players in the game not noticing an error. Looking up tables on dice rolls etc. wow! Were you able to play others who may not have been in your house with some kind of mail [guess not] or were all games played in someones home, did alot of you play solitare and was that a decent way to play this game for your enjoyment, how did you find other players? Were they neighborhood people or friends from another town or city and you got together for a game once in awhile? How could you remember these rules, would you look them up while playing the game? I am truly interested how you gentlemen did this.

Willy

Probably a lot of errors isn't caught by anyone, but we check those rules or limits that are broken most often. It would not be possible to check all, it would simply take to much time and take the fun out of the game, so therefore you have to play with someone you trust wouldn't cheat intentionally.

Those rule's we check most often are:
if a land combat occurs: check that units were in supply both for the move and for the land combat (almost always)
Also for land combat: recalculate the odds and the +es.
Check activity limits is kept: Air missions, naval moves, and land moves, checked maybe every second impulse on average.
Demand that opponent state clearly what kind of impulse they have before they roll the first dice (almost always)
Check build points are calculated correctly: Maybe once every sixth turn.

We sometimes allow mulligans, but allowing mulligans has its dubious sides, since opponent may already have spent some unit or activity limits on a move that was triggered by the error.
_But one mulligan we always give: An unit causing over stacking is always allowed to move somewhere else.

Interesting topic. What you other guys do?

[willycube]

Thank you Sewerstarfish and Ullern deeply appreciate you gentlemen taking the time to answer my questions and you both did it royally and with great aplomb [not sure what that means but sounds good] it must have taken up a lot of room, the maps I mean. And I have heard of horror stories about the cat jumping onto the map and knocking all the counters around. Hope that did not happen to you, thanks for clearing up some game problems for me. Were there any divorces over this game?

Willy

[Anendrue]

A lot of rooom for maps, yes. I remember a few years ago I stunbled across a guy who covered a wall in steel and used magnetic counters. He meticuously split every counter in half and made a front back counter on magnetic tape. According to my last check the MWiF map would be 16 feet x 10 feet. If Matrix does a printed map as has been discussed my garage will indeed need an update and perhaps a steel wall to boot. [:D]

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: willycube

Thank you Sewerstarfish and Ullern deeply appreciate you gentlemen taking the time to answer my questions and you both did it royally and with great aplomb [not sure what that means but sounds good] it must have taken up a lot of room, the maps I mean. And I have heard of horror stories about the cat jumping onto the map and knocking all the counters around. Hope that did not happen to you, thanks for clearing up some game problems for me. Were there any divorces over this game?

Willy

If so, then that was probably for the best.

[Mad Russian]

I put together a gaming room in the efficiency apartment in my backyard.

We played for more than 10 years meeting every Thursday night from 7-10pm. We had between 4-8 gamers at any one time and probably averaged around 6.

I have a 4'x8' gaming table, that we constructed out of 2x4's and pressed wood, that was covered with the thinnest plexiglass that I could buy.

The gaming room was open at all hours to the group for strategy planning.

I still have over 400 board wargames, if you count all the magazine games, and not counting the ones I made myself, which is another dozen or so.......[X(]

We haven't used the game room in more than 10 years. The group broke up and moved to different parts of the country. MWiF is about to bring us all back together. We all still game with each other, with computer games, just not all the same game...at least not until this coming July.

We had the most dedicated gamers I know of. One of our gamers quit a job because they were going to make him work on gaming night. He also skipped his son's graduation because it fell on a gaming night.....no, he didn't get a divorce although the rest of us were all amazed that he didn't.

As to how you play error free, that's easy. You never do. The guys that make the least amount of mistakes usually win the game. Concerning rules mistakes, you keep on reading them through. Everytime you play. Over and over and even then you still find things. I've already found things in the upcoming MWiF that I don't see people talking about on these forums. Either they don't work the way I read them or the other gamers don't see it the same way  or it may not work like it appears it will. Any of those has even odds of being correct. The tutorials are very enlightening for a veteran player wanting to brush up on his skills.

Good Hunting.

MR

[LiquidSky]

No matter what rules MWif uses..you cant argue with the computer
 
 

[SkyElf]

Me and my four other friends played many games of WIF since it came out with some of its addons! One of us had a basement with a 1/2 plywood build on sawhorse like legs with some very large sheets of thin plexyl glass to cover map, if I remember correctly three sheets. We played usely on Friday or Saturday night starting between 6:30pm too about 12:30am to as late as 3:00am if game was intense at that time. The players were setup to play Germany, Italy/Japan, France/USA, Commonwealth, USSR/China now if one of us could not make it some one on his side would play for him. During the summer we might miss a few weekends with vacation, etc. This game took a long time commentment from the group. Between games we would play other games also. Most of us had a large number of games collectioned. Early on I had two sheet of of thin plexyl glass to cover two maps size sheets of SPI games with my first few gaming buddies, we use these on my large kitchen table. One of my other friends later on not of this group had a large table top gaming table he setup in basement of his house. A few times we even played out side and inside with HG Wells book Little Wars printed 1913 table top gaming! The first board game I played was Waterlo by Avalon Hill I picked up when I seen the movie, and went past a Hobby Store game was in the window, but I degress. Had many hundreds of happy hors playing this game alone! Still might be playing it but I moved to the USA, from Canada. I notice I did not mention how we settle disputs in game we all read the rule then had a vote if a tie a die highest die role one out!

SkyElf

[Mad Russian]

Our rules disputes were also done by vote and in case of a tie, by a die roll.

And while computers take that issue away it also, for the most part takes away house rules. Where you find something you disagree with in the rules and change it yourselves.

Good Hunting.

MR

[willycube]

ORIGINAL: Mad Russian

I put together a gaming room in the efficiency apartment in my backyard.

We played for more than 10 years meeting every Thursday night from 7-10pm. We had between 4-8 gamers at any one time and probably averaged around 6.

I have a 4'x8' gaming table, that we constructed out of 2x4's and pressed wood, that was covered with the thinnest plexiglass that I could buy.

The gaming room was open at all hours to the group for strategy planning.

I still have over 400 board wargames, if you count all the magazine games, and not counting the ones I made myself, which is another dozen or so.......[X(]

We haven't used the game room in more than 10 years. The group broke up and moved to different parts of the country. MWiF is about to bring us all back together. We all still game with each other, with computer games, just not all the same game...at least not until this coming July.

We had the most dedicated gamers I know of. One of our gamers quit a job because they were going to make him work on gaming night. He also skipped his son's graduation because it fell on a gaming night.....no, he didn't get a divorce although the rest of us were all amazed that he didn't.

As to how you play error free, that's easy. You never do. The guys that make the least amount of mistakes usually win the game. Concerning rules mistakes, you keep on reading them through. Everytime you play. Over and over and even then you still find things. I've already found things in the upcoming MWiF that I don't see people talking about on these forums. Either they don't work the way I read them or the other gamers don't see it the same way  or it may not work like it appears it will. Any of those has even odds of being correct. The tutorials are very enlightening for a veteran player wanting to brush up on his skills.

Good Hunting.

MR

Thank you Skyelf and Mad Russian for your time, very curious would you sit or stand the whole time so as to see the board maps better.

Willy

[willycube]

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

ORIGINAL: willycube

Thank you Sewerstarfish and Ullern deeply appreciate you gentlemen taking the time to answer my questions and you both did it royally and with great aplomb [not sure what that means but sounds good] it must have taken up a lot of room, the maps I mean. And I have heard of horror stories about the cat jumping onto the map and knocking all the counters around. Hope that did not happen to you, thanks for clearing up some game problems for me. Were there any divorces over this game?

Willy

If so, then that was probably for the best.

And people here told me you had no sense of humor wow! I have a feeling there is going to be a lot of sleepless nights and poor little wives laying in bed fretting over the loss of their husbands to a foolish game when the two of you could be watching Martha Stewart or Desperate housewives [pardon the pun] or Judge Judy or at least something that would enrich both of your lives TOGETHER!

Willy

[Mad Russian]

ORIGINAL: willycube

ORIGINAL: Mad Russian

I put together a gaming room in the efficiency apartment in my backyard.

We played for more than 10 years meeting every Thursday night from 7-10pm. We had between 4-8 gamers at any one time and probably averaged around 6.

I have a 4'x8' gaming table, that we constructed out of 2x4's and pressed wood, that was covered with the thinnest plexiglass that I could buy.

The gaming room was open at all hours to the group for strategy planning.

I still have over 400 board wargames, if you count all the magazine games, and not counting the ones I made myself, which is another dozen or so.......[X(]

We haven't used the game room in more than 10 years. The group broke up and moved to different parts of the country. MWiF is about to bring us all back together. We all still game with each other, with computer games, just not all the same game...at least not until this coming July.

We had the most dedicated gamers I know of. One of our gamers quit a job because they were going to make him work on gaming night. He also skipped his son's graduation because it fell on a gaming night.....no, he didn't get a divorce although the rest of us were all amazed that he didn't.

As to how you play error free, that's easy. You never do. The guys that make the least amount of mistakes usually win the game. Concerning rules mistakes, you keep on reading them through. Everytime you play. Over and over and even then you still find things. I've already found things in the upcoming MWiF that I don't see people talking about on these forums. Either they don't work the way I read them or the other gamers don't see it the same way  or it may not work like it appears it will. Any of those has even odds of being correct. The tutorials are very enlightening for a veteran player wanting to brush up on his skills.

Good Hunting.

MR

Thank you Skyelf and Mad Russian for your time, very curious would you sit or stand the whole time so as to see the board maps better.

Willy

The game room is complete with a set of the elevated bar stools. That lets you sit and still be high enough to see alot of the map at once. Of course you could get up and move around anytime you wanted. My library is also in the game room so there was no lack of reading material for those that got bored.......[>:]

Good Hunting.

MR

[praem]

I've played in 3 different gaming groups - one was set up in an abandont shipyard, and housed a number of games. The other 2 where in 2-room appartments. The map was mounted on plywood and werry carefully placed under a sofa btw. gaming nigths. Vacuuming was done with the greatest of care - wouldnt do to have a front disapear into the machine
 
The main problem wasn't counters being disturbed and we never lost one to the vacuumer, but the dust settling on the map and counters was a problem [;)]

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: praem

I've played in 3 different gaming groups - one was set up in an abandont shipyard, and housed a number of games. The other 2 where in 2-room appartments. The map was mounted on plywood and werry carefully placed under a sofa btw. gaming nigths. Vacuuming was done with the greatest of care - wouldnt do to have a front disapear into the machine

The main problem wasn't counters being disturbed and we never lost one to the vacuumer, but the dust settling on the map and counters was a problem [;)]

I used 4 glass sheets (30" by 30") over the maps so the counters were on top of the glass. This let us stack the glass and take down the tables (30" by 60") when not playing. I used large 6 sided dice in the corners as separators for the glass sheets, so the counters were not disturbed (some tall stacks needed to be subdivided). This arrangement meant only the top sheet of glass was subjected to the prevalent air pollution; the other 3/4 of the game was more or less covered/protected.

[gridley]

ORIGINAL: willycube

I have read the rules, read the posts and I am amazed how you WIF boardgamers played this game. I am assuming that when you make a wrong move in Mwif computer game eg. put one of your assets in the wrong sea box etc. Mr. Okeets will have some kind of an electrical charge go through the computer and zap you, maybe even send you to an ER in the hospital which will guarantee that you will never make that mistake again WHEW! How did you people play this game, did you make mistakes that werent caught by either side or maybe with six players in the game not noticing an error. Looking up tables on dice rolls etc. wow! Were you able to play others who may not have been in your house with some kind of mail [guess not] or were all games played in someones home, did alot of you play solitare and was that a decent way to play this game for your enjoyment, how did you find other players? Were they neighborhood people or friends from another town or city and you got together for a game once in awhile? How could you remember these rules, would you look them up while playing the game? I am truly interested how you gentlemen did this.

Willy

Mistakes are just a part of the game. Normally though they were either caught by the guy making the mistake or by the opponent...usually by the opponent.[;)] Thats why it is great playing with long time friends, there was very rarely [;)]"you cheating bas%&rd"

We always played at my place. When I was single it was in my apartment. After I got married we had a room seperatred from the house that was perfect...now it's an inlaw suite...sigh. We are now setting up our first game in years at another players house. I actually have to drive now.[:(]

I've never played solitaire, but I will soon with MWiF.

We would get together every Monday for too many hours. I know I couldn't handle late nights like that now.

We had one guy who was a real rule master, that was great. He is the oldest so we'll have to see if his grey matter is still what it used to be. Even with him we would still have to look up rules...usually to just end up confirming he was right.

None of this takes any bravery though...just a little insanity mixed with a love of WWII history.[;)]