This is a must fix

[Slyguy3129]

ORIGINAL: RD_Oddball

I never used the word feature in my reply. [;)][:D]  Also I didn't code/program the game but I can certainly bring it to the attention of the person that did.  It's duely noted and I hope I didn't come across as diminishing the importance of yours or anyones opinion.  It's certainly a valid point of view.  The "go to ground" action was worse in WaR and the reaction to it was one reason why we toned it down for CCTLD and added an alternate scenario to simply going to ground and getting shot up.  The alternate is that they stop their present course and immediately look for cover. 

Like I said we've made note and thank you for offering it.

Oh no that isn't how you came across. I was hoping I didn't sound to critical[;)]
If worse comes to worse then I'll just have to learn to work around it. But thanks for the haste and honest response RD it is much appreciated.

[Slyguy3129]

ORIGINAL: xe5

ORIGINAL: Senior Drill
"...enable the "Units Always Obey Orders" option ..."

Thats the fix right there. No compromise needed.
Agree w/ sl_id ... it is more realistic.
Personally I love to watch my soldiers think and fend for themselves.
The way teams 'string out' during movement, I believe it keeps sprites alive.
TLD's infantry survivability is excellent. Seen lots of extended firefights at short range.

The only tweaks I'd suggest are:
1. if in cover when engaged, by all means stop and shoot back.
2. if sneaking and engaged in the open at close range, shoot back
3. units w/ 'aborted moves' should try to reverse course back thru their move path until in cover (then shoot back) or out of enemy LOS.

No X I am afraid that is not a fix nor is it realistic in any way. Again keep in mind I'm not talking about when you are suppressed my MGs or multiple teams I'm talking about when one soldier is firing and stoping a whole teams movement. It does not and never has worked that way. But I do agree with you suggestion as such especially moving out of the LOS that would be a great way to solve this little issue.

[Slyguy3129]

ORIGINAL: xe5

ORIGINAL: squadleader_id
Nah...enabling that option basically turns our beloved CC wargame into just another Command&Conquer clone [:-]

And CC's award winning psych model is a major reason its 'beloved'. Complaining that soldiers wont obey move orders when fired at is like complaining they wont shoot when suppressed.

Your missing my point X. I understand that troops will not move when they are fired upon a great deal. But its should NOT cancel the entire order out period. That is absolutely ridiculous. In the old CCs when fired upon the teams would G2G and then sneak. If they survived long enough you could slowly sneak them back and away. In CC TLD you are no longer able to issue commands to them period. They still have the ability to attempt to follow it, but the game cancels it out before the AI can act on it. That is the issue I am bringing up not the fact that they are not following commands. I want Human not Machines, but even Humans will attempt more self preservation than the game is allowing the AI to do because this "feature" is handicapping it.

[Andrew Williams]

See the Infantry assault vid... those yanks don't do too bad.

fb.asp?m=2116905

sound went a bit wonky, sorry.

[nietsche]

Can I attempt to explain what is a real problem here.

It is that a couple of stray shots (red dashed lines) can stop a sneaking command group form moving the last few metres to take a VL when the enemy is at almost 0 morale. A hiding single unit can just occasionally fire and cause the whole team to go back where it came from even if that is under less cover. Each attempt to get them to move to the objective causes "confusion" for about 30 seconds. I have failed to take a last VL with 5 minutes to remaining and only 20 metres to cover. The final analysis showed only one rifle soldier was alive on the opposition.

This Endgame effect has happened several times playing the AI and other players.

[SteveMcClaire]

The symantics of the move orders in "The Longest Day" is a bit different than the original CC series:

"Move Fast" means get to the destination as quickly as possible, all other considerations are secondary.
"Move" means move cautiously and be ready to react to spotting new enemies or new incoming fire.
"Sneak" means to move very cautiously, use stealth as much as possible, and try to remain undetected.

For best results in getting troops to move under fire:

• Use "Move Fast".  Short (~40m or less) move fast orders will generally be obeyed no matter how much incoming fire a team takes.
• If the destination for a movement order is in good cover, the team is more likely to continue moving if it takes incoming fire. This is adjusted for the amount of time the men would be exposed to get to the cover, so again "Move Fast" is more likely to keep them going then "Move" or "Sneak".

There is one bug, which will be fixed an upcoming patch, which can result in a team ignoring all orders if it is within 30m or less of an enemy team.  This does not sound like what you're seeing, however.

All that said, we do want to hear feedback from our players and I appreciate your points.  We discuss this issue from time to time and will keep refining things as necessary.

[Bradley62]

Though I have not noticed any difference but, does "Move Fast" still result in infantry assaulting (grenades etc.) when approaching enemy held positions?

[Slyguy3129]

ORIGINAL: Steve McClaire

The symantics of the move orders in "The Longest Day" is a bit different than the original CC series:

"Move Fast" means get to the destination as quickly as possible, all other considerations are secondary.
"Move" means move cautiously and be ready to react to spotting new enemies or new incoming fire.
"Sneak" means to move very cautiously, use stealth as much as possible, and try to remain undetected.

For best results in getting troops to move under fire:

• Use "Move Fast".  Short (~40m or less) move fast orders will generally be obeyed no matter how much incoming fire a team takes.
• If the destination for a movement order is in good cover, the team is more likely to continue moving if it takes incoming fire. This is adjusted for the amount of time the men would be exposed to get to the cover, so again "Move Fast" is more likely to keep them going then "Move" or "Sneak".

There is one bug, which will be fixed an upcoming patch, which can result in a team ignoring all orders if it is within 30m or less of an enemy team.  This does not sound like what you're seeing, however.

All that said, we do want to hear feedback from our players and I appreciate your points.  We discuss this issue from time to time and will keep refining things as necessary.

Wow, can't tell you how nice that is to hear. Its not often a company has someone who is on the forums and willing to give answer and explanations like this. Thanks, and I do like the way all this sounds and it makes sense. I will keep that in mind as a generally issue sneak orders.

[RD Oddball]

It was a matter of getting the guy in the know to have a look.[;)]  Even though the rest of us on the development team know quite a bit about the game you can't beat knowing what the programmer knows about it. [:D]

[Slyguy3129]

ORIGINAL: RD_Oddball

It was a matter of getting the guy in the know to have a look.[;)] Even though the rest of us on the development team know quite a bit about the game you can't beat knowing what the programmer knows about it. [:D]

No doubt. Now it seems to be WAD. I tried Steve's Suggestion and it appears to be working not only correctly but how I was thinking it should work[:)]. I assaulted a few MG42 teams on Gold beach and it worked, I did sustain casualties as expected but I did eventually take out the MG nest. Very impressive now, sorry for the confusion it was simply the case of the user not understand the mechanics of the game! Thanks for the help Steve and Oddball. I have great faith in you guys to help restore Close Combat to its rightful place among the top PC Strategy games. Keep up the fantastic work guys!

[RD Oddball]

No problem at all.  It's all Steve.[;)]  Glad it was helpful.  We'll do our best as always and thanks for your faith in us.

[squadleader_id]

ORIGINAL: Steve McClaire

The symantics of the move orders in "The Longest Day" is a bit different than the original CC series:

"Move Fast" means get to the destination as quickly as possible, all other considerations are secondary.
"Move" means move cautiously and be ready to react to spotting new enemies or new incoming fire.
"Sneak" means to move very cautiously, use stealth as much as possible, and try to remain undetected.

For best results in getting troops to move under fire:

• Use "Move Fast".  Short (~40m or less) move fast orders will generally be obeyed no matter how much incoming fire a team takes.
• If the destination for a movement order is in good cover, the team is more likely to continue moving if it takes incoming fire. This is adjusted for the amount of time the men would be exposed to get to the cover, so again "Move Fast" is more likely to keep them going then "Move" or "Sneak".

There is one bug, which will be fixed an upcoming patch, which can result in a team ignoring all orders if it is within 30m or less of an enemy team.  This does not sound like what you're seeing, however.

All that said, we do want to hear feedback from our players and I appreciate your points.  We discuss this issue from time to time and will keep refining things as necessary.

Thanks a lot for the tips, Steve!
Short under 40m "Move Fast" orders seems to work even when under fire...I guess we'll just have to adjust our playing style from the old versions. Mind you 40m distance playing a map at 1680x1050 is a very short mouse click [;)]
That bug you mentioned ("a team ignoring all orders if it is within 30m or less of an enemy team") must be the one that makes assaults almost impossible...glad to hear this is getting fixed in the patch! Great work, Guys!

[7A_Bjorn]

I think the old CC5 reaction of squads in open under fire to hit the deck and crawl is better and more realistic than moving back still on their feet when under fire.