Andy Mac v PZB This time India will Stand !!!!

Nemo121 · Post by **Nemo121** » Sun Jul 25, 2010 6:55 pm

Gees, he hung around to protect a cripple. BAD choice, that's always a bad choice. You've got to know when to cut your losses.

So that's 3 BBs and probably a CL in return for two British torpedo bombers. OUCH !!! 13 torpedo hits out of 34 launched, not bad. My rule of thumb is 1 hit out of 3 launched vs merchies and 1 hit out of 9 launched vs warships ( a bit better vs BBs, a bit less vs CLs and pretty hopeless vs DDs ) but it looks like your guys did a lot better.

Can you post pictures of the experience levels of the pilots in those torpedo strike squadrons? I've noticed, in testing, that the slower torpedo bombers ( like the Swordfish, Vildebeest and Albacore ) seem to do much better for equivalent experience than the Avengers. I'm not sure if that's just chance or due to their lower approach speed being modelled as some sort of stability advantage or somesuch.

pat.casey · Post by **pat.casey** » Sun Jul 25, 2010 7:07 pm

ORIGINAL: Nemo121

Gees, he hung around to protect a cripple. BAD choice, that's always a bad choice. You've got to know when to cut your losses.

<snip>

I dunno, something like that can cut either way. If PZB had left the damage BB on its own and Andy picked it off with, say, 6 DDs in a night attack, we'd all be saying "tut-tut, should have escoted it back home to prevent it being picked off by light forces". I don't think PZB had any idea there were brit carriers in the area.

To my mind at least, the more interesting question is why put 3 BBs this close to ceylon in the first place? The whole mission just looks like an "I'm bored and want to score some style points" sort of operation rather than something that had some meaningful goal behind it.

Andy Mac · Post by **Andy Mac** » Sun Jul 25, 2010 7:33 pm

There you go

I think the Albacores and Swordfish are great Torpedo platforms they are just poor in an environment of hostile fighters (as proved during the Channel dash)

I wont commit them except at desperate need to an attack on defended sites.

This kind of operation is bread and butter for them

Andy

Andy Mac · Post by **Andy Mac** » Sun Jul 25, 2010 7:35 pm

Given he hadnt spotted Indomitable and he knew most of the RN is in Pearl it was a reasonable gamble to take he was unlucky that Somerville was operating east of Ceylon getting ready to try to ambush the attacks on the Burma Coast
 
Also he was very close to hitting 6 full USAAF BS about to unload at Ceylon

Andy Mac · Post by **Andy Mac** » Sun Jul 25, 2010 7:43 pm

I shot off 41 out of 45 torpedoes and as you can see my naval bombing skill is not great so Force T is pulling back towards Ceylon to re arm
 
I dont want to go haring off after him and turn a victory into a draw
 
With only 18 Sea Hurricanes to CAP the fleet I could lose all 45 strike aircraft so I am going to play it cautious
 
Also my next move is probably an attack on Ramree Island so I dont want to take risks.
 
 

Andy Mac · Post by **Andy Mac** » Sun Jul 25, 2010 8:20 pm

A retiring Force T comes across a not quite crippled Yamashiro and puts her down
 
Tough ship thats 7 x Mk 18's to put her down plus a few 500lb's
 
A good couple of days for the allies it opens up options to go after Ramree Island and makes my coastal ofensive a possibility
 
 
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Oct 25, 42
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Time Surface Combat, near Townsville at 92,144, Range 8,000 Yards
 
Japanese Ships
      CL Sendai, Shell hits 1
      DD Yugumo, Shell hits 3
      DD Akigumo
      DD Kazegumo, Shell hits 1
      DD Takanami
 
Allied Ships
      DD Gwin
      DD Russell, Shell hits 1
      DD Helm
      DD McCall, Shell hits 1
 
 
 
Improved night sighting under 100% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 100% moonlight: 11,000 yards
Range closes to 20,000 yards...
Range closes to 14,000 yards...
Range closes to 8,000 yards...
CONTACT: Allies radar detects Japanese task force at 8,000 yards
Allies open fire on surprised Japanese ships at 8,000 yards
DD McCall launches Torpedoes at DD Kazegumo at 8,000 yards
DD Helm launches Torpedoes at DD Kazegumo at 8,000 yards
DD Russell launches Torpedoes at DD Kazegumo at 8,000 yards
DD Gwin launches Torpedoes at DD Kazegumo at 8,000 yards
DD McCall launches Torpedoes at DD Yugumo at 8,000 yards
Range closes to 4,000 yards
DD McCall engages DD Yugumo at 4,000 yards
DD Helm engages DD Yugumo at 4,000 yards
DD Russell engages DD Yugumo at 4,000 yards
DD Yugumo engages DD Russell at 4,000 yards
Range closes to 2,000 yards
DD Kazegumo engages DD McCall at 2,000 yards
DD McCall engages DD Takanami at 2,000 yards
DD Russell engages DD Yugumo at 2,000 yards
DD Akigumo engages DD Helm at 2,000 yards
DD Yugumo engages DD Russell at 2,000 yards
Range increases to 6,000 yards
CL Sendai engages DD Helm at 6,000 yards
DD Takanami engages DD Helm at 6,000 yards
DD McCall engages DD Kazegumo at 6,000 yards
DD Kazegumo engages DD Gwin at 6,000 yards
DD Yugumo engages DD McCall at 6,000 yards
Range increases to 11,000 yards
CL Sendai engages DD McCall at 11,000 yards
DD Takanami engages DD Helm at 11,000 yards
DD Kazegumo engages DD McCall at 11,000 yards
DD Akigumo engages DD Gwin at 11,000 yards
DD Yugumo engages DD McCall at 11,000 yards
Task forces break off...
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Air attack on Dacca , at 56,38
 
Weather in hex: Heavy cloud
 
Japanese aircraft
      Ki-21-IIa Sally x 27
 
 
Allied aircraft
      no flights
 
Japanese aircraft losses
      Ki-21-IIa Sally: 6 damaged
 
Allied aircraft losses
      B-17E Fortress: 1 destroyed on ground
 
 
 
Airbase hits 1
Runway hits 4
 
Aircraft Attacking:
      27 x Ki-21-IIa Sally bombing from 10000 feet
               Airfield Attack:  4 x 250 kg GP Bomb
 
Raid spotted at 17 NM, estimated altitude 13,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 4 minutes
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Naval bombardment of Townsville at 92,144
 
Allied aircraft
      no flights
 
Allied aircraft losses
      Kittyhawk IA: 1 destroyed on ground
      Hurricane XIIb: 1 destroyed on ground
      Hudson III (LR): 2 destroyed on ground
 
Japanese Ships
      BB Kirishima
      BB Hiei
      BB Kongo
      CA Mikuma
      CA Chokai
      CA Maya
      DD Makigumo
 
 
Allied ground losses:
      224 casualties reported
         Squads: 0 destroyed, 7 disabled
         Non Combat: 15 destroyed, 61 disabled
         Engineers: 1 destroyed, 0 disabled
      Guns lost 47 (13 destroyed, 34 disabled)
      Vehicles lost 49 (10 destroyed, 39 disabled)
 
 
Airbase hits 2
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 16
Port hits 4
 
BB Kirishima firing at Townsville
BB Hiei firing at 1st Australian Division
BB Kongo firing at 21/22 Field Regiment
CA Mikuma firing at 1st Australian Division
CA Chokai firing at 1st Australian Division
CA Maya firing at 1st Australian Division
DD Makigumo firing at 13th Australian Brigade
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Time Surface Combat, near Cox's Bazar at 54,43, Range 3,000 Yards
 
Japanese Ships
      DD Uzuki
 
Allied Ships
      xAK Testbank, Shell hits 2, Torpedo hits 3, and is sunk
      AM Oudh, Shell hits 16, and is sunk
 
 
 
Japanese Ships Reported to be Approaching!
Allied TF begins to get underway
Reduced visibility due to Thunderstorms
Maximum visibility in Thunderstorms: 3,000 yards
Range closes to 14,000 yards...
Range closes to 11,000 yards...
Range closes to 9,000 yards...
Range closes to 8,000 yards...
Range closes to 7,000 yards...
Range closes to 6,000 yards...
Range closes to 5,000 yards...
Range closes to 4,000 yards...
Range closes to 3,000 yards...
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 3,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 3,000 yards
DD Uzuki engages AM Oudh at 3,000 yards
Range closes to 2,000 yards
DD Uzuki engages AM Oudh at 2,000 yards
AM Oudh sunk by DD Uzuki at 2,000 yards
DD Uzuki engages xAK Testbank at 2,000 yards
Range increases to 3,000 yards
xAK Testbank sunk by DD Uzuki at 3,000 yards
Combat ends with last Allied ship sunk...
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Mandalay , at 59,46
 
Weather in hex: Light cloud
 
Raid spotted at 46 NM, estimated altitude 35,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 15 minutes
 
 
Allied aircraft
      P-40K Warhawk x 16
 
 
No Allied losses
 
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
      16 x P-40K Warhawk sweeping at 29000 feet
 
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Shwebo , at 59,45
 
Weather in hex: Clear sky
 
Raid spotted at 41 NM, estimated altitude 32,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 14 minutes
 
 
Allied aircraft
      P-40K Warhawk x 16
 
 
No Allied losses
 
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
      16 x P-40K Warhawk sweeping at 29000 feet
 
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on 31st Chinese Corps, at 72,55 (Nanning)
 
Weather in hex: Thunderstorms
 
Raid spotted at 14 NM, estimated altitude 8,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 4 minutes
 
Japanese aircraft
      Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 9
      Ki-49-IIa Helen x 18
 
 
 
No Japanese losses
 
 
Allied ground losses:
      33 casualties reported
         Squads: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
         Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
         Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
       9 x Ki-49-IIa Helen bombing from 6000 feet
               Ground Attack:  4 x 250 kg GP Bomb
       9 x Ki-49-IIa Helen bombing from 6000 feet
               Ground Attack:  4 x 250 kg GP Bomb
 
Also attacking 52nd Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 31st Chinese Corps ...
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on 52nd Chinese Corps, at 72,55 (Nanning)
 
Weather in hex: Thunderstorms
 
Raid spotted at 22 NM, estimated altitude 9,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes
 
Japanese aircraft
      Ki-21-IIa Sally x 25
 
 
 
No Japanese losses
 
 
Allied ground losses:
      36 casualties reported
         Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
         Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 3 disabled
         Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
      25 x Ki-21-IIa Sally bombing from 5000 feet
               Ground Attack:  4 x 250 kg GP Bomb
 
Also attacking 64th Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 52nd Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 64th Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 52nd Chinese Corps ...
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on 35th Group Army, at 72,55 (Nanning)
 
Weather in hex: Thunderstorms
 
Raid spotted at 12 NM, estimated altitude 13,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 3 minutes
 
Japanese aircraft
      Ki-48-Ib Lily x 25
 
 
 
No Japanese losses
 
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
      25 x Ki-48-Ib Lily bombing from 8000 feet
               Ground Attack:  4 x 100 kg GP Bomb
 
Also attacking 31st Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 35th Group Army ...
Also attacking 31st Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 35th Group Army ...
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on 35th Group Army, at 72,55 (Nanning)
 
Weather in hex: Thunderstorms
 
Raid spotted at 40 NM, estimated altitude 6,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 11 minutes
 
Japanese aircraft
      Ki-48-IIa Lily x 12
 
 
 
Japanese aircraft losses
      Ki-48-IIa Lily: 1 damaged
 
 
Allied ground losses:
      12 casualties reported
         Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
         Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
         Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
      12 x Ki-48-IIa Lily bombing from 4000 feet
               Ground Attack:  4 x 100 kg GP Bomb
 
Also attacking 9th Chinese Base Force ...
Also attacking 35th Group Army ...
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Shwebo , at 59,45
 
Weather in hex: Clear sky
 
Raid spotted at 23 NM, estimated altitude 32,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes
 
 
Allied aircraft
      P-40K Warhawk x 5
 
 
No Allied losses
 
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
       5 x P-40K Warhawk sweeping at 29000 feet
 
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Koggala at 32,57
 
Weather in hex: Thunderstorms
 
Raid spotted at 12 NM, estimated altitude 13,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes
 
 
Allied aircraft
      Albacore I x 13
      Swordfish I x 4
 
 
Allied aircraft losses
      Albacore I: 1 damaged
 
Japanese Ships
      BB Yamashiro, Bomb hits 2,  heavy damage
 
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
       4 x Albacore I launching torpedoes at 200 feet
               Naval Attack:  1 x 18in Mk XII Torpedo
       4 x Albacore I bombing from 5000 feet
               Naval Attack:  2 x 500 lb GP Bomb
       4 x Swordfish I bombing from 2000 feet
               Naval Attack:  2 x 500 lb GP Bomb
       5 x Albacore I bombing from 3000 feet
               Naval Attack:  2 x 500 lb GP Bomb
 
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on Magwe , at 57,47
 
Weather in hex: Severe storms
 
Raid spotted at 47 NM, estimated altitude 18,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 10 minutes
 
 
Allied aircraft
      P-38E Lightning x 13
 
 
No Allied losses
 
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
      13 x P-38E Lightning sweeping at 29000 feet
 
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on Magwe , at 57,47
 
Weather in hex: Severe storms
 
Raid spotted at 23 NM, estimated altitude 29,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 5 minutes
 
 
Allied aircraft
      P-38F Lightning x 15
 
 
No Allied losses
 
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
      15 x P-38F Lightning sweeping at 29000 feet
 
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on Magwe , at 57,47
 
Weather in hex: Severe storms
 
Raid spotted at 46 NM, estimated altitude 19,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 13 minutes
 
 
Allied aircraft
      B-17E Fortress x 26
      B-17F Fortress x 15
 
 
Allied aircraft losses
      B-17E Fortress: 1 damaged
 
 
 
Airbase hits 4
Runway hits 19
 
Aircraft Attacking:
       6 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 15000 feet
               Airfield Attack:  8 x 500 lb GP Bomb
       6 x B-17F Fortress bombing from 15000 feet
               Airfield Attack:  8 x 500 lb GP Bomb
       9 x B-17F Fortress bombing from 15000 feet
               Airfield Attack:  8 x 500 lb GP Bomb
       5 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 15000 feet
               Airfield Attack:  8 x 500 lb GP Bomb
       6 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 15000 feet
               Airfield Attack:  8 x 500 lb GP Bomb
       3 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 15000 feet
               Airfield Attack:  8 x 500 lb GP Bomb
       6 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 15000 feet
               Airfield Attack:  8 x 500 lb GP Bomb
 
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on Magwe , at 57,47
 
Weather in hex: Severe storms
 
Raid spotted at 38 NM, estimated altitude 20,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 11 minutes
 
 
Allied aircraft
      B-17E Fortress x 6
 
 
No Allied losses
 
 
 
Runway hits 3
 
Aircraft Attacking:
       6 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 15000 feet
               Airfield Attack:  8 x 500 lb GP Bomb
 
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on Magwe , at 57,47
 
Weather in hex: Severe storms
 
Raid spotted at 33 NM, estimated altitude 16,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 11 minutes
 
 
Allied aircraft
      Kittyhawk IA x 12
      B-17F Fortress x 7
 
 
Allied aircraft losses
      B-17F Fortress: 1 damaged
 
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
       7 x B-17F Fortress bombing from 15000 feet
               Airfield Attack:  8 x 500 lb GP Bomb
 
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on Magwe , at 57,47
 
Weather in hex: Severe storms
 
Raid spotted at 21 NM, estimated altitude 34,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 4 minutes
 
 
Allied aircraft
      P-38G Lightning x 3
 
 
No Allied losses
 
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
       3 x P-38G Lightning sweeping at 29000 feet
 
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Koggala at 32,57
 
Weather in hex: Partial cloud
 
Raid spotted at 19 NM, estimated altitude 13,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 10 minutes
 
Japanese aircraft
      no flights
 
 
Allied aircraft
      Albacore I x 13
      Swordfish I x 4
 
 
Japanese aircraft losses
No Japanese losses
 
Allied aircraft losses
      Albacore I: 1 damaged
 
Japanese Ships
      BB Yamashiro, Torpedo hits 3, and is sunk
 
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
       3 x Albacore I launching torpedoes at 200 feet
               Naval Attack:  1 x 18in Mk XII Torpedo
      10 x Albacore I bombing from 10000 feet
               Naval Attack:  2 x 500 lb GP Bomb
       4 x Swordfish I bombing from 10000 feet
               Naval Attack:  2 x 500 lb GP Bomb
 
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on Magwe , at 57,47
 
Weather in hex: Severe storms
 
Raid spotted at 12 NM, estimated altitude 32,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 2 minutes
 
 
Allied aircraft
      P-38F Lightning x 11
 
 
No Allied losses
 
 
 
Aircraft Attacking:
      11 x P-38F Lightning sweeping at 29000 feet
 
 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Ground combat at Sydney Island (153,145)
 
Japanese Shock attack
 
Attacking force 13 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 2
 
Defending force 0 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 0
 
Japanese adjusted assault: 3
 
Allied adjusted defense: 1
 
Japanese assault odds: 3 to 1 (fort level 0)
 
Japanese forces CAPTURE Sydney Island !!!
 
Combat modifiers
Attacker: shock(+), leaders(+), leaders(-)
 
 
 
Assaulting units:
    Yokosuka 3rd SNLF /2
 
 

Andy Mac · Post by **Andy Mac** » Sun Jul 25, 2010 8:41 pm

What next is the question I am half tempted to try a shoestring Ramree Island gambit - Chindits of 77th Bde can sieze the base by air and I can fly in some engineers
 
It would force a reaction at the very least and distract him from North Burma - Only question is do I want to force a reaction - The reality is I have more than achieved what I wanted in Burma already I am pushing him back steadily and will have Katha built up soon - Ultimatelty this is not the theatre of decision I just need to do enough to force him to commit force here that he could use elsewhere.
 
The escape of his forces out of Australia is inconvenient as I am sure they are bolstering his perimeter.
 
Ultimately I want to attack all around the perimeter draw him out and then hit hard in CENTPAC - cleanest route but I need to wait for Essex class before attempting it.
 
Anyway there is always time for the next pin prick.
 
I need to work out what I want to achieve by siezing  Ramree now rather than in 4 or 5 months.
 
Not sure yet what I want to achieve so I should probably wait.
 
Ideally he is going to have to coomitt more assets to the Bay of bengal now maybe even mini KB which will make KB more vulnerable in CENTPAC
 
 

Andy Mac · Post by **Andy Mac** » Sun Jul 25, 2010 8:47 pm

Just musing over options

My conclusion a Japanese player MUST trash BURCORPS and III CORPS IN MALAYA

Letting some or a ll escape is a BAD idea if they retreat pursue them - letting these units rest recover and train gives the allies a lot of force to use if they are willing to commit assets to this theatre

Andy Mac · Post by **Andy Mac** » Sun Jul 25, 2010 8:49 pm

pos obviously I dont have the PP's to free up all the requisite units any time soon so this is just musing for now....

pat.casey · Post by **pat.casey** » Sun Jul 25, 2010 9:05 pm

Is it really a good idea to move into west coastal sumatra? Seems like any force you land there will likely be too small (and the road net too poor) to take over the whole island so you'll end up on one or two hard to supply bases while he has a half dozen in range to pound you flat.

In the alternate reality of AE, attrition generally favors the Japanese, and landing in western sumatra seems likely to set up an environment where he can achieve consistency favorable loss ratios.

Andy Mac · Post by **Andy Mac** » Sun Jul 25, 2010 9:11 pm

Yuh I know I dont have the PP's anyway i am just playing with options...
 
Almost what I would like to do is go deep early before masses of LCU;s are available to the Japanese.
 
On the other hand my fleet couldnt secure my LOC.
 
As I said I have already achieved my minimum objectives I have clearly sucked units into Burma which makes him wekaer elsewhere not sure about whats next

Grfin Zeppelin · Post by **Grfin Zeppelin** » Sun Jul 25, 2010 9:17 pm

Yes but an Invasion of Sumatra will force him to react.Might be a nice diversion theather from elswhere later.

Andy Mac · Post by **Andy Mac** » Sun Jul 25, 2010 9:20 pm

By not pressing me in Burma/India in early mid 42 PZB let me train crops of good pilots and build up reserves of key types
 
This has came back to bite him I have enough trained Divs for the Burma campaign and enough trained pilots and air frames to enable a ltd attrition campaign.
 
This is where keeping a force in being has worked out for me
 
 

Andy Mac · Post by **Andy Mac** » Mon Jul 26, 2010 12:56 pm

Been mulling it over during the last 24 hours.

Given my success in the Bay of Bengal I think now is th etime to try and take advantage.

Rather than take a risk and go deep I will attempt a shallow strike in the next three months.

Phase 1 will be a siezure and attempted build up option of Ramree Island by paratrooper and FT engineers.

Phase 2 will be an attack on the Andaman Islands by XXXIII Corps with 2 Divisions plus an Armoured Bde under command.

Thepurpose of this strike is to give me an advanced base that can threaten Rangoon to Singapore or Sumatra and force PZB to disperse his forces.

The only question I need to answer is what forces do I need to send back from Pearl to support this operation.

I am currently thinking of sending HMS Illustrious, Victorious and Formidable all of which increase to 54 aircraft in March 1943 to add to HMS Indomitable and screen and if I add USS Saratoga to the mix that would give me a strike force of 300 carrier aircraft to support the landings.

That would leave 4 US CV's and 3 CVE's in the Pacific.

Alternatively I can transfer the whole US Pac Flt to the Bay on Bengal....

Andy

pat.casey · Post by **pat.casey** » Mon Jul 26, 2010 1:29 pm

Andy, take this for what it's worth, because I don't have the full strategic picture here, but ...

Why split up your USN carriers like that? It just opens you up to be defeated in detail and leaves you too weak in either theatre to deal with KB if it shows up. Likewise, 300 Carrier aircraft is mightly "light" if you end up near a bunch of LBA. You'll have two forces which can *barely* support a landing and 0 forces which can deal with a Japanese counterthrust.

My thinking would be:

If the Bay of Bengal is worth doing, its worth doing right. Move the entire US carrier fleet over, make a massive landing, and get it done then send them home.
If the Bay of Bengal is not worth that kind of commitment, then raids with light forces/paratroops can at least keep him honest in the area, and potentially provide a support infrastructure for later in the war if/when Japanese carrier air is neutralized.

Seems like a "halfway" reinforcement is just asking for trouble.

castor troy · Post by **castor troy** » Mon Jul 26, 2010 1:43 pm

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

Been mulling it over during the last 24 hours.

Given my success in the Bay of Bengal I think now is th etime to try and take advantage.

Rather than take a risk and go deep I will attempt a shallow strike in the next three months.

Phase 1 will be a siezure and attempted build up option of Ramree Island by paratrooper and FT engineers.

Phase 2 will be an attack on the Andaman Islands by XXXIII Corps with 2 Divisions plus an Armoured Bde under command.

Thepurpose of this strike is to give me an advanced base that can threaten Rangoon to Singapore or Sumatra and force PZB to disperse his forces.

The only question I need to answer is what forces do I need to send back from Pearl to support this operation.

I am currently thinking of sending HMS Illustrious, Victorious and Formidable all of which increase to 54 aircraft in March 1943 to add to HMS Indomitable and screen and if I add USS Saratoga to the mix that would give me a strike force of 300 carrier aircraft to support the landings.

That would leave 4 US CV's and 3 CVE's in the Pacific.

Alternatively I can transfer the whole US Pac Flt to the Bay on Bengal....

Andy

have you checked the withdrawel dates of these British carriers yet? I´m in April 43 as the Allied and all but one of these carriers had to be withdrawn. With a daily 65 pp hit each you can´t afford keeping three of them long beyond their withdrawel dates. One of them arrives in early (March?) 43.And no, I haven´t lost a British carrier but still only got one in early 43. [:D]

Andy Mac · Post by **Andy Mac** » Mon Jul 26, 2010 3:00 pm

PZB selected a no withdrawal game [:D][:D][:D]

Andy Mac · Post by **Andy Mac** » Mon Jul 26, 2010 7:15 pm

Spent a lot of time re organising my additional 6 USAAF Bomb Sqns arrived and were unloaded at Ceylon.
 
I am now trying to rationalise types to make best use of my assets
 
I am a firm believer in having reserves.
 
So I will be re orgasnising over the next few turns
 
Tenth AF in India will be getting all my USAAF B25C's and all my B17's
Fifth AF in Australia will be getting all my B25B's, B26's, B18's, A20's and A26's as light and medium's and will recieve at least one full BG of B24D's
Seventh AF in CENTPAC will recieve most of the B24D's
 
I am hoping that after this reorg I will have 10 - 15 forts in the pool to allow for ops and other losses
 
In the air war in AE its all about who can fight the sustainable campaign that means having BS with 2 - 3 spare aircraft and extra sqns that stand down even on an effort strike so that on day 2 you can positively keep the momentum.
 
It worked in Australia and in Burma don't get me wrong PZB I suspect has already picked out my method and there is an obvious counter but even so I want the ability to take losses and still come back on day 2 because at some stage he will nail me and my lights and mediums will take crippling losses.
 
Tomorrow 221 RAF Group is hitting Schwebo in an effort strike of 4 Sqns of Blenheim, 3 of Hudsons with several escorting and sweeping fighters
 
225 Group will be able to operate tomorrow against a yet to identified target
 
 

Andy Mac · Post by **Andy Mac** » Mon Jul 26, 2010 7:25 pm

At present 221 Group is operating in support of Burcorps
225 Group of XV Corps on the coast
Tenth AF has the heavies and Wellingtons and is operating under direct command
222 Group is on defence of Ceylon to Calcutta
227 Group is training mixed Chinese and RIAF/RAF Sqns and is reposnible for the West Coast of India
 
Andy

aprezto · Post by **aprezto** » Tue Jul 27, 2010 1:40 am

Congrats Andy.
 
While the opportunity fell into your lap to a certain extent - you have grasped the opportunity with both hands. That's two excellent outcomes on the high seas now. A couple more and he'll be hurting.

Andy Mac v PZB This time India will Stand !!!!

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