allies GC save game turn 1

[Houtje]

Hi,
I was wondering if anyone would be willing and able to send or post a save game-file of their first turn of the allied GC (scen 1, vs AI). I've put about 20 hours into my first turn already and am still slightly overwhelmed. I've taken a look at Kull's spreadsheet, which is very useful btw, but I would just like to examine and click through the units and bases on the first turn of an experienced player (convoys, replacement settings, development, etc. etc.).

I am NOT looking to profit from someone else's dirty work by simply using their save files, but I hope to gain some insight into how experienced players cope with this beast of a game.

Thanks in advance for any help.

[khyberbill]

The best way is to do it yourself. Too many different choices for you and what someone else may do, may not fit your style of play. Are you going to stand and fight (and die) in Malaya? What about all the units in the DEI? Will you contest landings with your small cruiser forces or run away to play another day? Do you send your CV's to contest the landings at Wake and to rescue the Marine unit there? Or head south to contest elsewhere? I have started at least 15 PBEMs as Allies in WITP and AE and I am still refining my FIRST move.
As starters
1) Reposition your long haul cargo and tankers to west coast/capetown/abadan/aden. I send all 17knot AP AK's etc to the west coast.
2) In Malaya, I extract fragments of all Indian brigades (they rebuild nicely), the British BF's and the 22nd and 27th Ozzies.
3) In DEI, I make a concerted effort to get the two air base forces (1 Mil and 2 Mil) to Australia due to their large air support role-buy out all DEI forces to Burma Command and save 67% on your PP. There is a nice hilltop town in the middle of Java that is great for a last stand.
4) Manila is the great escape. The forces of evil will sink a lot of those ships, but not all. Same with HK. In one game I got most of the HK forces to Midway in just under 10 days. Buy out your PT boats in these two places.
5) Force Z, I try to save. The landing of choice today is Mersing so I would send Force Z there with a home port of Batavia-if nothing shows up there it will retreat-I hope. Move your torpedo planes to Singapore at first and start hunting. When it gets too hot, send the good squads to India.


I hope that helps.
Good Luck

[carnifex]

Don't worry too much about the first turn if playing vs the Japanese AI. The only thing you really have to do on turn one is get the ships out of Manilla and Hong Kong.

It's not like the war started and all of a sudden every single Allied ship was steaming, every air group rebasing, and every LCU getting on a train. You will have weeks to move things around before the Japanese show up anywhere vital. Load whatever the latest setup is and click End Turn.

[Torplexed]

ORIGINAL: carnifex

Don't worry too much about the first turn if playing vs the Japanese AI. The only thing you really have to do on turn one is get the ships out of Manilla and Hong Kong.

It's not like the war started and all of a sudden every single Allied ship was steaming, every air group rebasing, and every LCU getting on a train. You will have weeks to move things around before the Japanese show up anywhere vital. Load whatever the latest setup is and click End Turn.

Exactly. I think too many people try to over-optimize their first turn and game the game. Historically, the British never dreamed Malaya would be steamrolled so quickly, and MacArthur thought he could hold the Japanese at the beaches. Most mainland US forces were sent to guard West Coast beaches against an invasion that a player with hindsight knows isn't likely soon if ever. Instead, he starts packing those forces overseas straight away as soon as the PP permit. The AI, while better than the WITP original is never gonna give you the no holds barred fight a competent human will. So, relax a bit. [8D]

[Kull]

ORIGINAL: Houtje

Hi,
I was wondering if anyone would be willing and able to send or post a save game-file of their first turn of the allied GC (scen 1, vs AI). I've put about 20 hours into my first turn already and am still slightly overwhelmed. I've taken a look at Kull's spreadsheet, which is very useful btw, but I would just like to examine and click through the units and bases on the first turn of an experienced player (convoys, replacement settings, development, etc. etc.).

I am NOT looking to profit from someone else's dirty work by simply using their save files, but I hope to gain some insight into how experienced players cope with this beast of a game.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Unfortunately this subforum doesn't allow for the upload of anything as large as a Save Game file, but I created another thread in which I've posted the Save file that results from taking all the actions listed in my spreadsheet (for those interested, check this thread). Keep in mind that this is "Day 2" of Scenario 2. I didn't post it earlier simply because you don't learn anything by just playing from someone else's starting position, but for those who are using the spreadsheet as a guide, it might be helpful.

[treespider]

390 turns later and you'll be at Jan 1 1943. I bet you can overcome something you overlook on Turn 1 in the intervening 389 turns...[;)]

[Kull]

ORIGINAL: treespider

390 turns later and you'll be at Jan 1 1943. I bet you can overcome something you overlook on Turn 1 in the intervening 389 turns...[;)]

All true, but I'm telling you, this game is HUGELY intimidating to new players. It's not so much they're worried about forgetting something as just trying to figure out where and how to start!

[Jim D Burns]

ORIGINAL: carnifex
The only thing you really have to do on turn one is get the ships out of Manilla and Hong Kong.

Against the AI, I leave many of the ships in Manila for future evacuations of the big Asiatic fleet baseforce units in Manila and Bataan. Wait a few turns for mini KB to leave the area, then load em up and ship em out along with the HQ unit itself as well. You don't really need the baseforce units and they can help early in the game when your ports aren't very large yet in other places where you want to unload a lot of shipping.

You can usually safely leave the other ships in port at Manila as well so they don’t get jumped by mini KB either.

At Hong Kong, I make three amphib task forces (based on the different ship speeds) and load up as many of the land units as I can before heading south with those ships. You take some hits for sure there, but the added combat power of the surviving units you evacuate from Hong Kong really adds some power to Darwin’s defense later.

Of course a human opponent would make short work of your ships in both cases, but against the AI, there’s room to get creative without paying too huge a price.

Jim

[Misconduct]

ORIGINAL: Houtje

Hi,
I was wondering if anyone would be willing and able to send or post a save game-file of their first turn of the allied GC (scen 1, vs AI). I've put about 20 hours into my first turn already and am still slightly overwhelmed. I've taken a look at Kull's spreadsheet, which is very useful btw, but I would just like to examine and click through the units and bases on the first turn of an experienced player (convoys, replacement settings, development, etc. etc.).

I am NOT looking to profit from someone else's dirty work by simply using their save files, but I hope to gain some insight into how experienced players cope with this beast of a game.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Houtje

Best thing you can do Houtje, is forget what other plays do the first turn and learn from your mistakes, the AI is not incredible in this game in a sense it will just murder you in the first few turns, I myself just started playing 2 weeks ago in AE (I originally played WITP before hand) and have made quite a few mistakes losing carriers and falling behind on the time line, however don't let it discourage you! If anything print the game manual and read everything on the forums as much as you can, I am glad you are asking questions though that is good! Cheers!

[Houtje]

Thanks all for your tips and advice; thanks Kull for the save: I will indeed use it as a guide only and try to learn from my own mistakes as I go.

[Drambuie]

As already said I think to play is the best way to learn, and the AI does seem fairly forgiving.

Having played WITP original I decided in my first AE full game against the AI Japanese to play the war out roughly as it happened, not pulling back units unless they were obviously about to die, trying to put myself in the Allied 'shoes' as it were. I tried to not use my knowledge of the game and history too much to influence 'unrealistic' decision making. So far it has worked ok and i'm clawing stuff back. I think from what I see/read that in PBEM games you need to play more unrealsitic/unhistoric to counter the opponent's similar approach.

I also quite like making the odd cockup and mess of things, or even forgetting to move a task force, as it seems more realistic and less ominiscient than doing everything 'perfectly'

[:)]

[carnifex]

ORIGINAL: Jim D Burns

ORIGINAL: carnifex
The only thing you really have to do on turn one is get the ships out of Manilla and Hong Kong.

Against the AI, I leave many of the ships in Manila for future evacuations of the big Asiatic fleet baseforce units in Manila and Bataan. Wait a few turns for mini KB to leave the area, then load em up and ship em out along with the HQ unit itself as well. You don't really need the baseforce units and they can help early in the game when your ports aren't very large yet in other places where you want to unload a lot of shipping.

You can usually safely leave the other ships in port at Manila as well so they don’t get jumped by mini KB either.

At Hong Kong, I make three amphib task forces (based on the different ship speeds) and load up as many of the land units as I can before heading south with those ships. You take some hits for sure there, but the added combat power of the surviving units you evacuate from Hong Kong really adds some power to Darwin’s defense later.

Of course a human opponent would make short work of your ships in both cases, but against the AI, there’s room to get creative without paying too huge a price.

Jim

Personally I don't withdraw any ground units from Hong Kong and Manila when playing vs the AI. I take whatever I can out of Singapore though.

[Misconduct]

Yeah I did the same, I moved all my troops from singapore to Java, and Balkipan, I figure allowing the AI to have Palembang allows them fuel, so i will leave it unharassed, however my defend sticks in Java right now.

[topeverest]

Houtge,

Agred with other players, read the forum for general thoughts, but you learn from your actions. Give the game 60 days and then restart. Your second and third time will be better and better. Crank up the difficulty. After 4 or 5 times, you probably can survive a human opponent.

My personal bias with the allies is to fight everywhere you have a chance of delivering air and naval losses.

[Cad908]

I had the same thought about creating a "template" for newbie allied AI players, even worked for a weekend on creating a save file for community critique. As I was doing more research, I came across some of the posts Andy, the AI developer, had about the scripting mechanism for play versus the AI. Apparently there are 12 different scripts for each side on each of the big scenarios. 6 of the scripts are described as "historical" and 6 are "non-historical" alternatives the AI could take. Hats off to Andy for all the work that required to program and now to maintain. (There is much interesting info in the AI thread) What that means for this discussion is, as I understand it, each time you start a new game the program selects the AI script that game will use. Thus, if we were to create a "template", it would run only the selected script each game. This would remove much of the unknown from an allied player and, I believe, destroy the appeal of the AI game. (I believe the same conditions would apply as a Japanese player against Allied AI) I suppose you could create multiple files by removing 11 scripts, starting a new game, save file and then change the script, rinse repeat. Then you could create 12 templates, but that would be a lot of work and I think would "game" the AI. Note, Andy has been very secretive about which scripts does what and wants to keep it that way.

As always, I will defer to the devs if my understanding is wrong.