The Japanese Economy

[Grotius]

One question on a different topic: in Scenario 2, I can't halt Shinano at game start! After work I'll fire up Tracker to figure out why this is. I assume you guys can halt her in Scenario 1? I couldn't halt any of the RO-class subs, either. I can halt Musashi, but I don't think I want to. I usually halt at least something on turn 1 to see what my production-trends look like; this time I might just let everything produce and see what happens.

But mostly I'm curious whether Shinano is treated differently in Scenario 1 and 2. I know I get more toys; maybe the designers actually want me to build Shinano. Still, I don't think I have any more Naval Shipyard points in Scenario 2 than in Scenario 1, so I don't understand why I can't halt her. I've got more of just about everything else, though, including supply and fuel.

[Mike Solli]

ORIGINAL: Grotius

Thanks for the replies. Mike, I downloaded your useful Powerpoint file on upgrades. One question I have: the Ki-36 Ida doesn't seem to upgrade to anything. When I click 'upgrade' on it in game, one group says I can upgrade to the Dinah (a recon plane), while another says I can upgrade to the Sonia (a bomber). Why isn't it just one or the other -- and why is the Dinah a possibility at all? Not that I'm complaining; I wouldn't necessarily mind a couple more Dinah groups.

Speaking of the Dinah, though, the Ki-15-II Babs seems like a longer-legged, superior alternative. Is it?

I halted Ida production in any case, and converted that factory to the A6M2.

Do you have PDU off? If that's the case, then the only upgrade is what that unit's historical upgrade. I'm playing with PDU off and on occasion, there are some truly weird upgrades. It sounds like that to me.

[Chickenboy]

ORIGINAL: seille

For my own game with PDU on i just decided what bombers i want at the start and what fighters.
I´ll not produce any japanese army bombers except the Sally. No Lilly, Ida, Sonia. After looking at i
thought this is only crap.
For the army fighters i decided to go with Oscars and produce Nates only until the engines are used up.

Navy i´ll go with Betties and Nells. Then Kates and Vals of course.
Increased their numbers as well as the A6M2 production.
I used AE Tracker to figure out which and how many engines i´ll need and after the air frame adjustments
i made the adjustments for the engines.
A lot to repair now....
R&D i did not touch yet, but i think i´ll try to accelerate some fighters.
Don´t think i´ll need many late war bombers and i won´t need the VERY late fighters, but a plane like the Ki84
is interesting. That was my noob planning [:)]

For IJA bombers, the Sally line is clearly the class choice. Best payload, decent range and the like.

In planning for your production, it is also important to remember the engine type shared between IJA and IJN frames. In this case, I believe that the Ha-32 is shared between Betty and Sally types. So, if you're going to pin all of your hopes on the Sally and Betty, you'd better jack up Ha-32 production to the rafters. IIRC (I'm at work now), the Nell uses Ha-33, so at least it's a different engine type in demand than the Sally needs.

I keep a modest production of both Nells and Bettys for IJN bombers. If Ha-32 engine production starts running low, I can still maintain production of Nell torpedo bombers and not jeapordize my Sally production line by putting my Betties in a production 'halt'.

[seille]

Yes, Betty and Sally use the same Engine (HA-32)
I expanded these factories a lot , so i´ll need 268 of these engines !
Maybe i was crazy, but i plan to produce 73 Betty and 61 Sally per month.
Think too many Betties.....we´ll see. I expect "some" losses.
 
When my factories are repaired i´ll have the amount of engines i need.
But i just think i made a mistake in my calculation.
I´ll need also engines for the R&D airframes, right ?

[Mynok]

Those big birds make your best kamikazes later in the war. Can't really have too many of them IMO.

[Mike Solli]

ORIGINAL: seille
I´ll need also engines for the R&D airframes, right ?

No, you don't need engines for R&D factories until the factory becomes operational (when the R&D disappears).

[seille]

Puhh, fortunately ! Otherwise my production planning would have been a waste of time.
Damn, and i know there are many more of these "traps" waiting for me.
Thanks for your help. Many helpful tips. Hope i can keep most of them in my head....

[Grotius]

Do you have PDU off? If that's the case, then the only upgrade is what that unit's historical upgrade. I'm playing with PDU off and on occasion, there are some truly weird upgrades. It sounds like that to me.

PDU on, actually. I'm seeing two different upgrades for the same plane, the Ida. Ah well -- either upgrade would be a vast improvement over the original.

I'm worried that Scenario 2 is going to spoil me. I have a LOT more fuel and supply.

[BShaftoe]

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

Try this. It's just Japanese.

Many thanks, Mike. It's exactly what I was looking for. Lots of thanks.

[ny59giants]

I was killing time today waiting for a turn in my Inbox. I was going through multiple pages in this thread. I knew about the "J" key, but had failed to see the set of buttons that come show up when I prioritize either the "air" or "engines." I was doing my air production like WITP where you could mainly double production, not increase size by "ONE." Needless to say, it got a work out my last turn. [:)]

Thanks you AE Team. [&o][&o]

[SqzMyLemon]

I hear you there ny59giants, I wish in hindsight I'd have known that patch 2 would let you really tweak production in as small an increment as a single engine/airframe, what a huge difference. The doubling option was the only choice at the time when I expanded, but like a marine I'll adapt and overcome. That being said, the developers have been fantastic trying to make this a great gaming experience by constantly improving things.

[FatR]

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy
For IJA bombers, the Sally line is clearly the class choice. Best payload, decent range and the like.

Helen gets armor starting from 8/1942, and Sally never does. IMO, Helens should be the main type of IJAAF bombers throughout 1943-44 (the late versions are nearly as good as Ki-67s). Yes, Ki-49 has a unique engine, but armor greatly affects both casualties and pilot survival. I thing it is absolutely vital.

[Chickenboy]

ORIGINAL: FatR

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy
For IJA bombers, the Sally line is clearly the class choice. Best payload, decent range and the like.

Helen gets armor starting from 8/1942, and Sally never does. IMO, Helens should be the main type of IJAAF bombers throughout 1943-44 (the late versions are nearly as good as Ki-67s). Yes, Ki-49 has a unique engine, but armor greatly affects both casualties and pilot survival. I thing it is absolutely vital.

I hadn't thought that far out in my comments, but you're right when comparing the later war Helen to the early war Sally.

[FatR]

Early in the war you cannot reconfigure your airforce the way you want too, any major shifts in plane park take several months. But if you can allow it economically, yes, Sally is better. Light bombers hardly do any damage, except to Chinese. Also, in RL Helen never completely replaced Sally, in AE it should.

[Mark Weston]

I'm into the first few turns of my first CG as Japan. And I have to say that the planning and logistics side of being a JFB is disturbingly addictive.

Informed by the fantastic discussion in this and other threads I have a fairly clear idea of what I need to do to get fuel and resources in the amounts I need. I have a plan for aircraft and engine production. I've planned a modest increase to the shipyards so that I can accelerate a few shiny toys. But without any previous CG experience I have no idea how much is needed in the way of armaments and vehicles, and that seems to get much less coverage here.

Perhaps the Japanese vets could share their experiences? Can Japan get by on current production in armaments and vehicles? If not, how much do you expand them? And when?

[xj900uk]

Ahh, but that's half the fun of it you see.  No two persons ideas & experiences are quite the same.
There are lots of ideas and decisions you can make regarding Japan.  You have to safeguard & build up the economy, and to do that you need to protect the mercantile marine to get oil, resources and fuel back to the Home Islands - if you don't do that then all your ideas will just stay that way & never get put into fruition.

[Mike Solli]

ORIGINAL: Mark Weston
Perhaps the Japanese vets could share their experiences? Can Japan get by on current production in armaments and vehicles? If not, how much do you expand them? And when?

Initially, I don't expand armaments or vehicles at all. The 72 vehicles does look a little thin though. I expect to increase vehicles to ~100 by Spring 42. So far, I'm ok with vehicles (mid-Jan 42), but that can change pretty quickly with one bad attack. I did lose half a Tank regiment when a cargo ship went down (proof that you need to put every LCU in at least 2 cargos). It's been rebuilt so that took a good chunk of the vehicle production.

Armaments, I'm still not sure about. It's growing nicely, but that will drop when you get major units. Gotta keep an eye on that too.

[Mike Solli]

ORIGINAL: Mark Weston
Perhaps the Japanese vets could share their experiences? Can Japan get by on current production in armaments and vehicles? If not, how much do you expand them? And when?

Initially, I don't expand armaments or vehicles at all. The 72 vehicles does look a little thin though. I expect to increase vehicles to ~100 by Spring 42. So far, I'm ok with vehicles (mid-Jan 42), but that can change pretty quickly with one bad attack. I did lose half a Tank regiment when a cargo ship went down (proof that you need to put every LCU in at least 2 cargos). It's been rebuilt so that took a good chunk of the vehicle production.

Armaments, I'm still not sure about. It's growing nicely, but that will drop when you get major units. Gotta keep an eye on that too.

[String]

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli



Armaments, I'm still not sure about. It's growing nicely, but that will drop when you get major units. Gotta keep an eye on that too.

Especially if you're playing scenario 2 where the japanese get extra reinforcements.

[n01487477]

ORIGINAL: String

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli



Armaments, I'm still not sure about. It's growing nicely, but that will drop when you get major units. Gotta keep an eye on that too.

Especially if you're playing scenario 2 where the japanese get extra reinforcements.

And even in Scenario 1, you'll need to bump it up ... this just shows LCU's arrival with VEH needs, without dealing with losses. The green line is the accumulated need, the blue is the production points and the red, when each arrives and the cost.