Supply Issues Post Patch 2 (Beta) - Stumbled on the answer?

[bsq]

I know that there has been a lot of discussion about supply issues post the latest patch - here's my observations.

I upgraded a game in early Mar 45. I was setting up for several major assaults in SEAC so was hoarding supply in the eastern ports of India (in particular Madras, Calcutta, Chittagong and Colombo).

On 5 Mar 45 (the day of the upgrade) all had more than 900k supply. 9 days later, this value had dropped on average by 75%!!

The only way to really check what had happened required a closed environment (one with few variables) - Ceylon then.

All units in Ceylon were fully supplied, so it wasn't that that was the issue. Only one convoy had left taking no more than 60k to Rangoon, so this was not the issue. There are only 5 locations on the island, so I checked them all (before and after) and 'Hey Presto' all the supplies are still on the island, but not where I wanted them and certainly now not where my AKs are!!

Cautionary tales here (x2)
Players - watch your supply settings on the demand side - set it too high and now all your supplies will be dragged all over the map via contiguous land hexes. I don't know what the optimum settings are, but max will drag 1000's of tons of supplies all over the place.
Devs - this is such a fundamental difference to how supply movement is handled, you need to tell us in BIG LETTERS how significant this change is and better still how to manage it, because the old ways cause carnage! (Of course if you did, then the letters needed to be bigger and 'aircrew' friendly (use crayon [:D] ))

This has completely screwed up 12 game months of planning for me in one theatre and I see no way out of it, short of starting over for the last 9 turns.

[BigJ62]

"All units in Ceylon were fully supplied, so it wasn't that that was the issue. Only one convoy had left taking no more than 60k to Rangoon, so this was not the issue. There are only 5 locations on the island, so I checked them all (before and after) and 'Hey Presto' all the supplies are still on the island, but not where I wanted them and certainly now not where my AKs are!!"

Where are the AKs? Where did the supply end up? Were any add supply buttons set for any of the bases?

I've noticed from some of the saves people are posting that they are way over using the add supply feature, it should only be used when there is no other choice and even then sparingly.

In playing the Allies I have only needed the add supply feature in only two places Singers and Batan and no where else.

[canuck64]

ORIGINAL: bsq

I know that there has been a lot of discussion about supply issues post the latest patch - here's my observations.

I upgraded a game in early Mar 45. I was setting up for several major assaults in SEAC so was hoarding supply in the eastern ports of India (in particular Madras, Calcutta, Chittagong and Colombo).

On 5 Mar 45 (the day of the upgrade) all had more than 900k supply. 9 days later, this value had dropped on average by 75%!!

The only way to really check what had happened required a closed environment (one with few variables) - Ceylon then.

All units in Ceylon were fully supplied, so it wasn't that that was the issue. Only one convoy had left taking no more than 60k to Rangoon, so this was not the issue. There are only 5 locations on the island, so I checked them all (before and after) and 'Hey Presto' all the supplies are still on the island, but not where I wanted them and certainly now not where my AKs are!!

Cautionary tales here (x2)
Players - watch your supply settings on the demand side - set it too high and now all your supplies will be dragged all over the map via contiguous land hexes. I don't know what the optimum settings are, but max will drag 1000's of tons of supplies all over the place.
Devs - this is such a fundamental difference to how supply movement is handled, you need to tell us in BIG LETTERS how significant this change is and better still how to manage it, because the old ways cause carnage! (Of course if you did, then the letters needed to be bigger and 'aircrew' friendly (use crayon [:D] ))

This has completely screwed up 12 game months of planning for me in one theatre and I see no way out of it, short of starting over for the last 9 turns.

bsq-I'm not seeing what you discovered as an answer, though admittedly Ceylon is a good place to observe supply movement. But what happened to your supply?

[witpqs]

ORIGINAL: BigJ62

In playing the Allies I have only needed the add supply feature in only two places Singers and Batan and no where else.

I would like to ask a semi-related question to help clarify something for me. As the Allies there comes a point later in the GC where you are bringing supplies to a large port that is already filled up to the 999,999 limit. Not an island with only one base, but a port in a large area like Australia or India with many other bases that have lots of room available for supplies.

When you unload a supply TF at such a base with 999,999 supplies already on hand, do you lose the supplies into a black hole or do they move out to other bases?

So far I have made extensive use of the 'add supply' button in some of those 'other' bases just to pull supply out of the convoy arrival ports to keep them below 999,999. Is that necessary, or will the supplies automatically move to avoid being lost?

[BigJ62]

You can do it the way you describe or just unload at another port as supplies are not sent to bases that are maxed out, surely you have other bases that can use some supplies. Don will have to answer about unloading when base is maxed out.

[witpqs]

OK, I'll wait for Don to check in - thanks!

[oldman45]

I had a similar problem but it corrected it self. I am in early 43 and have a major campaign going in Indochina. Supply was tight but not a problem. When I did the patch ever body south of Akyab was out of supply. I started scrambling and before the effects of those actions could be felt over 100k showed up in the major bases. Not sure where it came from but everybody was happy. I had told the major bases in Thailand and Burma to max their supply. I think it was 3 or 4 days later the supplies show up. I have since dramatically turned down the supply demands and things seem to be settling down. It was pretty strange there for a bit.

[rockmedic109]

My problem is 999,999 supplies showing up at unusual places.
 
Like Kalgoorlie, near Perth.  Did someone unearth supplies left over from the colonial days?  Or did Lend-Lease have a Depot at this out of the way desert post with everything from toilet seats to cavalry sabres?
 
And another 999,999 showing up at Bali.  I can see it now.....
LT  "Sir!  The infamous Black Marketeer Count DeCoyne is here to see you."
COL  "Why?"
LT  "He has a proposition for you."
COL&nbsp; <I hope he doesn't want me to pay off my account early> "What can I do for you Mr DeCoyne?"
COUNT&nbsp; "It's what I can do for you.&nbsp; I have placed 999,999 tons of supplies at Bali."
COL&nbsp; "Why Bali?&nbsp; We can use them here in Soerabaja!"
COUNT&nbsp; "Soerabaja is going to fall.&nbsp; Putting those supplies here will just give the Japanese more supplies.&nbsp; On Bali the spoilage will reduce it before the Japanese can get much of it, the port is not big enough to pull enough out to make a difference and you can send subs there to sink the ships that do come after the supplies."
COL&nbsp; "What do you get out of this deal?"
COUNT&nbsp; "The locals can use the spoilage to turn the place into a resort for after the war.&nbsp; I am getting 15% of what each touriist spends for the next 100 years."
COL&nbsp; "Where'd you get all those supplies?"
COUNT&nbsp; "Have you ever heard of Lend-Lease?"

[bsq]

ORIGINAL: canuck64
bsq-I'm not seeing what you discovered as an answer, though admittedly Ceylon is a good place to observe supply movement. But what happened to your supply?

It stayed on the island, but got moved around by over judicious use of the supply demand buttons, which appeared to have little effect pre patch 2 (beta) but now certainly do. I did not go round on my 5 Mar 45 turn and change all the supply demands - I left them as I had them set. So it would appear that the problems others have been alluding to (in particular China) have at their root a major alteration in the overland supply movement algorithm.

I found a potential answer by noticing this change in effect in a closed environment (a multi-location island with more than one full hexside between any other landmass). I am sure that a Japanese player could find the same in Formosa or Luzon.

Subsequently I reversed the settings and 750k of supply returned to Colombo in one turn! Like I say the algorithm has been re-written because I have never seen that much supply move in a single day before and I have messed around with the demand settings in the past with the older builds.

[bradfordkay]

ORIGINAL: rockmedic109

My problem is 999,999 supplies showing up at unusual places.

Like Kalgoorlie, near Perth.  Did someone unearth supplies left over from the colonial days?  Or did Lend-Lease have a Depot at this out of the way desert post with everything from toilet seats to cavalry sabres?

And another 999,999 showing up at Bali.  I can see it now.....
LT  "Sir!  The infamous Black Marketeer Count DeCoyne is here to see you."
COL  "Why?"
LT  "He has a proposition for you."
COL  <I hope he doesn't want me to pay off my account early> "What can I do for you Mr DeCoyne?"
COUNT  "It's what I can do for you.  I have placed 999,999 tons of supplies at Bali."
COL  "Why Bali?  We can use them here in Soerabaja!"
COUNT  "Soerabaja is going to fall.  Putting those supplies here will just give the Japanese more supplies.  On Bali the spoilage will reduce it before the Japanese can get much of it, the port is not big enough to pull enough out to make a difference and you can send subs there to sink the ships that do come after the supplies."
COL  "What do you get out of this deal?"
COUNT  "The locals can use the spoilage to turn the place into a resort for after the war.  I am getting 15% of what each touriist spends for the next 100 years."
COL  "Where'd you get all those supplies?"
COUNT  "Have you ever heard of Lend-Lease?"

It sounds like Count DeCoyne works for M&M Enterprises...

[oldman45]

Now I am going to have to go check all my bases else where to see if that happened.

[bsq]

ORIGINAL: oldman45

Now I am going to have to go check all my bases else where to see if that happened.

Trouble is mate that it is hard to pin down on a continental landmass with multiple Lines of Communication just where all those bullets and bombs went. The only way I could see it is when it had only a few places it could have gone.

Certainly with the 3 sub-continent locations I mentioned I also altered the settings of the surrounding satellite bases, but I never got all of my supply back [&:]. Lesson learnt then and apart from the shock discovery I quite like the way this algorithm moves supplies (although the ability to move 3/4 Million tons of supply overnight might need to be looked at).

[oldman45]

I checked but with the troops spread out across Indochina its tough to see where the supplies went.. Like I had posted earlier all the supply went away then magicaly came back. The supply seems to be flowing like its supposed to except I can't seem to get supply into china. I am now flying it across the hump.