Recommended reading?

[Paul Wykes]

Can Anyone suggest any books to read to brush up on the subject , both factual reference books and Novels.

By coincidience I had just started reading "Third World War--August 1985" by Sir general John hackett, which I had been suggested reading from several sources.

Any thoughts/suggestions on other books

Thanks

[Sabre21]

Oh man..there are so many to choose from. That one is pretty good from a higher level. Some others are Tom Clanceys "Red Storm Rising", one of my favorites is "Team Yankee", there's also another from the soviet perspective...I think it's called "Red Army"...not sure...I'll check a bit later thru my box of books:)

Theres a series of WWIII books...but I don't find them very good...a bit too much fiction.

I will look and see what else I can find.

Sabre21

[Paul Wykes]

Thanks.

I`ve read "team yankee", thats where I read about "the third world war".

I haven`t read Tom Clankcy`s book. Must try and track a copy down.

[byron13]

Clancey, taking full advantage of name recognition, also has a couple of fact-based books out that I have not looked at very closely. They describe particular kinds of units. I think he's got one out called "Armored Cavalry Regiment" - or something like that. I would expect it to dissect the equipment and doctrine of a cav regiment. There are some good books out on the Gulf War as well that, after three-quarters of the book spent on the glorious air campaign, would have some good stuff on the ground war. Seems like Clancey even co-authored one of those.

[NaKATPase]

I just picked up a book this afternoon entitled "Red Thrust" by S.J. Zaloga published in 1989.
I've only read the first two chapters thusfar, but it seems both enjoyable to read and quite informative (at least to someone like myself who has not served)
Each chapter covers one specific soviet unit type (motor rifle, tank, artillery, spetnatz etc.) and gives both a fictional account of that type of unit in action in a fictional war, followed by a more scholarly analysis of how such a unit would function. The focus is on small unit tactics (platoons/companies) and their training and equipment.

[Pantherblaster]

Well though "The Third World War - August 1985" is a good read I think it's a very, very UK centred/minded book. The numbers in both editions (he printed one in, I believe, 1978 and another revised one in 1983 or 1984) are increadeably incorrect. He makes assumptions on other NATO countries equipment (such as MBTs) that have been proven wrong, and downgrades most allies performances, while ofcourse the British can do no wrong, pound an extra Army Corps out of the ground, have the best equipment and training (I aggree on this last one though), etc.
It nonetheless is an interesting read and the "fighting", "article" and "intel reports" are nicely written.

"Red Storm Rising" is also a good book, but I would have liked more of Hackett's specifics on a map or something. Excellently written though.

Eric L. Larrie's"WWIII" and "To Defend and Protect" (or something like that) are also two books you might consider reading, good books in my view.

Larry Bonds book on a new Korean War in the 80's is, although dated, a very nice read too. "Cauldron", NATO falling apart a resurgent Germany and France who break up the EU and create a new European union dominated by them is although geo politically very unrealistic and pro-US in the fighting (well, we know that the US is his largest market, but Poland receiving and flying F15 vs Raphaels and winning and the same for them receiving M1s, well ....) a nice read.

If you are into reading "serious" books than on WWI I would recommend John Keegan's (the best military historian, I believe) "World War I" (original title, I know). "The face of battle" (eye witness accounts on Agincourt, Waterloo and The Somme supported by military theory and historical backgtound) and "Five armies in Normandy" (well no need explaining that) are also very good books from him.

"Into the Storm", by Tom Clancy is a pretty good read aswell. It describes Gen. Franks military career ending with his command on the Allied armoured forces that crushed Saddams Republican Guard westwards of the Kuwaiti desert.

Richard Holbrooke's book on the Dayton aggreement and the road up to it is interesting if you are into the former Yugoslavia.
He describes it as how he has seen it, an subjective, but still I think a very interesting insight in and a pretty sharp view of modern day diplomatics. Good read.

"End Game" (David Rohde) and "The Darkest Scenario" (Thijs Franken e.a.) are both very good books on the worst massacre in europe since WWII, Srebrenica (Bosnia).

I'm now in the process of reading a 2,000+ 2 part read on Hitler, how he grew up and so on, by Ian Kershaw. Very interesting and detailed into the person Adolf Hitler and the way he governed or rathwer the lack of his governing of his party and Nazi-Germany, etc. I really want to advice anyone interested into this bastard, but more than just te superficial that is known. It's a long read but it's very well written.

Regards,

Pantherblaster

[IronManBeta]

There are a lot of books, of course, but the majority have to be long out of print now. Fortunately I took an interest in the field in the late 80's and collected a lot of what was available at the time. I measure this stuff by the amount of shelf space I need to store it. At 8' (books, games, magazines) I consider it to be dissapointingly small, but still it forms a useful base. The web, of course, changes everything but that is another story....

The two absolute must-have books are "Weapons and Tactics of the Soviet Army" by David C Isby (1981) and "Armies of NATO's Central Front" by Isby and Charles Kamps Jr. in 1985. They are exhaustive encyclopedias of everything a wargamer ought to know. If you can possibly get your hands on these then pay any price and get them!

In a completely different vein is John F Antal's "Armor Attacks - The Tank Platoon" (1991) which is an interactive book by a serving officer. He did at least 3 of these and the reader becomes a commander and must make decisions as the book progresses that affect the outcome of the battle. It is soooo easy to make the wrong choice and end up in deep trouble. By the time you figure it out you will have obtained an education indeed!

In terms of what is in the stores right now, if you haven't snagged "Blackhawk Down" yet you owe it to yourself to get it. It is simply brilliant. Steve Newberg (author of MBT which underlies the present game) asked only that I read this book before starting in.

My #1 most interesting web link is the Federation of American Scientists: http://www.fas.org/ There is a ton of interesting modern military stuff here.

Cheers, Rob.

[Black Cat]

" Into The Storm" by Gen. Fred Franks ( with Tom Clancey ) is very worthwhile IMO.

Franks commanded the armor heavy VII Corps in Germany, and deployed with it to the Gulf War.

His relationship with "Storming Norman" makes interesting reading, but the real value is the forming of the Post Vietnam War Army that fought, and won, Desert Storm and how the staff War Planning works in a Corps.

[Pantherblaster]

Yes, "Black Hawk Down" is a very good reading and description of what happenned in Somalia in 1993.

WWIII, by Eric L. Larry, is required reading for everyone interested in a potential third world war. I think the US title was something like Arctic ....-fill in-....

Regards,

Pantherblaster:D

[IChristie]

Robert,

I remember that back in the 80's the Canadian Forces produced a book that was used for training. It was written as a fictional account of a mech infantry company during the openning hours of a Warsaw Pact invasion. I think it was called something like:
"Contact: the first 24 hours" or something. I remember that it was a really good read.

Do you recall it?

[IronManBeta]

Yes, I've got that book and wanted to make scenario #1 based squarely on it. It is almost an exact description of what this game could be about. I have it out in my stack at home and can't quite visualize the exact title but it was something like what you suggested or maybe "First Contact, etc". I think it was by noted military author Kenneth MacKessey (sp?). I'll check tonight.

The premise of the book is that the 4th Cdn Mech Bde is held deep in reserve until the Soviets begin to break through. 4th CMBG is ordered up and assumes a defensive position along a crest line anchored by several villages. Both flanks are in the air. The action centers on the inf bn with supporting tank company holding the left of the line. The arrive about 12 hours before the enemy and prepare a hasty defense. The lead Soviet tank regiment shows up and tries to bull it's way through in a poorly prepared rush that pierces 95% of the depth of the defense and nearly breaks through. The book ends as the Soviets go over to the defensive for a day and the 4th CMBG is pulled back to conform to the receding front line.

A lot of the detail is aimed at Canadian soldiers with the intent of relating their peacetime drills to potential wartime realities. It was very interesting to me because it spells out things in detail that are assumed elsewhere. The book is quite short though and shows signs of being a rush job. It could easily have been 10 times longer and still not been enough. I would say that more of it is aimed at 'man management' then at technical explanation. The maps are excellent and are backed up with actual photographs of the terrain itself. That really helps the reader to visualize the course of the battle.

I mentioned it to Steve Newberg and it turned out that he was familiar with it. He seemed to be somewhat less thrilled with it because, I think, the tactical situation wasn't very interesting to him and also because the descriptions were too stereotyped and 'official' in their tone. Prose-wise, it pales in comparison to anything by Larry Bond, Coyle or Clancy too. Nevertheless it was a very interesting read, and it really go me going back when Matrix suggested I might want to look at doing a modern title.

It was particularly helpful for things like expected unit frontages, weapons lethality (guestimates), length of command cycles, arty doctrine, and some air/helo support.

I should park it by my bedside again and browse it a little more. There might be some gems yet that I didn't appreciate at the time and could benefit from now!

Cheers, Rob.

[IChristie]

Been a while since I read it. I certainly wouldn't vouch for it's style in comparison to "real" novels. I just remember it being a nice break from the official pams that formed our steady force-fed diet during phase training.