Tobruk

[DoomedMantis]

Whats the best strategy for taking Tobruk as the Germans?

Its mainly the hex's with the Minefield strongpoints in them, when attacking those hex's I am receiving nearly 90 % casualties and the minefield is unaffected.

I have loaded up the attacking force with engineers and have massive bombardments. The odds are saying the casualties will be light and my chances of success is excellent, but am now at a loss?[&:]

The best I have done is receiving 87% casualties and them 40% (although the miefield was unaffected). Considering though I had a 10 to 1 ratio of troops thats not sustainable

Note I am playing the Campaign for Nth Africa 41 - 43

One other point there was one attack that I tried when the only thing I was attacking was the minefield strongpoint and I had 90% casualties and the enemy had 0%

[Curtis Lemay]

ORIGINAL: DoomedMantis

Whats the best strategy for taking Tobruk as the Germans?

Its mainly the hex's with the Minefield strongpoints in them, when attacking those hex's I am receiving nearly 90 % casualties and the minefield is unaffected.

I have loaded up the attacking force with engineers and have massive bombardments. The odds are saying the casualties will be light and my chances of success is excellent, but am now at a loss?[&:]

The best I have done is receiving 87% casualties and them 40% (although the miefield was unaffected). Considering though I had a 10 to 1 ratio of troops thats not sustainable

Note I am playing the Campaign for Nth Africa 41 - 43

One other point there was one attack that I tried when the only thing I was attacking was the minefield strongpoint and I had 90% casualties and the enemy had 0%

You have two choices: Pay the price now or wait till the minefields fall into disrepair much later (when they will be withdrawn).

It was a tough choice for Rommel, too.

[golden delicious]

Curious about that withdrawal. As I recall, the British cut a path through their own minefield to improve the flow of traffic in and out of the port. Is that an option for them in the scenario or is it on a strict timer? It would be a bit unreal if Tobruk was right on the frontline but the minefields disappeared anyway.

[Curtis Lemay]

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

Curious about that withdrawal. As I recall, the British cut a path through their own minefield to improve the flow of traffic in and out of the port. Is that an option for them in the scenario or is it on a strict timer? It would be a bit unreal if Tobruk was right on the frontline but the minefields disappeared anyway.

They are automatically withdrawn - no option. And the circumstances that led to Tobruk's fall were a bit unreal.

[golden delicious]

ORIGINAL: Curtis Lemay

They are automatically withdrawn - no option. And the circumstances that led to Tobruk's fall were a bit unreal.

Not exactly, just a combination of factors;

a) the town had fallen far to the rear and so its value as a port was considered to be greater than its value as a fortress
b) the German offensive that changed this situation did so very suddenly, preventing the British from strengthening the fortress
c) the defence of Tobruk was left to a South African division.

Anyway, reading over the original post, is it actually possible to take Tobruk while these minefields are up? I assume that historically it would have been; isolated fortresses didn't tend to do very well in this period if seriously attacked.

[Curtis Lemay]

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

ORIGINAL: Curtis Lemay

They are automatically withdrawn - no option. And the circumstances that led to Tobruk's fall were a bit unreal.

Not exactly, just a combination of factors;

a) the town had fallen far to the rear and so its value as a port was considered to be greater than its value as a fortress
b) the German offensive that changed this situation did so very suddenly, preventing the British from strengthening the fortress
c) the defence of Tobruk was left to a South African division.

The really unreal part was that when Rommel got into position to attack Tobruk, he found that all the supplies that he had stockpiled back just before Crusader were still sitting there! The CW had never destroyed them. That helped accelerate things alot.

Anyway, reading over the original post, is it actually possible to take Tobruk while these minefields are up? I assume that historically it would have been; isolated fortresses didn't tend to do very well in this period if seriously attacked.

Oh absolutely. The PO can do it.

[golden delicious]

ORIGINAL: Curtis Lemay

The really unreal part was that when Rommel got into position to attack Tobruk, he found that all the supplies that he had stockpiled back just before Crusader were still sitting there! The CW had never destroyed them. That helped accelerate things alot.

Well, since the RN determined that it could not supply Tobruk, it made sense to maintain a stockpile in the town so it could be maintained as a fortress. Once it became clear that the fortress would fall the supplies should have been destroyed of course- but there wasn't much time left to do so. In any case this is hardly Klopper's only failing. Did he issue any orders at all during the defence?

Oh absolutely. The PO can do it.

Good stuff.

[DoomedMantis]

you certainly do take a big price, I found that attacking up through the SE was the best approach, but it certainly left me fairly crippled

[Curtis Lemay]

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

Well, since the RN determined that it could not supply Tobruk, it made sense to maintain a stockpile in the town so it could be maintained as a fortress. Once it became clear that the fortress would fall the supplies should have been destroyed of course- but there wasn't much time left to do so. In any case this is hardly Klopper's only failing. Did he issue any orders at all during the defence?

I wasn't refering to the Commonwealth supplies within Tobruk. I meant the Axis supplies outside it - the supplies that Rommel had built up back in the previous November - just before Crusader interupted his plans. They were still there! That's why the attack was too quick for the defenders to repair their defenses properly.

That's why I withdraw the minefield units around that period. The CW just seemed to be going through a blunderful phase in regards to Tobruk then.