I was disappointed

[Erik Rutins]

V22,

ORIGINAL: V22 Osprey
You say "under the hood" but then it basicly just becomes a $50 patch since it doesn't bring anything new to the table.So the all the bugs are ironed out, isn't that what a patch does?

I'll probably get this anyway because I never had the originals, but from what I've read so far it doesn't bring of enough new content to be worth $50 if you already have the game.

It's not just a patch, a lot more work than a patch went into this and it delivers what was promised. Read through the forum and see how the folks who are familiar with the originals are enjoying it. The goal was to extend the life of these games for years to come as nothing better is really on the horizon.

[V22 Osprey]

Erik, I was basing this off what I've read so far.Like I said, I'm getting this anyway.

[Crocky]

Bought it playing it loving it well worth it havent hit any problems yet so IMHO its something that will stay on my PC for years and i will get heaps of enjoyment out of it .... played for around 24hrs in total so far $ 2.00 an hour is ....cheap entertainment [:D]

[harley]

ORIGINAL: Crocky

played for around 24hrs in total so far $ 2.00 an hour is ....cheap entertainment [:D]

Good effort so quickly. Guys like HARD Sarge are probably in the sub-cent per hour off the original game. I believe I spent more time tweaking and dissecting the game than I did playing it, but that meant I knew where the bodies were buried when I got the code...

My favourite fix was the one that stops the attacking AI from knowing where your planes were - before Matrix we argued whether there was some AI knowledge in there, and were always told NO... Well, there was. Now the AI scans every airfield, and weights the value of attack against the presence of AA, The presence of a unit, and the most recent recon. Without the recon, it won't know, and will be unlikely to attack, or get caned if it does.

[Larac]

Eric and BoB team,

Thank you for making this remake, I missed the original game, and Matrix going back and setting it up so I can play such great games, without resorting to DoS Box and such is really nice.

Hopefully many younger folks will now be able to play these titles and get a understanding that pretty and flashy does not mean good.

So I hope it sells well enough for others to be brought out over time, at mid forties I find my self liking all types of games, from Plants Vs Zombies to the new Batman game, but I find that I end up learning more from playing a good war game.

I'll play some then look up facts and battles to understand more of what happened, then play more.

Good Luck to Matrix and the BoB Team, next months check will be buying this one.

Lee

[TechSgt]

My favorite BtR fix?
My fighters won't be heading off to the Northwest corner of the map, (0,0)! That to me alone, is worth the price.

Graphics? Did I miss something in the original? Maybe I was too busy plotting to notice? [:'(]

I'm curious as to the "real need" for an editor? Let see...
I corrected a few mis-assigned squadrons, because I wasn't currently playing the latest patch.
I corrected a few mis-placed pilots, because I screwed up using the known detachment exploit!
I guess I could have changed that horrible Unit Commander, or maybe made a squadron of "super" bombers?

I am now waiting on "snail-mail" to deliver, (long dumb story about downloading, won't go into). I will admit, I am worried when I read the problem texts that have been showing up. I'm hoping my computer isn't going to be one that Hard Sarge wrote about not behaving like all the rest. The support seems to be there -- maybe not as speedy as some think it should be.

But, I see a interesting map mod in another thread, people working on "pink ME109 skins", and an active forum. I know we have a dedicated corp group.

I think we are in for a good era.

TS

[kirbykern]

Other than Defending the Reich no one and I mean NO ONE has even attempted to produce games covering this subject matter. And I don't see anyone producing games of this sort any time in the future.
 
As far as the price goes. HELLLOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!! You're buying two entirely different games. Get over it. No one is holding a gun to your head and, yes, Matrix did an excellent job of setting expectations. Most the the complaints I've read are folks who did not or will not do the research up front and then complain that THEIR expectations were not met.
 
Sure, the performance bugs are a hassle but I think the Matrix team has recognized them and will deal with them post haste.
 
No, they are not NEW games but they are far, far more than a "patch". Read the available info:

A highly enhanced combination of Talonsoft's Battle of Britain and Twelve O'Clock High into a single game package
Increased historic pilot database to over 18,000 pilots
Richer detail across the entire game with more data tracked and displayed like ground kills by pilot and unit, pilot and aircraft losses by unit, pilot loss date and more
New nationalities including Axis Co-Belligerents, USSR and Brazil.
Numerous new aircraft types, units and locations.
New waypoints in the plotting options to allow detailed routing to avoid flak or mislead the enemy.
Added performance modifiers to all aircraft based on altitude and overall more realism with flight operations.
Simplified field-pak options for the Luftwaffe defender, and added new options for the Allied attacker
Fighter Bombers can now sweep and will attack.
Many AI improvements like better choice protocols on which airfields to strafe based on recent recon and flak deployment
Improved AI use of new planes
An all new accurate fuel-use model, allowing units to fly until they are “Bingo."[/ul]
 
Plus we now have an active support team to deal with issues as they occur rather than only having the option of cussing at the computer.
 
 
 
 
 

[Hard Sarge]

yea but I like cussing at the computer, been doing that almost 30 years now

[kirbykern]

ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge

yea but I like cussing at the computer, been doing that almost 30 years now

Ok, yes, but, now I'm not cussing about the lack of support for BoB and BtR. I have plenty of OTHER things to cuss about.

It's worse than you know. I cuss at mainframes all day at work and then go home and cuss at my PC.

[Justascratch]

Back in the day when all this sort of traffic took place on bulliten boards vs forums, I remember giggling each time a newbie logged in to complain about the graphics used in X-Com. It went right past these folks that the game wasn't about hand eye coordination, but was meant to be an exercise in squad level action, resource management and above all the care and feeding of squad members.

I own and commited hundreds of hours to BOB and BTR back in the day and I am very grateful that back in the day has rolled around again with better AI and all the bugs I knew about gone. I one of my favorite games is now in the hands of folks who have proven over and over again that they really do give a d&%@ about it's future development.

THANKS MATRIX! Having a ball - glad you are here.

That said,
Is there any talk about starting from scratch and rebuilding a game that models this exciting bit of history from the ground up?

[Terminus]

ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge

yea but I like cussing at the computer, been doing that almost 30 years now

Causes improved operation of the machine. Well-known fact.

[leftydad]

As somebody who never played/owned BOB/RTR 15 years ago, I got this game over the weekend and I think it's great!!! Looks great to me on my widescreen, it's detailed, fun, addictive. I'm not disappointed. I'm delighted!

[06 Maestro]

ORIGINAL: harley
Guys like HARD Sarge are probably in the sub-cent per hour off the original game. I believe I spent more time tweaking and dissecting the game than I did playing it, but that meant I knew where the bodies were buried when I got the code...

In a virtual place far away and long ago I think I their were two fellows who were experts at this game with very similar handles as Hard Sarge and Harely. It was not a TS site, but a BTR fan site. If that was you two guys, you could count your costs in nano cents of Pesos.[;)]

ORIGINAL
... - before Matrix we argued whether there was some AI knowledge in there,

And, a few other fine points of the game. I used to go there just for those discussions.

I will get this eventually, but my plate is full right now. I have the original BTR, but it won't play on my Vista machine. I have not played that game in years. When I did, it was an everyday occurrence for over a year-one Grand campaign and several small scenarios. It was a great game-no doubt it is even better now.

[watchtower]

The only thing i'm disappointed about is that I don't have enough 'play' hours to enjoy this little beauty again.

[Hard Sarge]

ORIGINAL: 06 Maestro

ORIGINAL: harley
Guys like HARD Sarge are probably in the sub-cent per hour off the original game. I believe I spent more time tweaking and dissecting the game than I did playing it, but that meant I knew where the bodies were buried when I got the code...

In a virtual place far away and long ago I think I their were two fellows who were experts at this game with very similar handles as Hard Sarge and Harely. It was not a TS site, but a BTR fan site. If that was you two guys, you could count your costs in nano cents of Pesos.[;)]

ORIGINAL
... - before Matrix we argued whether there was some AI knowledge in there,

And, a few other fine points of the game. I used to go there just for those discussions.

I will get this eventually, but my plate is full right now. I have the original BTR, but it won't play on my Vista machine. I have not played that game in years. When I did, it was an everyday occurrence for over a year-one Grand campaign and several small scenarios. It was a great game-no doubt it is even better now.

I think it would be easier to list the people who were not from that forum who are here and working on the game (I even tried to refind and bring in Andrei)

so much info and detail was lost with that forum, it is really a shame

[terry1040]

It is great to see these games back after all these years.
I love the windows mode. Yes, everything is still a bit sluggish on my computer, but I am sure Matrix will fix this during the first patch. [8D]

Kudos to Harde Sarge and Team for spending all these years of hard work to put it together in one package.

If I would wish for something:
A way to manage all the daily data / results more efficiently (for instance in Excel).
I would love to see a text-report about what happended during the resolution phase and how my squadrons look like. [&o]

Beside that, this is just a fantastic release of an extremely interesting game. [:D]

Terry

[sprior]

I installed it last night. 1.7GHz twin core processor, 2GB RAM, Vista SP2 and it ran like a dream straight out the box. Ran it in windowed mode, moved the window around, checked my email for incoming AE turns, all as sweet as a nut. Thanks.

[TechSgt]

ORIGINAL: terry1040

...
If I would wish for something:
A way to manage all the daily data / results more efficiently (for instance in Excel).
I would love to see a text-report about what happended during the resolution phase and how my squadrons look like. [&o]

...

Terry

This is exactly my hope for the "windowed" mode. Open up a little side window in Excel to keep track of little tid-bits, EA unit locations, Target AAA, NF locations and types, enemy land unit movements, etc. Stuff I do by pencil for the old TOH.

TS

[MajorDude]

ORIGINAL: TechSgt

ORIGINAL: terry1040

...
If I would wish for something:
A way to manage all the daily data / results more efficiently (for instance in Excel).
I would love to see a text-report about what happended during the resolution phase and how my squadrons look like. [&o]

...

Terry

This is exactly my hope for the "windowed" mode. Open up a little side window in Excel to keep track of little tid-bits, EA unit locations, Target AAA, NF locations and types, enemy land unit movements, etc. Stuff I do by pencil for the old TOH.

TS

/signed [:)]

[fbs]

Changed the thread title, hahaha... [:D]

I still think the game can be so much more, but it is good entertainment.


Cheers [:D]
fbs