fuel to Oz question

[toselli]

hi everyone,
I have a question regarding fuel movement to Australia. I was thinking of skipping the Pacific route entirely and haul fuel from Eastern Us to Cape Town and then Perth. I will use the West Coast to supply PH and central Pacific and Abadan to supply India.
The advantage I see is that most of this route is very safe and that, as ships do not use endurance in off map movement, I can use all the small and medium endurance tk from eastern US to Cape.
My question to more experienced Allied players is : do you think that this strategy is doable or will it be a logistic mistake?
Thanks a lot.

[Terminus]

Well, it'll take longer, and all the fuel will end up in one base (Perth) far away from most of the action that requires fuel.

[khyberbill]

In the early part of the war you get enough fuel in Abadan to supply India and Australia. However, after 1942, you will find that War in the South Pacific consumes lots of fuel and you will want the shortest route. Also by then you will have the naval assets needed to protect your tanker fleet.

[topeverest]

I see no need to use Off Map.

Agreed, Capetown cannot support Fuel needs of Oz once war starts going in Oz, but there will be ample supplies to push out (probably to Oz). After you plump up India area, you will have no other simple use for the fuel in Abadan than haul to Oz. Anticipate heavy fuel needs in Oz and push fuel from Western US. IMO carefully assign tankers to zones based on endourance and amount of fuel available to move. Put 'extra' tankers in western USA and use as needed. Also, in emergency, you can use your AK types to pull fuel at half efficiency.

The war will consume much more fuel than WITP. Dont underestimate how fast 200,000 points can be consumed by an active, naval war effort

[cantona2]

Set up a waystation about half way between WC and OZ. Long haul tankers carry fuel to waystation and unload. They then haul it back to WC. Mid range tankers then use the waystion as hub to ship fuel where it needs to go. Obviously the waystation needs to be garrisoned and have plenty of naval and aerial ASW assets.

[Rob Brennan UK]

ORIGINAL: cantona2

Set up a waystation about half way between WC and OZ. Long haul tankers carry fuel to waystation and unload. They then haul it back to WC. Mid range tankers then use the waystion as hub to ship fuel where it needs to go. Obviously the waystation needs to be garrisoned and have plenty of naval and aerial ASW assets.

and a maxed out port to avoid spoilage.

[Buck Beach]

ORIGINAL: cantona2

Set up a waystation about half way between WC and OZ. Long haul tankers carry fuel to waystation and unload. They then haul it back to WC. Mid range tankers then use the waystion as hub to ship fuel where it needs to go. Obviously the waystation needs to be garrisoned and have plenty of naval and aerial ASW assets.

Where would you suggest that these bases be located? Pearl and north island New Zealand ports are natural locations but none are even close to a halfway point. Other bases in between WC and Oz can only be built up to a max level 5.

I think that I would probably make it a 3 leg trip.

[cantona2]

ORIGINAL: Buck Beach

ORIGINAL: cantona2

Set up a waystation about half way between WC and OZ. Long haul tankers carry fuel to waystation and unload. They then haul it back to WC. Mid range tankers then use the waystion as hub to ship fuel where it needs to go. Obviously the waystation needs to be garrisoned and have plenty of naval and aerial ASW assets.

Where would you suggest that these bases be located? Pearl and north island New Zealand ports are natural locations but none are even close to a halfway point. Other bases in between WC and Oz can only be built up to a max level 5.

I think that I would probably make it a 3 leg trip.

Ill PM you where i have mine not to give intell to my PBEM opponents [:D]

[topeverest]

Seek bases that can store an unlimited amount of fuel and supply. That will narrow it down considerably. you probably can get it from there.

[khyberbill]

ther bases in between WC and Oz can only be built up to a max level 5.

5 is enough if you build up the AF to at least 4. Use long legged tankers (>10,000) to get to this waypoint and then short legged tankers to distribute to where the fuel is needed.

[wdolson]

Pago Pago can be built up to be spoilage free, though unless you put a lot of naval support there, loading and unloading is probably going to be slow.

The 12000+ endurance tankers can make Australia in a direct run, though they will have to load some of their cargo for the return trip from Australia.  You could run some long hauls from LA to Australia at the start and then use your shorter haul tankers to move fuel to Pearl Harbor.  You can probably make two or three round trips to Pearl with the short haul tankers while the long hauls are on one trip to Australia.  Next trip, return the long haul tankers to Pearl and load them for the next trip there. 

It isn't half way, but you have cut more than a week round trip to LA for your long haul tankers and the short hauls can probably stay ahead of demand at Pearl from the long haul tankers.  After a few months you'll probably have 1 million fuel at Pearl which is the largest port outside the continental North America in the eastern half of the Pacific and it's built up at the beginning of the game, so once the port is repaired from the Japanese attack, you don't have to tie down any engineers building a fuel depot.

Bill

[EUBanana]

ORIGINAL: Buck Beach

ORIGINAL: cantona2

Set up a waystation about half way between WC and OZ. Long haul tankers carry fuel to waystation and unload. They then haul it back to WC. Mid range tankers then use the waystion as hub to ship fuel where it needs to go. Obviously the waystation needs to be garrisoned and have plenty of naval and aerial ASW assets.

Where would you suggest that these bases be located? Pearl and north island New Zealand ports are natural locations but none are even close to a halfway point. Other bases in between WC and Oz can only be built up to a max level 5.

I think that I would probably make it a 3 leg trip.

OPSEC forbids me to say. [:D]

[Sardaukar]

I bring fuel to Suva from LA & Panama (when available in sufficient numbers) and to Perth from Cape Town. From Suva/Perth I shuttle fuel where it's needed. Shorter-range tankers evacuated from DEI etc. are good for the shuttle-thing. There are usually also enough small short-range ASW escorts available to keep subs at bay.

[moonraker65]

I use off map. I have a 10 TK CS Convoy running constantly at present between the Eastern US and Cape Town. I then shuttle between Cape Town and Adelaide. The Road/Rail Network from Perth is no good so Adelaide is a much better bet and can be built up to a reasonable sized port. I also shuttle supplies to Adelaide from CT in 4 CS Convoys thereby keeping Oz nicely topped up. Abadan I only use for India and Aden although I have just started shuttling fuel from Colombo to CT to keep as constant a flow as possible. Later on the supply convoys arriving at CT bring Fuel and Supplies so the need to go Off Map from the East Coast diminishes and those TK's can then be redirected to more needy areas. Depends what scenario you're playiong and personal preference. I'm playing Juan's Enhanced CV variant and there's no way I could've gone West Coast because the Japs went a lot further South than normal although once I re-took Noumea, Luganville and started to build up Ndeni I then started moving stuff direct across from the WC. Even my reinforcements had to go Off Map due to the scale of Jap activity in the first part of '42.

[castor troy]

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

I bring fuel to Suva from LA & Panama (when available in sufficient numbers) and to Perth from Cape Town. From Suva/Perth I shuttle fuel where it's needed. Shorter-range tankers evacuated from DEI etc. are good for the shuttle-thing. There are usually also enough small short-range ASW escorts available to keep subs at bay.

does your fuel stay in Perth? I once tried to use Perth as a fuel depot, but it didn´t take long and it was all sucked into Australia´s HI.

[amatteucci]

BTW, is it possible to move fuel, by land, from Perth to Sydney?

[Sardaukar]

ORIGINAL: castor troy

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

I bring fuel to Suva from LA & Panama (when available in sufficient numbers) and to Perth from Cape Town. From Suva/Perth I shuttle fuel where it's needed. Shorter-range tankers evacuated from DEI etc. are good for the shuttle-thing. There are usually also enough small short-range ASW escorts available to keep subs at bay.

does your fuel stay in Perth? I once tried to use Perth as a fuel depot, but it didn´t take long and it was all sucked into Australia´s HI.

For some reason, it does stay there. I wish it'd get sucked to Sydney, for example, but no. Also, in DaBabes scenario I am playing recently, Perth is requesting 85 000 fuel..and I cannot figure why.

[Don D]

ORIGINAL: amatteucci

BTW, is it possible to move fuel, by land, from Perth to Sydney?

Vs. the AI it seems that somewhere between 100-200k will stay in Perth and the most of the rest will end up in Sydney after a while. I assume in PBEM getting huge amounts to Perth would be a lot harder but it would do the same thing once it's there.

[moonraker65]

I used Perth at first but found that not much seemed to get moved for the reasons I stated above. Adelaide is a far better option because it's situated on a main rail and road route that connects to the HI in the rest of Australia.

[Buck Beach]

ORIGINAL: wdolson

Pago Pago can be built up to be spoilage free, though unless you put a lot of naval support there, loading and unloading is probably going to be slow.

The 12000+ endurance tankers can make Australia in a direct run, though they will have to load some of their cargo for the return trip from Australia.  You could run some long hauls from LA to Australia at the start and then use your shorter haul tankers to move fuel to Pearl Harbor.  You can probably make two or three round trips to Pearl with the short haul tankers while the long hauls are on one trip to Australia.  Next trip, return the long haul tankers to Pearl and load them for the next trip there. 

It isn't half way, but you have cut more than a week round trip to LA for your long haul tankers and the short hauls can probably stay ahead of demand at Pearl from the long haul tankers.  After a few months you'll probably have 1 million fuel at Pearl which is the largest port outside the continental North America in the eastern half of the Pacific and it's built up at the beginning of the game, so once the port is repaired from the Japanese attack, you don't have to tie down any engineers building a fuel depot.

Bill

I think even the 9800 endurance ships can make Brisbane from Pearl (even with way points) and back without a top off of fuel.