bug reports - new beta patch v55007b

[squadleader_id]

Installed the v55007b beta patch...went through some screens and played a quick battle to check out the changes...looks like some of the bugs were not addressed yet.
The elements.txt file hasn't addressed the see-thru hedgerows (Block LOS = 0)...and some minor (but annoying) data-gadget "typos" are still present.

Fixed Gammon bomb icon in Weapons.txt -> in the fix list, but looks like this hasn't been fixed.


Allied Company HQ using the wrong gadgets, they're using basic infantry symbols instead of their specialized symbols (Airborne, Ranger etc).
The gadgets are available, just not linked to the data correctly.




Error in the gadget files?



US AB using the wrong rank gadgets in the battle screens (olive Army uniforms instead of the khaki uniforms correctly used in the soldier screens):


Also...to represent US AB units correctly (uniforms and ranks gadgets)...extra data slots are needed for GIR Platoon and Company HQ teams.
In the current alsteam data...we only have PIR Platoon HQ Teams and GIR Company HQ Teams.
That's why you will see GIR BGs with Platoon HQ teams wearing M42 jumpsuits and PIR BGs with Company HQ teams wearing olive drab.

Tank and AG crew rank graphics are still not historically correct...I gotta get off my butt and finish my little Panzerwaffe rank mod
French Commandos rank gadgets in this beta patch needs fixing too...it's not updated with the final version of the graphics.

[squadleader_id]

Isigny - map coding glitches not fixed.
First reported here: tm.asp?m=2112120

[chopper8ac]

Good Work Squadleader ! We're getting closer- hopefully this will play as good as COI when all corrections are made. Hopefully the PzSchreck range will be corrected to 100-150
m also in the final patch.

[RD Oddball]

ORIGINAL: squadleader_id

Installed the v55007b beta patch...went through some screens and played a quick battle to check out the changes...looks like some of the bugs were not addressed yet.
The elements.txt file hasn't addressed the see-thru hedgerows (Block LOS = 0)...and some minor (but annoying) data-gadget "typos" are still present.

Fixed Gammon bomb icon in Weapons.txt -> in the fix list, but looks like this hasn't been fixed.


Allied Company HQ using the wrong gadgets, they're using basic infantry symbols instead of their specialized symbols (Airborne, Ranger etc).
The gadgets are available, just not linked to the data correctly.


Error in the gadget files?

US AB using the wrong rank gadgets in the battle screens (olive Army uniforms instead of the khaki uniforms correctly used in the soldier screens):


Also...to represent US AB units correctly (uniforms and ranks gadgets)...extra data slots are needed for GIR Platoon and Company HQ teams.
In the current alsteam data...we only have PIR Platoon HQ Teams and GIR Company HQ Teams.
That's why you will see GIR BGs with Platoon HQ teams wearing M42 jumpsuits and PIR BGs with Company HQ teams wearing olive drab.

Tank and AG crew rank graphics are still not historically correct...I gotta get off my butt and finish my little Panzerwaffe rank mod
French Commandos rank gadgets in this beta patch needs fixing too...it's not updated with the final version of the graphics.

Thanks for taking a fine tooth comb to this for us Squadleader.

RE: hedgerow LOS - Wasn't aware there were any issues here. It never got reported in our bug tracking system and thus never got looked at. I recall a voluminous thread about this but thought it was a matter of preference rather than an objective error. If you can nutshell it for me and it's something that is NOT a matter of preference then it'll get addressed. We're not in the habit of fixing things just because one or a handful of people simply don't like it as a matter of personal preference. We fix things that interfere with play or MANY people object to, enmasse. Otherwise making changes because one person dislikes something turns into a dog chasing it's tail. One person dislikes what someone else likes. ON that stuff we make a decision and stick with it. It sounds like to me that what you're describing is an error as hedges SHOULD block LOS but I've not seen this error on my end so we need to be able to replicate it. Details are needed. Were you quoting a data field in your above post or was that shorthand for describing what you're seeing?

RE: Co HQ gadgs - Thanks for pointing this out. It'll get fixed.

RE: Commando section HQ gadg - ditto.

RE: uniform colors etc. - We'll look at it but discussions about historical accuracy can be proven just as much as they can be disproven. I'm not going to lie and say I know exactly what cloth uniforms were cut from and that a given country ALWAYS used that type of cloth and color and that the given color dye never faded or was darker than planned or was never manufactured differently or some compromises were never made if one cloth type was unavailable or whatever. I've got no clue about that stuff and I don't feel it has bearing on close combat (lower case version) or effects game play for everyone. Yes it effects immersion of play and we'd certainly like you and anyone else who cares about that level of detail to be happy when playing the game. If there's undisputable proof you can show I'll have learned something and the change will get made. If you already posted that in a previous thread please refresh my memory.

Thanks for your insighful, in depth feedback!

[squadleader_id]

ORIGINAL: RD_Oddball

Thanks for taking a fine tooth comb to this for us Squadleader.

No probs, Jim.
I had the day off...so [;)]

RE: hedgerow LOS - Wasn't aware there were any issues here. It never got reported in our bug tracking system and thus never got looked at. I recall a voluminous thread about this but thought it was a matter of preference rather than an objective error. If you can nutshell it for me and it's something that is NOT a matter of preference then it'll get addressed. We're not in the habit of fixing things just because one or a handful of people simply don't like it as a matter of personal preference. We fix things that interfere with play or MANY people object to, enmasse. Otherwise making changes because one person dislikes something turns into a dog chasing it's tail. One person dislikes what someone else likes. ON that stuff we make a decision and stick with it. It sounds like to me that what you're describing is an error as hedges SHOULD block LOS but I've not seen this error on my end so we need to be able to replicate it. Details are needed. Were you quoting a data field in your above post or was that shorthand for describing what you're seeing?

In a nutshell...the data in the original CC5 for hedgerow element "Block LOS" is incorrect...resulting in unrealistic LOS across multiple hedgerows seen in CCTLD (several people reported them at CCS). This was 'fixed' when major CC5 Normandy mods were released (GJS, Utah, BO)...more in depth discussion here:
tm.asp?m=2112120&mpage=2

RE: uniform colors etc. - We'll look at it but discussions about historical accuracy can be proven just as much as they can be disproven. I'm not going to lie and say I know exactly what cloth uniforms were cut from and that a given country ALWAYS used that type of cloth and color and that the given color dye never faded or was darker than planned or was never manufactured differently or some compromises were never made if one cloth type was unavailable or whatever. I've got no clue about that stuff and I don't feel it has bearing on close combat (lower case version) or effects game play for everyone. Yes it effects immersion of play and we'd certainly like you and anyone else who cares about that level of detail to be happy when playing the game. If there's undisputable proof you can show I'll have learned something and the change will get made. If you already posted that in a previous thread please refresh my memory.

Jim, I'm not complaining about uniform cloth color or anything like that...not at all [:)]...I'm not that anal about our beloved tiny soldiers [:'(]
I was referring to rank gadget designs for the German Panzer and Assault Gun crews.
The designs used now are based on stock CC5 Infantry uniforms...just painting them black for Panzer crews is...umm...a shortcut...not the grognard way [;)]
I've started working on them after the first beta patch came out but lost the mood and never got to complete the set (still need to work on the Assault Gun Wrap rank gadgets)...I'll see if I can complete the gadget set later this week.
tm.asp?m=2137066

The first draft I posted for the Panzer Wrap design:

[RD Oddball]

ORIGINAL: squadleader_id

RE: hedgerow LOS - Wasn't aware there were any issues here. It never got reported in our bug tracking system and thus never got looked at. I recall a voluminous thread about this but thought it was a matter of preference rather than an objective error. If you can nutshell it for me and it's something that is NOT a matter of preference then it'll get addressed. We're not in the habit of fixing things just because one or a handful of people simply don't like it as a matter of personal preference. We fix things that interfere with play or MANY people object to, enmasse. Otherwise making changes because one person dislikes something turns into a dog chasing it's tail. One person dislikes what someone else likes. ON that stuff we make a decision and stick with it. It sounds like to me that what you're describing is an error as hedges SHOULD block LOS but I've not seen this error on my end so we need to be able to replicate it. Details are needed. Were you quoting a data field in your above post or was that shorthand for describing what you're seeing?

In a nutshell...the data in the original CC5 for hedgerow element "Block LOS" is incorrect...resulting in unrealistic LOS across multiple hedgerows seen in CCTLD (several people reported them at CCS). This was 'fixed' when major CC5 Normandy mods were released (GJS, Utah, BO)...more in depth discussion here:
tm.asp?m=2112120&mpage=2

RE: uniform colors etc. - We'll look at it but discussions about historical accuracy can be proven just as much as they can be disproven. I'm not going to lie and say I know exactly what cloth uniforms were cut from and that a given country ALWAYS used that type of cloth and color and that the given color dye never faded or was darker than planned or was never manufactured differently or some compromises were never made if one cloth type was unavailable or whatever. I've got no clue about that stuff and I don't feel it has bearing on close combat (lower case version) or effects game play for everyone. Yes it effects immersion of play and we'd certainly like you and anyone else who cares about that level of detail to be happy when playing the game. If there's undisputable proof you can show I'll have learned something and the change will get made. If you already posted that in a previous thread please refresh my memory.

Jim, I'm not complaining about uniform cloth color or anything like that...not at all [:)]...I'm not that anal about our beloved tiny soldiers [:'(]
I was referring to rank gadget designs for the German Panzer and Assault Gun crews.
The designs used now are based on stock CC5 Infantry uniforms...just painting them black for Panzer crews is...umm...a shortcut...not the grognard way [;)]
I've started working on them after the first beta patch came out but lost the mood and never got to complete the set (still need to work on the Assault Gun Wrap rank gadgets)...I'll see if I can complete the gadget set later this week.
tm.asp?m=2137066

The first draft I posted for the Panzer Wrap design:

RE: LOS - Okay thanks for the extra info. I'll have a look and discuss it with a few folks. As long as it's not personal preference and it's fixable we will.

RE: ranks - If you send me the gadgs like you have in the past I'll be sure they get included. I assume you still have my e-mail. If not PM me.

[squadleader_id]

Jim, I might have misunderstood you about the uniform colors...were you referring to the US AB rank gadgets I posted?

US AB (PIR) are using gadgets C in battle (gamegadg)...instead of gadgets B.

[koontz]

Its still very unstable in Multiplayer, good
thing atleast that the crashes are when loading the game
and not during the battles.

[RD Oddball]

SL I'm not 100% sure.  I've been told some of that was intentional but I can't say I know the reasons.  I'll ask and get back to you.
 
Koontz - We've not seen any instability in MP in testing recent builds.  We'll need specific info to address any potential bugs.  OS, any pertinent hardware issues, have you updated drivers, what kind of firewalls are you behind, AV software have you set up your router to allow for the proper open ports, etc..

[Senior Drill]

ORIGINAL: RD_Oddball

SL I'm not 100% sure.  I've been told some of that was intentional but I can't say I know the reasons.  I'll ask and get back to you.

Koontz - We've not seen any instability in MP in testing recent builds.  We'll need specific info to address any potential bugs.  OS, any pertinent hardware issues, have you updated drivers, what kind of firewalls are you behind, AV software have you set up your router to allow for the proper open ports, etc..

I'll add to that list, Jim, in that crashes while loading are indicative of data and graphic file incompatability with saved game and battle files.

Koontz, did you apply the new patch to a fresh install? Or did you patch an already patched game? Are these crashes occuring when playing a new battle, operation or campaign, or are they showing up when trying to continue an existing operation or campaign?

Anytime the data or graphics files have been modified, there is a good chance that the new data and graphics may not play nice with old saved games. A soldier added to a tank, or deleted from a squad, a new weapons class added or an old one deleted. These, and many other possible combinations, including the availability of off board naval artillery to new maps could be the cause of those crashes. Sometimes there are no problems. Most often there is something that causes an incompatability and finding out just exactly what that is, is like trying to finding a flea on an elephant's ass. Next to impossible and a waste of everybody's time. Ya just can't play old games on new data. Never could, and never will.

The rule of Da Thumb is to finish all ops and camps prior to installing a patch be it a beta or gold. Then start new with a fresh install and apply the patch or patches in the specified order. Start new operations or campaigns and if problems occur, give every game, system and network parameter you can so the error can be reproduced. If it can't be reproduced, it points to operator error.

[RD Oddball]

As always, spot on.  Thanks Drill.

[GS_Schimpf]

Didn't check back if this typo/bug was in from the initial release, but I noticed it today for the first time, after installing the latest beta patch. It's just a minor thing but I noticed it and wanted you guys to know [:)]

[panzerlehr62]

Good catch!

Gz...

[Andrew Williams]

Ha... that's in WaR too... and today is the first report...thanks!

[RD Oddball]

I before e except after c. [:D]

[Neil N]

ORIGINAL: RD_Oddball

RE: uniform colors etc. - We'll look at it but discussions about historical accuracy can be proven just as much as they can be disproven. I'm not going to lie and say I know exactly what cloth uniforms were cut from and that a given country ALWAYS used that type of cloth and color and that the given color dye never faded or was darker than planned or was never manufactured differently or some compromises were never made if one cloth type was unavailable or whatever. I've got no clue about that stuff and I don't feel it has bearing on close combat (lower case version) or effects game play for everyone. Yes it effects immersion of play and we'd certainly like you and anyone else who cares about that level of detail to be happy when playing the game. If there's undisputable proof you can show I'll have learned something and the change will get made. If you already posted that in a previous thread please refresh my memory.

Thanks for your insighful, in depth feedback!

Being an airborne afficianado, I can speak a little to this...

Glider Troops wore the same ODs that regular infantry wore during WWII...it was a sore spot with them as they were part of the airborne, but did not get to wear M42s in Normandy, jump boots and could not blouse their pants. Because of this, all shoulder rank images for glider can get away with using the same ones as regular army.

After Normandy, the Parachute Infantry was very unhappy about being forced into the new M43s. Many paratroopers did not turn in their M42s as ordered because of a certain pride.

We showed American Airborne with M42s in WAR, and while not technically historically correct, I liked the distinction.

[RD Oddball]

Thanks for the info Neil. To hold you to the same requirement as everyone are there any sources you can cite? I know you're a fan of Mark Bando's site "Trigger Time". Any others? Books being best.

I too appreciate what was done in WaR. A fine homage to what the Airborne actually wanted. [:)] That being said I'm inclined to leave TLD as is for the historical accuracy side. Both scenarios have been represented now and the art is available for anyone wanting to create whichever scenario they wish.