Military Misconceptions:

[AbsntMndedProf]

What misconceptions do people have about military equipment and/or strategy that you would like to set straight?

For my own part, I know that I used to believe the misconception that flash guards on MGs were to prevent the enemy from seeing the location of an MG while firing at night. I now know from reading here and other places, that isn't possible. Flash guards are there to protect the night vision of the gunner.

(Here is a chance for the veterans here to teach we civilians a feww things.)

Eric Maietta

[Les_the_Sarge_9_1]

My biggest beef is how the common schmuck person calls everything in military service a "tank".

EEEEEEEwwwwwwwww nothing gets on my nerves more than that stupidity.

Another classic misconception is that most famous battles were dilerate intentionally brilliant decisions.

War is about luck. The lucky live the unlucky die. Most of history's great generals were just lucky in most cases. I for instance think, while you can "make some of your luck" often it is just blind luck.

If Patton hadn't slapped a soldier in Italy his career would likely have been tied to the war in Italy.
If Monty hadn't walked into a done deal in North Africa, he would likely have ended up a nobody.
I could list a never ending string of examples of "blind luck" for all over WW2 if I wanted this thread to last forever I guess.

But Patton and Monty are my favourite examples.

[challenge]

Originally posted by Les the Sarge 9-1
War is about luck.

I agree with this, but only to a certain point. Many great victories may be owed to luck to some degree, but without the ability to recognize and exploit a favorable situation luck means little. History may show how luck played well in some cases, but it also is repleat with examples of bad tactics ruining even the best of luck.

It has been said you make your own luck. Good luck is nothing more than the ability to exploit favorable circumstances while minimizing the effects of unfavorable ones; bad luck is the inability to use events to your advantage.

[Jacc]

Take an airplane. No matter what the design, anything from Bf-109 to Gloster Gladiator and Learjet are approvable.
Now, arm this thing with one 10kg bomb.
Fly it in a public place - and watch the people shout "Look, a bomber! It has bombs, so it has to be a bomber!"
Arrgh.
Another is already mentioned - everything that moves and has at least some level of protection is a "tank".
And of course all these heroic Hollywood-based misconceptions: how hand grenaders explode in a huuuuuuge fireball, or you can protect yourself from .50 cal MG fire by hiding behind a table.

[BryanMelvin]

Not all is blind luck in winning a battle - Tactic's. Small unit tactic's win battles. Example--

In North Africa - German tanks would draw the UK tanks towards them and then retreat into their own dust as fast as they could go. Then as the UK tankers give chase - the dust clears and then they are knocked out by German AT Guns placed for such a happening. Then comes the Allied Tactics to counter this and so it goes...

It takes blind Luck to survive a battle but Tactics take center stage to win one

[Les_the_Sarge_9_1]

Luck down at the small unit level is perhaps more or less personal. Do you stop a bullet today or not.

Stripping the forces to go prop up Greece was unfortunely a political necessity, but in hindsight a bad choice.

As "luck" would have, the Germans choose to send Rommel at just that moment to North Africa.
Again as "luck" would have it, Rommel's initial daring didn't get him killed.

Now as "luck" would have it "Monty" shows just up in time for Al Alemien after several previous Brit Generals had been sacked.
He was able to beat a worn down Rommel, and gain fame that I think was arranged by those previous Generals that had pissed of Churchill.

So luck comes to many leaders in many ways.

If the Brits had left the forces in North Africa to mop up, we would not have known of Rommel likely, and therefore would have never heard of Monty either I suppose.

[chief]

Blind luck was having our three aircraft carriers at sea on Dec 7, 41, and as a sideline not hitting the fuel depots at Pearl was another stroke of Luck...

[Belisarius]

Originally posted by chief
Blind luck was having our three aircraft carriers at sea on Dec 7, 41, and as a sideline not hitting the fuel depots at Pearl was another stroke of Luck...

Luck - or poor intelligence and strategy by the Japanese :p

Had they given some serious effort to it, they'd known that the carriers were scheduled to be out of port on Dec. 7.

- Go after the ships! Once the fighters are out, sink the ships! The ships! Nothing but the ships!

D'oh. Bad strategy.

[BryanMelvin]

I guess it goes with the definition of the words "Blind Luck" you mean. It appears we are speaking of something different.

Blind Luck means to me in current disscussion that any nation can go to war with another and each has a 50 percent chance to win the war. No need to worry - blind luck will win any war. If Ethiopia delcares war on America then by blind luck - Ethiopia can win this war and send the USA back to the stone age all due to blind luck.

As many here are defining blind luck - I would define as fate.

Fate - involves more what is being said here as Blind luck.

Fate involves choices and human consideration. The German HQ sent Rommel to NA due to his skill not a roll of the dice as Blind luck would have. Same with Monty, same with Patton - these men made decisions to follow a military career. Fate involves decisions. The US broke the Japanese code and thus knew Midway was the Japanese next target. That took work and skill to do. Blind luck would have a two year old breaking the code by accident then babbling,place her finger on a map and thus - blind luck says Japanese would stike LA County. Fate involves the work it took to break the code and decisions involved. Now the Battle was determined by the luck of the draw and the decisions made by men in combat.

Pure Blind luck involves the roll of the dice, a toss of the coin, no choice needed. Surviving an Nebelwaffer attack would be blind luck as would avoiding all wounds in combat.

If you were running your own buisness - that buisness would not survive long on blind luck. It takes decisions - finding the right person for the job - budgeting - planning etc.. You make things happen and maintain a certian degree of control in the direction your buisness may take. Yes, there is a degree of luck involved but not blind luck. So I think we are discussing two different definitions concerning blind luck.

[rlc27]

I hate how the average layman knows of only two weapons: guns and bombs; makes me think of those black round fused things in cartoons. And confuses German POW camps with concentration camps. And no matter what the delivery system, be it intercontinental ballistic missile, suitcase, howitzer, or airplane, calls any nuclear weapon a "nuclear bomb." And calls anything that is not a "bomber," (see above post) a "fighter-jet."

Oh, and the tank thing, too--I've heard someone refer to both a Humvee and a piece of self-propelled artillery as "tanks."

[Les_the_Sarge_9_1]

Ignorance is bliss only goes so far eh.

[Karnaaj]

When dealing with Hollywood, "misconception" becomes the norm. <G> If it looks cool, thewy'll do it - if reality screws the story, ignore it. (Remember, kids, all those cool explosions whenever a vehicle is shot/crashes *are* special effects; anyone who has had to work on a carburetor knows that it's a delicate process to get an explosive fuel/air mixture.)

Ducking behind tables? <smirk> Ducking behind *cars* may not help. IRON HORSE magazine (biker rag) once "tested" a Japanese motorcycle... by hosing it (and a Renault "Le Car" at the same location) with an MG34. Many bulletholes later, both were even more trashed than before - and I seem to recall exit holes *on the far side of the car, through the engine block*. <!!!> Admittedly, an older Detroit Iron barrier might fare better... but I'd still rather be the guy firing the MG. <G>

[Ograbme]

-Anything that can shoot more than one bullet per decade is a "machine gun".
-Grenades/bazookas can blow up buildings.
-85% of all battlefield casualties are caused by snipers.
-Tank commanders aren't at all concerned by those heroic ragtag soldiers defending the city and won't demean themselves by closing the effing hatch.
-Anything more durable than canvas will stop any projectile ever invented.
-Artillerymen are psychic and already know where you want them to shoot. All you need to do is ask for support and the shells will be on target before you can say "over"