Overflying Russia

[turkey]

I'm aware the allies used Russian air bases for offensive missions (Operation Frantic) against Romanian oilfields, but I'm not sure if they ever used Russian bases for missions against the Japanese in China, although I beleive this was an objective, but I can't find references to say Uncle Joe ever allowed this?

Can anyone help? Did the allies ever bomb Japanese from China?

*** More importantly does the game (stock - fully modded) allow the allies to use Russian bases to bomb Japanese targets in China / Manchukuo?
Thanks

[herwin]

ORIGINAL: turkey

I'm aware the allies used Russian air bases for offensive missions (Operation Frantic) against Romanian oilfields, but I'm not sure if they ever used Russian bases for missions against the Japanese in China, although I beleive this was an objective, but I can't find references to say Uncle Joe ever allowed this?

Can anyone help? Did the allies ever bomb Japanese from China?

*** More importantly does the game (stock - fully modded) allow the allies to use Russian bases to bomb Japanese targets in China / Manchukuo?
Thanks

HISTORY

The Soviet Union was at peace with Japan from 1940 until August 1945, using the port of Vladivostok as an entry point for Lend-Lease shipments travelling on Soviet-flagged vessels in the North Pacific. The Soviets were very careful not to offend the Japanese government.

[cverbrug]

Indeed, at the start of hostilities between Japan and the USA, russia was military on the defensive and the Germans were close to Moscow. Russia would certainly have been overly carefull not to have a second front started against them.

[wdolson]

ORIGINAL: turkey

I'm aware the allies used Russian air bases for offensive missions (Operation Frantic) against Romanian oilfields, but I'm not sure if they ever used Russian bases for missions against the Japanese in China, although I beleive this was an objective, but I can't find references to say Uncle Joe ever allowed this?

Can anyone help? Did the allies ever bomb Japanese from China?

*** More importantly does the game (stock - fully modded) allow the allies to use Russian bases to bomb Japanese targets in China / Manchukuo?
Thanks

As others have said, the USSR was at peace with Japan and had no interest in getting involved with Japan until after Germany was out of the war. The Soviets were supplying China up until I think 1940 and the threat of war got them to cut off the Chinese.

The US B-29 offensive was originally going to fly from China and bases were built there. After a few missions, it was realized that the supply chain was too fragile and the B-29s were moved to the Marianas which could be supplied adequately.

If the Soviets are active, Soviet bases can be used by other countries. If inactive, no dice.

Bill

[Historiker]

The US B-29 offensive was originally going to fly from China and bases were built there. After a few missions, it was realized that the supply chain was too fragile and the B-29s were moved to the Marianas which could be supplied adequately.

The Japanese also launched an offensive and captured the airfields...

[turkey]

That'll be a "NO" then. Thanks all.

As a matter of interest does anyone know if the game mechnics would allow this?

I've noticed that Russian bases come up as posible destinations for PBY's operation out of Dutch harbour.

edit: Don't worry thanksL Just searched the forum.

[Historiker]

At least in most mods, you can transfer airgroups through russia into china or the alieutians. It is unfair though as absolutly unrealistic. I mostly played with the houserule that any allied unit entering russian territory has to stay there interneed until russia is at war, too.
So you can save a sub by disbanding it at vladivostok, but you mustn't let it leave the harbour again!

[turkey]

We are playing "no holds barred" as a way to test theories of how things might have been different given a different world. So far the balance seems to be about right i.e. my opponent is using huge armies in China (300,000 plus) and I am countering with strategic bombing of his supply centers and HI with my 4e "heavies" which never would have been sent to China given demand from priority theaters (and the fragile supply situation mentioned by wdolsen) hence the question about ops from Russia into occupied China. Having said that I'm interested by the idea of house rules, but having an internal debate about how far do you take it (been reading the must reads etc). It does seem to me some of it is tactics and I don't think a house rule should forbid a tactic (such as large number of PT boats in a given harbour, but if it were physically impossible for reason such as logistical constraint, then maybe a house rule is a good idea. I'm sure this has been done to death over the years, but HEY! Despite AE, WiTP is still pulling in new gamers (and interested in though by no means an expert in C20 history) [8D]

[engineer]

In a "no holds barred" game Russia provides a quick & easy way to fly reinforcements to China/Burma/India.  You fly up the west coast to Alaska then out the Aleutians.  The Russians have a handy base just north of Kuriles, then you can fly down to Vladivostok and on to Chungking.  Allied planes in Russia may not fly any missions other than transfer and maybe training. 
 
Everyone is right about Lend-lease and the utter ahistorical nature of such a strategy.  The Russians played things pretty straight on interning Allied pilots who strayed over their air space. 

[turkey]

Thanks engineer. My opponent is adamant it is no holds barred. I wonder what evil he is planning. - He doesn’t use the forums and doesn't accept the concept of house rules! So it could be verry tricky. I would like to prevent a mega land death star in China etc, but guess I will have to ride the punch if we have no house rules. However I've sent everything else by sea, or flown in while I still held Andaman. Still pretty ahistoric, leaving West Coast devoid of long range bombers etc but "feels" OK. I remain in 2 minds. Right now I don't think the threat to my forces is great enough for the US President and Secretary of War to authorise such a politically risky mission and the possible internment of a wing of B17s. However if a 300k or 400k army appears on the outskirts of Wuchow... I guess no holds barred means just that but would welcome your thoughts on the morality. After all in war morality comes a poor second.[&:]

[engineer]

I suppose you're both being very careful to leave garrisons in all your key cities so a couple squads of sub-landed commandos don't sink everything that's refitting at Mare Island?

If you're doing player defined upgrades and Japanese production, he has a very good opportunity to out-produce you on fighters. Of course, you can upgrade every level bomber on the map to a B-24/Liberator VI and fly your missions at 6000 feet if the flak is light enough.