Non-historic first turn with Dec 7th surprise?

[vonSchnitter]

Very interesting, Mate.

To be honest, I am not sure whether you:
a - care to set me up - one way or the other - to take a pot shot on the noob thing - fine by me
b - care not to share your "secrets" by use of a smoke screen
c - you are up to something worth a close look - re reshufling TF numbers

If C is the correct answer - I am sure you will have made a dent in AE history, proving the rules are leaky.

I leave it to you, to opt for the benefit of all concerned if c. is right.
Or just stop bragging.

or send a PM and we go from there.

[CEDeaton]

ORIGINAL: vonSchnitter

Very interesting, Mate.

To be honest, I am not sure whether you:
a - care to set me up - one way or the other - to take a pot shot on the noob thing - fine by me
b - care not to share your "secrets" by use of a smoke screen
c - you are up to something worth a close look - re reshufling TF numbers

If C is the correct answer - I am sure you will have made a dent in AE history, proving the rules are leaky.

I leave it to you, to opt for the benefit of all concerned if c. is right.
Or just stop bragging.

or send a PM and we go from there.

Hey, please don't get me wrong. I'm just having a little fun here. The noob comment struck me as REALLY funny since I've seldom met anyone that has played games as long as I have (at least anyone who will admit it). I wasn't offended at all. I know I don't post a lot - too busy playing, most times. So I just "lurk" and see what's going on with the games I like.

I really don't understand what you meant by your comment about the smoke screen (probably it's a local slang thing), but suffice to say, if one fancies themseleves a cunning player, it's best to keep at least some cards close to the vest and my comment about giving away secrets was half in jest, but half serious as well.

That being said, I've really opened my kimono in this thread. I got bitch-slapped, plain and simple. In this case, some changes in the rules seem to have set me up for it, but that's OK. War tends to slap people who don't expect it.

My whole purpose with this thread originally was to be sure that was what Matrix intended. If so, I think it's a shame because the game can now model fewer potential opening moves than could have been done in vanilla WITP and, I think, we all suffer a loss from that. Overall, however, I believe the game itself is a vast improvement over stock WITP, so I can live with a setback here and there.

If I appeared to be bragging, I can assure you, that was not my intent. Not sure how anyone that just got a carrier damn-near sunk on Dec 7th could even attempt to brag. [:D]

[vonSchnitter]

Well Craig,

I am fine with all you say. No problem.

Let me ask you this - probably your chance to earn AE fame and the respect of any IJ player:

Did you find a way to split off carriers from KB and have them "warp" to a specific location ?
Did you find a way to have the reminder of KB "warp" to a specific location ?

Just simple questions ?

In case both answers are yes - either in the forum or in a pm - do you mind, if the powers that be, get a chance to review their setup with your help ?
At that time I am out of the cicle and your secrets are safe.

[Nomad]

To be quite honest vonSchnitter, he gave all the info you needed in post 20.

Excellent idea CD, and if you had put your San Diego strike force on Naval Attack / Port Attack you would have had a real victory parade. [:)]

[Freedom205]

That was entirely possible in WITP also,(splitting up TFs and still being able to warp) but havnt had the option of trying it out in AE as I am waiting for a mixup in the promo code to sort out so I can buy this wonderful gem  ;  )

[Nomad]

The difference is in WitP every IJN TF could warp speed on turn 1, but in AE, only those that are identified in the scenario file are capable. That means that a bit of slight of hand is needed to do what CD did.

[Mynok]

ORIGINAL: CraigDeaton

Hey, please don't get me wrong. I'm just having a little fun here. The noob comment struck me as REALLY funny since I've seldom met anyone that has played games as long as I have (at least anyone who will admit it). I wasn't offended at all. I know I don't post a lot - too busy playing, most times. So I just "lurk" and see what's going on with the games I like.

Heh..I've been playing close to as long as you. Started in 77 with Tactics II then Squad Leader. [:D]

Keep on keeping on. Sounds like you know how to have fun with these games, and that's really what it is all about. [:D]

[johnbmac]

USN in Strategy and Tactics Magazine got me started when I was 12 years old in 1971.

Strategy & Tactics magazine #29.

USN deals with the air, land and sea warfare in the Pacific between 1941 and 1943. Each hex represents over 200 miles. Each turn represents a week's operations. Land unit counters represent divisions or regiments. Air units represent multiples of 10 planes. Virtually the entire Pacific is shown, from east of Hawaii to west of Java. Across this wide expanse, naval units (individual aircraft carriers, groups of everything else) fight in one of the most complex campaigns in history. The air, land and naval forces all operated under different conditions. There are five different Combat Results tables used to accomodate everything from torpedo attacks to bayonet charges. The CRT's represent abstract battle actions. There are three "campaign" games plus three shorter "mini" scenarios.

Game Equipment: one 22 x 28" map, 400 1/2" counters, rulesheet (folding "roadmap" variety), games charts & tables.



http://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/8727

[CEDeaton]

ORIGINAL: johnbmac

USN in Strategy and Tactics Magazine got me started when I was 12 years old in 1971.

Strategy & Tactics magazine #29.

USN deals with the air, land and sea warfare in the Pacific between 1941 and 1943. Each hex represents over 200 miles. Each turn represents a week's operations. Land unit counters represent divisions or regiments. Air units represent multiples of 10 planes. Virtually the entire Pacific is shown, from east of Hawaii to west of Java. Across this wide expanse, naval units (individual aircraft carriers, groups of everything else) fight in one of the most complex campaigns in history. The air, land and naval forces all operated under different conditions. There are five different Combat Results tables used to accomodate everything from torpedo attacks to bayonet charges. The CRT's represent abstract battle actions. There are three "campaign" games plus three shorter "mini" scenarios.

Game Equipment: one 22 x 28" map, 400 1/2" counters, rulesheet (folding "roadmap" variety), games charts & tables.



http://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/8727

Holy crap! They're gtting $81 for that game?! I've got about three old boxes of board games in the attic that I'm gonna start listing on e-Bay next week. I now know how to continue my game addiction after getting hit with a 4% pay cut last week.

Gotta love this economy, eh?

[herwin]

ORIGINAL: CraigDeaton

ORIGINAL: vonSchnitter

Sorry Craig,

I just went by your post count and drew some assumptions - I hope you noticed I at least tried to handle a percieved noobs concerns with as much TLC as possible ? [:D]

Anyway: Did you change the destination hex of KB ? If so which one - if I may ask.

Some of us old and hardened WitP PBMers ([8D]) still believe that the KB is out of danger if left unaltered..

By the way who is your PBM partner - just to laud him - and avoid him ...[:D])

In the past I'd have kept this little surprise to myself, but since it now appears pointless... What I did was I split off Shokaku and Zuikaku and a small escort and hit San Diego. I was willing to trade several BBs in order to take out the Saratoga. Unfortunately, since he was able to sortie everything with the revised turn one rules, it wasn't even in the port (obviously) and this battle actually took place near San Clemente island.

Well, SD is closer than PH, but with PH, the KB had Truk as an emergency stop if things went wrong. I'm not sure what you would do for SD.

[Shark7]

House rules. In the games I've played without historical first turn the house rule was simple.

Allied player makes no adjustments turn one (to simulate the surprise), however, the Japanese player may pick only one port to raid (either Pearl, Manila or Singapore).

It's the only way to have a non-historical start and have some semblance of fairness to it.

[herwin]

ORIGINAL: Shark7

House rules. In the games I've played without historical first turn the house rule was simple.

Allied player makes no adjustments turn one (to simulate the surprise), however, the Japanese player may pick only one port to raid (either Pearl, Manila or Singapore).

It's the only way to have a non-historical start and have some semblance of fairness to it.

Go KB hunting with your gunships if it hangs around--it's vulnerable out to 4 hexes away. Use your carriers to sink its replenishment TF.

[CEDeaton]

ORIGINAL: herwin

Well, SD is closer than PH, but with PH, the KB had Truk as an emergency stop if things went wrong. I'm not sure what you would do for SD.

Simple. I get to watch her sink! [:@]

[CEDeaton]

I have a quick two-part question for the group...

This might be more appropriate for the Scenario thread, but it's on-topic for this particular subject.

1) Any interest in a slightly modified Dec 7th scenario that allows the Japanese to alter their opening moves, but locks the Allies into a historical first turn so they can't completely empty their ports and do other ahistorical/unreasonable actions?

2) What might be the best way to go about that? I'm thinking edit the operations points that the allies ships begin with on the first turn so they can't move, or is there some other better device that would accomplish the same thing?

[herwin]

ORIGINAL: CraigDeaton

I have a quick two-part question for the group...

This might be more appropriate for the Scenario thread, but it's on-topic for this particular subject.

1) Any interest in a slightly modified Dec 7th scenario that allows the Japanese to alter their opening moves, but locks the Allies into a historical first turn so they can't completely empty their ports and do other ahistorical/unreasonable actions?

2) What might be the best way to go about that? I'm thinking edit the operations points that the allies ships begin with on the first turn so they can't move, or is there some other better device that would accomplish the same thing?

Start with a house rule.

[seydlitz_slith]

I am in the process of starting a pbem using scenairo 1 (grand campaign) with non-historic 1st turn and surprise off. The premise is that the allies used their code brezking activities to learn a few more details about the Japanese plans in advance and the military powers that be issued a more appropriate war warning to theater commanders.

Japan realized that her codes were compromised late in the game. Not early enough to call of offensive hostilities, but early enough to alter some details or abort a few risky operations.

It is against an opponent that I have been playing WITP with for years (now in Feb '44 in our pbem) so it should be fun. I am playing Japan and this scenario supplies some unique challenges. I do have a plan to use against the allies if they empty their ports.