Operation Barbarossa - Alpha AAR

[wiking62]

Okay, thanks for the reply.

I don't want to start another discussion that detracts from your AAR.

Are those Hungarian units that have started to show up in the screenshot of AGS to the South, North and North East of Zhitomir?

[Zort]

Sorry if I missed this from before, but on the AGC picture, bottom left, there is a symbol on the inf div. What does that mean: entrained?

[elmo3]

ORIGINAL: hart2412

Okay, thanks for the reply.

I don't want to start another discussion that detracts from your AAR.

Are those Hungarian units that have started to show up in the screenshot of AGS to the South, North and North East of Zhitomir?

The off white background units are Slovak. Green background are Hungarian. Baby blue are Rumanian. Gold (yellow) are Italian.

[elmo3]

ORIGINAL: Zort

Sorry if I missed this from before, but on the AGC picture, bottom left, there is a symbol on the inf div. What does that mean: entrained?

Yup. It's a boxcar. In some earlier shots the symbol looked like two train tracks but it was changed to the boxcar as the train tracks looked more like a ladder.

[Muzrub]

ORIGINAL: elmo3

Losses through turn 13:

Hi mate,


Just a quick question- it appears to me that the casualty figures are rather high when comparing Men Killed with Men Disabled.

Do you think the Killed column is out of proportion with the Disabled column?

Also if the killed column could be reduced and more men were added to the Disabled column would those wounded men be added back into the force pool later- or are disabled and wounded considered totally different?

It is just that I have been watching your progress overtime and it really appears that the Eastern Front was even more dangerous than I first suspected- you don't get wounded, you just get dead!

cheers,

keep up the good work.

BTW the idea of highlighting elite army units should be implemented, I might have to go back and check but are NKVD and Guards units highlighted?

[paullus99]

Actually, I had the same question - since wounded always outnumbered dead.

[Joel Billings]

Disabled are very long term but not permanently out of action troops. 2% of the disabled column come back to the manpower pool each turn. There are many more getting wounded each turn that are not in the permanent losses column. Those show up in the Recent Casualties column. In game terms these can be elements that are damaged which can be repaired at any time. Disabled comes from elements that are destroyed.

[Platypus]

ORIGINAL: elmo3

Turn 12 for AGC followed a similar patter to the previous version.  We liquidated the pocket even though the Soviets were in supply.  It cost us more casualties but nothing could be done about that.  We also move as many mobile units as possible into the area near Vyazma for the anticipated breakout toward Moscow next turn.  1st SS Mot Div and 60th Mot Div arrived by train from the west and were inserted into the line northwest of Vyazma.  Three more infantry divisions also arrived in the area this turn and will be fed into the flanks next turn if we achieve our breakthrough.

Hi Elmo - some queries about how the AI's capability has changed since the first run-through.

1. Does the re-run simply mean that the SOV AI has deployed more units forward now, thus draining STAVKA's reserves? ie. GER is now seeing some 'desperation' from the AI?

2. Does the SOV AI have its unit releases fixed to a timetable, or, is it based upon various defence lines on the map? ie. if GER reaches the line RZHEV - KALUGA, then X number of SOV divisions appear in front of MOSCOW?

3. Is the AI SOV ORBAT restricted to historical numbers and designations?

The reason I ask is that some other game AIs 'play' in an ahistorical manner, by adding extra units to overcome a clever human opponent.

cheers

[elmo3]

ORIGINAL: Muzrub

Hi mate,
...

BTW the idea of highlighting elite army units should be implemented, I might have to go back and check but are NKVD and Guards units highlighted?

I think Joel covered your questions about casualties. Guards have a red background so they are distinguished from regular troops that way. I don't recall anything distinguishing about NKVD counters but will check.

[elmo3]

ORIGINAL: Platypus

Hi Elmo - some queries about how the AI's capability has changed since the first run-through.

1. Does the re-run simply mean that the SOV AI has deployed more units forward now, thus draining STAVKA's reserves? ie. GER is now seeing some 'desperation' from the AI?

2. Does the SOV AI have its unit releases fixed to a timetable, or, is it based upon various defence lines on the map? ie. if GER reaches the line RZHEV - KALUGA, then X number of SOV divisions appear in front of MOSCOW?

3. Is the AI SOV ORBAT restricted to historical numbers and designations?

The reason I ask is that some other game AIs 'play' in an ahistorical manner, by adding extra units to overcome a clever human opponent.

cheers

1. Not sure as I am not looking at the AI side. That would be cheating. [;)] The latest updates made the AI more likely to garrison cities and made other improvements to it's play. From air recon I've seen some areas that looks like a defense in depth and other areas that look pretty thin.

2. A number of new Soviet armies are formed automatically in the 15 turns or so. No units are created based on the on-map situation AFAIK.

3. I'm playing on Challenging so the AI gets a number of benefits. Additional units might be one of them. I'm not sure about that as this is my first test of the '41 campaign. Maybe one of the testers with more experience will comment on that.

[elmo3]

Not sure I will have time for a full turn today but here is part of it at least.  On turn 14 (week of 9/18/41) AGN made good progress thanks to a combined effort of 4th Pz Grp (red) and 18th Army (purple).  We isolated three Soviet divisions with 1st Pz Div and 8th Pz Div slicing northwest to the western outskirts of Pushkin.  They are now only 20 miles from the port of Leningrad.

[Balou]

elmo,

"port of Leningrad". Is that significant of some sort ?

[elmo3]

ORIGINAL: Balou

elmo,

"port of Leningrad". Is that significant of some sort ?

No, since we have good supply lines. If we did not then we might need the port as a supply source.

[elmo3]

In the center we were able to push within 20 miles of W Moscow with 4 divisions from 2nd Pz Grp (light blue) and one from 3rd Pz Grp (light green).  Other units rfom those groups are trailing not too far behind and keep the supply lines open.  The 9th Army (dark green) continues to hold the northern flank although I don't know where those Soviets came from behind out lines north of Smolensk.  They are surrounded and won't be going far now in any case.  I moved most of my airbases forward this turn to be able to provide air support next turn.  Not sure if we will get enough supply to the forward elements for a push on Moscow or whether we'll need to wait another turn.  Time is critical now as the rains and mud will be coming soon.

[elmo3]

In the south Kiev fell to  our infantry assault which allowed most of the armor of 1st Pz Grp (red) to push out to the southeast.  I'll have to look at the big picture in the area and decide where to head next given that the weather will be closing in soon.  Supply lines are short right now so we should have plenty of fuel to make some good progress for another couple of weeks at least.

[elmo3]

Noting to report of note on the Rumanian frontier so we'll skip the screen shot and end the turn to get the casualty reports.

[elmo3]

Losses through turn 14:

[paullus99]

Establishing a firm defense on the Dniepr might not be a bad idea - if you can cut south & pocket the remaining Russians on the Rumanian frontier.

[elmo3]

OK here is a screen shot for the start of turn 15.  It is the Logistics Phase Event Log showing replacements and ammo that made it to the front this turn.  It also shows that a few units were upgraded to new TOE's. I'm not sure this screen is complete yet so don't worry about what is not shown at this point.

[elmo3]

ORIGINAL: paullus99

Establishing a firm defense on the Dniepr might not be a bad idea - if you can cut south & pocket the remaining Russians on the Rumanian frontier.

That is a possibility. The 1st Pz Grp is in a good position to make a pocket this turn or next.