Pardon the Interuption!

[MarkShot]

The game is CPU intensive. The memory footprint is probably below 200Mb. Video subsystems are not really stressed.

I was trying to get a benchmarking thread going, but I guess people weren't interested. You can find it here.

Probably good to wait until the demo if checking performance.

Here is scenario complexity which drives simulation performance:

tm.asp?m=2479970

Here is the benchmarking:

tm.asp?m=2481037

[deanco2]

Pardon the interruption, I'll just stick my 2c in, and leave you all to it.

I came here from the Distant Worlds forum.  Distant Worlds is a game much like this one, in that the game runs along, and you stick your nose in from time to time and tweak things here and there.  I'm always looking for games like this, I don't always like clicking like a madman.  Huge fan of Combat Mission.  Anyway, I followed the links and downloaded the 'general concepts' video.  Watched it, and was blown away.  When he said that moving 300 counters was not only tedious, but unrealistic, I said, 'this guy's speaking my language'.  When I saw the play example how the computer was able to handle itself, I basically had my credit card out.  Until I saw the price, but that's another thread, and not why I'm posting.

So I would up buying HttR as the reviews were good and it looked to be about the same thing as far as I am concerned, and the price was right.  I am very happy with that game, it plays exactly how I imagined it would, and I am learning a lot about how an army moves just watching the counters move around.

Anyway, that overview video deserves a wider audience, I'm sure others would be swayed like I was.  It even sold a game, just not the game it's advertising.

[Toby42]

I have a Pentium 4 running at 3.06ghz. I only have 1 gig of shared ram. I know bottom of the scale! My laptop is brand new with a dual core processor and 4 gig of ram.

[boogada]

Its running fine on my two year old laptop. 2ghz Duo Core with 2gigs ram.

[FredSanford3]

Hey, where in Central Florida are you? I live in Altamonte Springs.

You can micromanage as much as you want in this game, you just don't have to.

[Larac]

With another gig or 2 of RAM the old laptop might run it ok.

As it is shared.

But try the Demo to be sure.

Mark, how close in system resources is COTA to BFTB ?

Lee

[Adam Parker]

ORIGINAL: Treale

I've been reading posts and I've downloaded the tutorial and movies, etc. It seems like all you do is give an order to a Headquarters unit and watch the computer play the game! What am I missing? From what I've seen, it doesn't look like much fun.

I was one who once thought the same. It's why though I owned CotA I could never play it. Ditto mainly for HttR.

Still sceptical, I then bought the game, scanned the rules to see what was under the hood and watched the BFtB tutorials - and I haven't been more excited to try something out in PC land for a while.

I once remember that a group of us was discussing the possibility of a war game where you had virtual "grease pencils", with which you could select a corps or division and draw its boundaries and plans of advance on the map (something for the iPad one day maybe?).

BFtB is the closest thing I've seen that comes to that. As the rulebook states - players need to put themselves into the shoes of the overall commander and command 2 levels down (with necessary exceptions as the tactical situation requires). If you can "suspend your disbelief" and roleplay the game in that manner, then this promises to be a gem of a game.

[eMonticello]

You do have a choice in this game. You can be Superman by setting the delay to zero and pushing every unit yourself or you can be Hannibal Smith and develop the plan that Face, Murdock, and Mr. T carry out.

[MarkShot]

ORIGINAL: Larac

With another gig or 2 of RAM the old laptop might run it ok.

As it is shared.

But try the Demo to be sure.

Mark, how close in system resources is COTA to BFTB ?

Lee

You can take a look at my performance thread. It seemed that they were close based on a cursory number of units test. I was surprised by that, since I know how much coding went into BFTB. But from a technical systems point of view, it's really more about how many instructions execute on the average for each unit in the main simulation loop. Increasing the number of cases and possibilities need necessarily greatly increase the average code path.

However, even if it is true that the CPU load is close, it is also clear that COTA's average scenario size (number of units) is quite a bit smaller. So for a marginal system, COTA has a higher proportion of scenarios which will play smoothly.

tm.asp?m=2481037

[Fred98]

ORIGINAL: eMonticello
or you can be Hannibal Smith and develop the plan that Face, Murdock, and Mr. T carry out.

Of course we all love it when a plan comes together [:D]

Sorry, someone had to say it!

-

[Toby42]

ORIGINAL: Franklin Nimitz

Hey, where in Central Florida are you? I live in Altamonte Springs.

You can micromanage as much as you want in this game, you just don't have to.

Citrus County....

[Toby42]

So are the same features on both COTA and BFTB? If not what are the major differences? If they are similiar, I might try COTA first to see if I like the system before I spend the extra money for BFTB....

[MarkShot]

In general the UI features of each former game is a subset.

However, various game mechanics are more than just a subset or superset. Things like mixed mode movement (foot and vehicle handled differently - introduced in COTA) and supply modeling (introduced in COTA) change how the game plays. That is not say that the former games are not still fun, but they will feel different.

Biggest changes in BFTB in my opinion affecting the player experience: Improved OOB, direct availability of ESTAB data (meaning information on weapons), and easier ability to control the timing of various things (like separate, but coordinated attacks).

If RDOA was the only one of the series ever release, I would probably still be playing it from time to time.

[Toby42]

ORIGINAL: MarkShot

In general the UI features of each former game is a subset.

However, various game mechanics are more than just a subset or superset. Things like mixed mode movement (foot and vehicle handled differently - introduced in COTA) and supply modeling (introduced in COTA) change how the game plays. That is not say that the former games are not still fun, but they will feel different.

Biggest changes in BFTB in my opinion affecting the player experience: Improved OOB, direct availability of ESTAB data (meaning information on weapons), and easier ability to control the timing of various things (like separate, but coordinated attacks).

If RDOA was the only one of the series ever release, I would probably still be playing it from time to time.

So if I bought COTA before I Bought BFTB, I wouldn't be wasting my money on an obsolete game?

[jazman]

ORIGINAL: MarkShot

Yes, but playing with full order delays, it will take some time and will result in some disruption. Leaving you to ask is it better to go with the flow or pull the rug from underneath your subordinates.

If Dave was here right now, he would probably say this is why a good commander will always maintain a reserve. Thus, if something like this happens, you can let the attack continue and deploy the reserve to protect the flank. (Dave is very big on keeping a reserve. He rarely throws everything he's got into the pot.)

So in the HTTR 30th Corps breakout attack, it's not a good idea to select 30th Corps HQ, and give it an attack order to Eindhoven, max aggro, rapid fire, etc., then sit back and watch?

[jomni]

ORIGINAL: Treale

I've been reading posts and I've downloaded the tutorial and movies, etc. It seems like all you do is give an order to a Headquarters unit and watch the computer play the game! What am I missing? From what I've seen, it doesn't look like much fun.

I'm sure that there is more to this game than that, but apparently I'm missing the point of it????

I'm not familiar with any of the titles in this series, so I'm pretty ignorant of them. I'm not about to spend $80 to see what the whole love affair here is about. Hopefully someone can enlighten me, or maybe I just have to wait for the demo to be released.....

Thanks

Giving orders to HQ is more fun than micromanaging for me.
You can still micromanage each individual unit if you want.

This game is more of a roleplay / simulation. If you are the commander, you go though the proper chain of command. This is what the game tries to portray unlike conventional games. But I respect your preference. For some people "simulations" aren't fun.

[wodin]

ORIGINAL: Treale

ORIGINAL: MarkShot

In general the UI features of each former game is a subset.

However, various game mechanics are more than just a subset or superset. Things like mixed mode movement (foot and vehicle handled differently - introduced in COTA) and supply modeling (introduced in COTA) change how the game plays. That is not say that the former games are not still fun, but they will feel different.

Biggest changes in BFTB in my opinion affecting the player experience: Improved OOB, direct availability of ESTAB data (meaning information on weapons), and easier ability to control the timing of various things (like separate, but coordinated attacks).

If RDOA was the only one of the series ever release, I would probably still be playing it from time to time.

So if I bought COTA before I Bought BFTB, I wouldn't be wasting my money on an obsolete game?

IF you have a keen interest in the theatre CotA represents I'd say buy it...if you are more interested in the Bulge and possibly other battles of the West Front (due to the est editor) then save and buy the Bulge game.

[Toby42]

Wodin, Do you have both games????

[Llyranor]

The previous games are certainly not obsolete. I'm currently playing Highway to the Reich (1v1 against a buddy), and the engine is still light-years ahead of many strategy games out there in terms of gameplay systems.

HTTR and COTA are still very viable products; the engine gets improved upon as the series progresses, but the battles are very different, leading to very diverse challenges. The only caveat is that I'd recommend playing them in order, because you will likely miss the newer features. You might want to skip HTTR if there is a planned expansion with all the new features.

Treale, I recommend waiting for the BFTB demo; after you try out the tutorial/watch all the videos that come with it, you should get a good feel of whether you think you'd like the game. If so, grab COTA if the setting interests you. If that sufficiently impresses you, BFTB down the line. There *are* substantial improvements (evolutionary, not revolutionary) to the interface for BFTB, though, so bear that in mind (scheduling orders, additional command parameters, etc). That being said, I still find HTTR/COTA to run circles around all those other strategy games, and certainly trump other wargames in realism (age-old TB vs RT aside).

What the game series does better than any other game is put you in the commander's shoes. You interact with the game interface at the level at which a commander would interact with his/her subordinates (eg. not pushing every single individual unit every hex of the way - which is a fine way to play, I love TB games; but does not do a good job of putting me in the commander's shoes). You can be a commander who just gives very broad orders to your subordinates and let them fend for themselves (but expects results based on the efforts you've put in), or you can micro every single unit if you want (but this will overload your HQ and lead to long order delays unless you choose to play without any order delays). However, you can also be a commander who gives some broad orders here if the task is simple enough, and then jump in and specific details about particular units which you think might have a more important role in the battle. You will learn that you can't just act, and then react to your opponent's moves. Because of order delays, you always need to think ahead (I think this game series implements this element best) and plan for contingencies. You will learn *when* to give orders, to *what* units, rather than just give orders to all your units every turn because you as the player are the only one who can. The chain of command in this game is just great. The way you have to think, and the way you interact with the interface, really feels commander-level.

[Grestok]

I also have all the games of the series : AA, HTTR, COTA and BFTB ! [8D]

I can tell you (@Treale) that COTA and HTTR are still quite playable and deep !