The First Team: Take Two!

[John 3rd]

ORIGINAL: Nemo121

It is entirely POSSIBLE that we could involve nearly 1,000 planes in the attack.  The possibilities are pretty damned good that we could score a BIIIIIGGGGGG victory. 

Wishful thinking on your part and no substitute for reality.

In the north you won't co-ordinate such large strikes from multiple bases + shipping. You will attack piecemeal under conditions unfavourable to your forces - which is why the Allies have chosen this route of advance, it greatly reduces Japanese aerial superiority.

With that said if you can mass that many Zeroes on KB ( I'd try to increase fighters on KB to 400 at the expense of attack planes.... With 400 fighters and 40% CAP you can have 240 escorts and that will mean more strike planes survive to attack --- the extra fighters means fewer attack planes fly but MORE actually attack ( which is the whole point ) ) then you don't really require co-ordination with LBA. Considering making your LBA defensive and saving those Zeroes to add to KB and letting KB deliver the strike itself. Even if it only launches 1/3rd of the time you should still have 3 or 4 days in range of the Allies which should allow at least one big, devastating strike. Your idea of 1,000 planes flying in a co-ordinated manner from multiple bases is, however, sheer fantasy. It won't happen in the north.

Hey Nemo!

I didn't mean to imply total coordination up there. I simply meant that we will have 100s of planes flying attacks throughout the area.

Good comment regarding adding more Zeros to KB...

[Q-Ball]

Well, here is a preview of the day, normall we don't post Combat Reports, but.....

Aleutians
Day Air attack on TF at 106,36

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 34
B5N Kate x 19
G4M1 Betty x 20
Ki-44-IIb Tojo x 40
Ki-61 KAIb Tony x 13
Ki-49 Helen x 15

Japanese aircraft losses
B5N Kate: 3 destroyed, 6 damaged
G4M1 Betty: 1 destroyed, 15 damaged
Ki-49 Helen: 2 damaged

Allied Ships
BB California, Torpedo hits 10, on fire, heavy damage Yes, it sank
AK San Bernadino, Torpedo hits 1, on fire
DD Drayton
AK Jefferson Myers, Torpedo hits 1, on fire

Off Coast of India

Day Air attack on TF at 13,9

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 47
G4M1 Betty x 74

Allied aircraft
Seafire x 36
Sea Hurricane Ib x 27

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 21 destroyed, 1 damaged
G4M1 Betty: 16 destroyed, 42 damaged

Allied aircraft losses
Seafire: 9 destroyed, 6 damaged
Sea Hurricane Ib: 17 destroyed

Allied Ships
CL Mauritius, Torpedo hits 1
CV Formidable, Torpedo hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
CV Illustrious, Torpedo hits 3, on fire
CL Newcastle

The result off India is the one that is REALLY important at this point; that could really set them back there; the only way to save the situation at Bombay now will probably be a breakout from Karachi.

[ny59giants]

Brad ran the 001 file and it showed different results than my initial results of the turn (i ran the game turn first). Since I ran the turn first, my events will be what actually happened and not his, correct?? We have some emails running back and forth at this time while the Allies get my reports and the game turn only from Brad.

[Q-Ball]

Yes, I thought something was wrong when I got the turn, and California wasn't on the sunk ships list. THEN I ran the .001 file, and the result was completely different; only 3 torp hits on Illustrious, no fires, and California was not attacked; instead, several AK were hit in Cold Bay. In other words, not nearly as nice a result.

We need some help on this, my understanding is that the GAME file I received contains the "True" result whatever that is; and that the .001 file Michael sent, although not what he saw, is the actual result. For grins, I loaded up the turn Paul sent myself, and got the same #2 result, i.e. no hits on California, etc. Either way, I don't think we sank California, and I don't think we're gonna get an RN CV, though I don't think we'll be seeing the RN off the coast of India anytime soon.

[Panther Bait]

Damn guys.  Bad luck if it really is a synch bug fantasy to get a US BB and a RN CV on the same turn.
 
From what I understand the game file is correct, and the 001 file is wrong if you had a synch bug problem.  The best way to make sure you "see" the correct results is to ask for the Japanese players combatresults.txt file.  That will "always" be correct.

[n01487477]

Well on the upside, there is some free intelligence here, ny59Giants is the true result...
 
--damian--

[Q-Ball]

ORIGINAL: n01487477

Well on the upside, there is some free intelligence here, ny59Giants is the true result...

--damian--

OK, so Michael, who ran the turn, has the true result. If I see a different result on my .001 file, THAT is incorrect. Right?

Michael, you didn't ESC out of any of the combat animations, did you? I understand that is one major cause of sync bug

[ny59giants]

Michael, you didn't ESC out of any of the combat animations, did you? I understand that is one major cause of sync bug

No, I didn't. However, it is often tempting when watching the bombardment and/or deliberate attack at Bombay even with the ground vs ground setting at the fastest speed. [:D]

John ran the 001 file and got the same results as I did.

Recent e-mail from Steve

We did !!!!!
My replay matched the combat report in the west but there were differences in the east.
Actually the combat report is mild compared to reality - the RN came off harder hit - lets just say I no longer have any capability to mount BB hunting raids

[John 3rd]

SINK THE BRITS!  SINK THE BRITS!!
 
Just my .02 out to the Eastern Commander.  If Steve is to be believed, we should have an excellent chance to sink at least one British CV.

The California is simply gravy since the Americans have about 200 BBs.  Might serve to keep the Americans depressed up North while our Fleet gathers.  Mike and I talked several times yesterday and cannot wait for the next turn to play out.

Plans are for the Imperial Fleet to gather, link-up with the Junyo/Hiyo TF, and move north for a fight.  Junyo and friends are just off Formosa so it will be 3-4 days before everyone can sortie.  Mike said the AOs will leave ASAP so they can have a decent lead on the rest of the Fleet for fueling purposes.

COULD be FUN!

Additional Note: IF the Brit CVs are truly out of it in a few days, then we can have the option of pulling ALL Zeros from India and some Bombers to aid the fight in the Pacific. If their convoys no longer have CAP life will be VERY nice...

[Q-Ball]

I agree with John, sinking California in the long run isn't that important, there aren't too many strategic moves that will be stopped by a lack of battleships.

Getting the RN CVs, though is VERY important. Without CV's, they can't really bring transports to the Indian Coast. That means they can't counterinvade, and they can't get fighters there (because they withdrew all air units but floatplanes).

From Steve's comment, unless it's false intel, he was trying to nail the BB's that keep bombarding Bombay. That would give with the 2 recent sightings well off the Indian coast of "CA,CA,CA,CA" TF's (probably CVs), that both disappeared after being spotted. This time, we got him 5 hexes from the Indian Coast. I bet what happened is that he stopped the turn before far away, and this time was NOT spotted; once that happened, he moved in the following turn, thinking maybe we were napping. Maybe the DD's topped off or something limiting the move, but he finished too far away from Pangim to hit the BB's, yet plenty close to get nailed by Bettys.

The way I had it arranged though, there wasn't a way to get within Albacore range without being within Betty range. Using surface ships would be even worse, because any ship that takes damage would linger within LBA range in the morning phase, and get nailed again. If getting the BB's was Steve's objective, his operation was ill-conceived, and way too risky.

[Q-Ball]

Sept 6 Combat Report

Back on track, we are now into day 2 of significant action on both sides of the map. Michael may comment further, and we should probably include maps, but here is a quick sit rep:

Battle of the Arabian Sea

Yesterday, 72 Bettys out of Poona put a hurtin' on an RN CV force that appeared off Pangim. Both CV Formidable and CV Illustrious were damaged heavily. TODAY, despite the Betty units being pretty chewed up, we managed to put 2 more torps into Illustrious, sinking her. CV Formidable escaped Miss Betty, but ate 2 bombs from Helens to keep the fires going, and only made 3 hexes in 24 hours. There is a good chance we can finish her off tommorow, as she is definitely wounded.
SCORE SO FAR: CV Illustrious SUNK, CV Formidable Heavily Damaged (and in trouble)

ALL HAIL MS. BETTY!

Aleutians

An Allied transport force of AK's began unloading at Cold Bay. During the day phase, they were roughed up by our planes flying from Umnak, sinking 3 AKs, and heavily damaging 3 more. They suffered casualties from these hits, so the troops coming ashore are hurt. The interesting thing about this is that there was NO CAP at all over the transports; they were more or less sacrificed to get troops ashore.

Clearly, they are committed to the death at Cold Bay, if they would send those ships in knowing they would be sunk.

Oh, and BB California was confirmed SUNK!

A good day for the Empire, tommorow figures to be busy again, with a wounded CV Formidable still within range, and Allied ships still at Cold Bay

[flaggelant]

i don't really believe they sent that TF in without suport, sacrificing a BB just to get some troops ashore,
sounds more like a logistical mess up.. or a very expensive testing of the defenses..?
 
anyway, nice going [8D]
 
 
are you guys going to bomb ground targets near cold bay (are they coming close to achieving anything), or is everything set to full time naval action?
 
 
 
 
 

[ny59giants]

The Americans have kept their CVs 6 hexes away from Umnak Island. My Zeros and Betty got eaten up pretty good on Day 1 when they were set for 11 hex range. Thus, I restricted them to 5 hexes to cover Cold Bay and one hex to the east.

On Day 2, BB California was 5 hexes away and ate 10 torpedoes. The Allies saw part of two sentai of Tojo and one of Tony's. I have around 175 fighters on Umnak, but not enough TBs. Brad hit the 2 British CVs and even though he suffered some losses, they both were hit hard.

On Day 3, California slid beneath the waves, but Cold Bay was hit by 7 American BBs and transports unloaded. The base had 22 Wildcats on LRCAP (known by the F-4 & F-5 recon flights). The base was close to any attacks. Thus, I guess my LBA hit the AKs and part of a Canadian Bde and American RCT was report to be sunk with the transports. I would imagine that most of the American CVs had CAP with range set for 0 to ensure they didn't bleed over to were the transports were hit in both air phases. The now have two Canadian BF, SeaBee, and 2/3 of a division ashore.

There are reports that the lights at the Naval General HQ in Tokyo have not gone out the last few nights. Security around the naval shipyards in Japan, especially at Osaka, have been increased along with sounds of Zeros, Vals, and Kates have been overheard. Sounds of warships have come across the beach at Formosa. The two daitai of Betty at Exmouth have been MIA for a few days.

Weather - clicking on various hexes around the Aleutians shows rain forecast from 120 miles west of Umnak to past Kodiak. The 3rd player of this scenario may play a major role again. [8|]      

[Nemo121]

The allies here are making a serious error.... they are committing to a fight to the death at Cold Bay but they are doing so in a piecemeal manner over a prolonged period of time. This allows you to shift forces into the area and actually cause far more casualties than if they arrived and dumped several divisions ashore over the course of just 1 or 2 days.

[Q-Ball]

ORIGINAL: Nemo121

The allies here are making a serious error.... they are committing to a fight to the death at Cold Bay but they are doing so in a piecemeal manner over a prolonged period of time. This allows you to shift forces into the area and actually cause far more casualties than if they arrived and dumped several divisions ashore over the course of just 1 or 2 days.

Without question they are making a serious error. I respect our opponents and they have made some skillful moves, but the last couple days were puzzling. After weeks of waiting, I would think they could bring 2-3 divisions and finish the job for good. Even if they take Cold Bay, we can still rule the air from the large base at Umnak. They are very fortunate KB was repairing, if KB was anywhere close to the Aleutians (and they had no way to know it wasn't), we would be turning this into a reverse Midway.

Here is a map of the situation near Cold Bay. 2 Transport TFs are unloading, with a third apparently about to hit the beach. I wish we had more strike aircraft, we'll have about 40 torpedo carrying planes attacking tommorow, they'll probably get 10 hits or so. The graphic shows our garrison at Cold Bay:

[Hornblower]

Nice to see a little action

[Q-Ball]

Here is the situation off India, showing where the RN CV's met Miss Betty. Steve has been a good opponent, but this is a serious Allied error. I didn't really do anything special to get this victory, other than take the basic step of building an airbase large enough to hold torpedo carrying planes, getting an Air HQ, then placing Bettys there on Nav Attack with Nells on search. Maybe they thought we withdrew them because I don't use them on Airbase attack at all, saving them for Nav Attack only.

CV Formidable is still out there moving 3 hexes a turn, I bet she goes down tommorow. Note the AP TF; what is that do you think? Running supplies to Bombay?

[Hornblower]

Most likely with the CV's providing Cap.  Might be an oportunity to send in your Surface TF at Pangim and finish them off if they still intend on making for Bombay.

[Q-Ball]

ORIGINAL: Hornblower

Most likely with the CV's providing Cap.  Might be an oportunity to send in your Surface TF at Pangim and finish them off if they still intend on making for Bombay.

Steve said he was trying to nail the BB's at Pangim, probably he was doing that plus hoping to sneak that convoy in. At this point, they are withdrawing; even if they do get closer, I have plenty of Sally/Helen nearby to finish the job.

Losing those 2 CV's is very critical for them. They are now really stuck out there. The last attack on Bombay was encouraging, I plan to keep taking the forts down, and hopefully finish it by the end of the year. If we can do that, I think this game is over.

[Hornblower]

if you finish this up in 3months game time, thats a sure sign AE is about to show up!