The Case For Pounding Pearl

[paulkenny]

Ok I am admittedly a Newbie, but in GC 1 or 2, why shouldnt the KB just pound Pearl for a few days. This is the only place where the American ships are definitely to be found and taking out the American cruisers, destroyers and auxilliary vessels has got to help. I just did day two of a PBEMail and hit Pearl again. for the cost of 8 planes I assured none of the 8 BBs would ever sail again, took out the New Orleans (I think), sunk the Detroit, possibly the St Louis, Honolulu, the Phoenix, sunk 2 or 3 destroyers and hit a number of auxilliaries, ontop of destroying 18 or so PBYs, a half dozen or so fortresses.

Pearl Harbor is a sitting duck after day 1, correct? the air assets are gone.

Will an American player risk an early carrier battle with 6 CV vs 1 or 2 at the most American CVs? I would think not?

You get a chance to take out American ships for relatively little risk.

If you hit Pearl for a couple days you may lose 10 or 20 planes, isnt that a small price to pay for destroying a bunch of vessels, even auxilliaries.

If you position yourself to the SE of Pearl, set your subs to screen, put a fair number of your kates on search to make sure the American carriers dont find you and pound away?

isnt this what Nagumo SHOULD have done?

What am I missing?

Also what about the tactic of taking KB away for a couple of days and returning when presumably (hopefully) the American carriers have returned.

[vettim89]

ORIGINAL: paulkenny

Ok I am admittedly a Newbie, but in GC 1 or 2, why shouldnt the KB just pound Pearl for a few days. This is the only place where the American ships are definitely to be found and taking out the American cruisers, destroyers and auxilliary vessels has got to help. I just did day two of a PBEMail and hit Pearl again. for the cost of 8 planes I assured none of the 8 BBs would ever sail again, took out the New Orleans (I think), sunk the Detroit, possibly the St Louis, Honolulu, the Phoenix, sunk 2 or 3 destroyers and hit a number of auxilliaries, ontop of destroying 18 or so PBYs, a half dozen or so fortresses.

Pearl Harbor is a sitting duck after day 1, correct? the air assets are gone.

Will an American player risk an early carrier battle with 6 CV vs 1 or 2 at the most American CVs? I would think not?

You get a chance to take out American ships for relatively little risk.

If you hit Pearl for a couple days you may lose 10 or 20 planes, isnt that a small price to pay for destroying a bunch of vessels, even auxilliaries.

If you position yourself to the SE of Pearl, set your subs to screen, put a fair number of your kates on search to make sure the American carriers dont find you and pound away?

isnt this what Nagumo SHOULD have done?

What am I missing?

Also what about the tactic of taking KB away for a couple of days and returning when presumably (hopefully) the American carriers have returned.

Many players do have KB linger for an additional day or more. In fact while playing against the AI, KB stayed for three days.

As far as hunting US CVTF, that is up to you but many feel that is poor form. One of the biggest caveats of this game is the Japanese player has godlike knowledge of the initial Allied dispositions. Using you knowledge of the exact location of the US CVTf is a tad bit on the gamey side.

That said, fear of such a move is the exact reason most Allied players do no send their carriers back to PH for a week or even more.

As to why Nagumo didn't do this? He was out of gas. This fact is not represented in any AE scenarios.

[Patbgaming]

I don't believe Paul was suggesting hunting the American Carriers. I believe he was suggesting if the Allied player felt a pressing need to come to PH's aid with those carriers, he would be most likely suffer the same fate as the BB's in PH. I would have to agree with him.

As an Allied AFB ( so far ) I would not be upset if my opponent stuck around for additional time at PH. I would however attempt to catch him at night with a surface force. Who knows maybe they could get lucky. [:D]

[findmeifyoucan]

The last comment is true. The Americans still have several dd and pt gf's they can potentially engage the KB with which I managed to do in one game plus manage to put up about 80 fighters to meet the second strike. KB lost about 80 planes and I got some hits on the Carriers with my DD's!
Curiously I never heard from my Japanese opponent again. Lol
Oh yes and Managed to sink the Wake Invasion force with my Carriers!

[Grfin Zeppelin]

Once can do that but its a trade off. Flak and cap might be nasty on the second day. An Allied attack at night might be lucky and hit a carrier with a torpedo.
Also you will lose pilots and they are very valuable and Kido Butai cant obviously be elswere while at Pearl. If sinkig stuff makes you happy, sure stay for a week but remember that everything in Pearl is replacable for the Allies and your most precious assets are hanging around far away from any base.
Normaly neutralizing the BBs is my goal at Pearl, I dont want the Allies to have them ready in the near future. Everythig else is a bonus.

[Tullius]

A second attack on PH should be a serious consideration. Yesterday i have started my GC as Allied and the initial attack was successful (from a japanese point of view): 2 BB sunk, all others heavy damaged, 8 more ships were also destroyed (including 4 DD). The IJN has lost only 11 planes, around 20 were damaged.

Despite the tonnage lost PH has also Runway Damage of 60 and a Airservice Damage of 52 at the start of day 2. All air units have a low morale (30 -40) and the PG are decimated. So a new attack would meet a harder defense but PH is still weak. Not damaged were the port facilties and and an attack against these facilities would be interesting. I have read somewhere that Nimitz said after the war that in the case the IJN had destroyed the PH fuel capacity the war would have lasted perhaps 2 years longer. So it seems to me that Japan could win valuable time in the game when PH could not be used for logistic even when it is only for some months.

[crsutton]

I asked my two Japanese opponents for a two round limit, and even that can be enough to wipe out most of the Allied BB fleet. With a reasonble first round attack, the Allied player is usually in pretty poor shape to resist further attacks. Not always but usually. Yes, the Allied could get lucky with a surface attack but then again they could also get very butt kicked too. I don't mind losing old BBs but losing valuable crusiers and DDs is throwing good money after bad.

[Canoerebel]

In my game with Q-Ball, he hammered Pearl Harbor four days. By then the American carriers were far away or I might have considered an intercept effort on a suspicion that the KB would be low on sorties. I did get two intercepts with DD/CL forces out of Pearl, but no damaging hits were scored except to one Allied CL.

[mg62]

I also had the AI hit Pearl for 3-4 days.  I lost most of the BB's there, but watched as the aircraft & pilot losses built up for the KB.  Was able to use my carriers to hit some invasions.  The upside is you know where KB is for a longer period of time and the aircraft & pilot losses the KB suffers.
 
The downside is later on I only had several BB's for shore bombardment & the loss in vp's for the ships sunk.  At least I didn't have my shipyards full after the attack.

[CapAndGown]

ORIGINAL: mg62
At least I didn't have my shipyards full after the attack.

Look on the bright side!

[inqistor]

There was plan, about third wave in Pearl Harbor attack. Nagumo was generally criticised for not sending it, but Japanese Navy Officers, during whole war, usually after striking tactical victory, withdrew.
Loses will be greater, than 20 planes, but KB should use most of its strikes against Pearl. With Allies planes reinforcements, airfields should get special attention. There is also possibility of detaching heavy ships, and bombarding base, although it have some badasss naval guns. Even returning to PH, after refuelling could be beneficial, as Allies planes reinforcements are horrible at the beginning.

[aprezto]

There are some relatively easy counters to the 'many day pearl raids':
 
* Load up some AOs on the west coast and head them out to sea.
* Send undamaged warships towards the west coast at full speed, once you clear the danger zone reduce speed to cruise and head for the AOs.
* Create TFs of dead ducks in Pearl along with some PT boat groups - CAP with whatever you have. Japs are very very likely to use "naval attack first - port attack second" and will concentrate on the dead ducks sparing slow Aux ships that can't run like the warships can.
* Move your carriers to a range that can offload their complement of dauntlesses and wildcats - see how he likes them apples (depends on airfield damage)
* as stated by others - send out some surface combat TFs.
 
If he stays for more than 2 days with these approaches he has big stones.

[mg62]

* Create TFs of dead ducks in Pearl along with some PT boat groups - CAP with whatever you have. Japs are very very likely to use "naval attack first - port attack second" and will concentrate on the dead ducks sparing slow Aux ships that can't run like the warships can.


I found this did work to difuse the attacks on Pearl. I had several DD TF's out trying to hit the KB, some of these got targeted as well. They did attract some of the KB air assets.

All in all I do like the change in agresiveness of the AI. I play as Allied against the AI and found this so far to be more challenging then WitP. In my AE game I'm up to May of 43 with TF's on the way to Tinian. I'm planning on restarting sometime after the new patch comes out.

[Icedawg]

ORIGINAL: aprezto

There are some relatively easy counters to the 'many day pearl raids':

* Load up some AOs on the west coast and head them out to sea.
* Send undamaged warships towards the west coast at full speed, once you clear the danger zone reduce speed to cruise and head for the AOs.
* Create TFs of dead ducks in Pearl along with some PT boat groups - CAP with whatever you have. Japs are very very likely to use "naval attack first - port attack second" and will concentrate on the dead ducks sparing slow Aux ships that can't run like the warships can.
* Move your carriers to a range that can offload their complement of dauntlesses and wildcats - see how he likes them apples (depends on airfield damage)
* as stated by others - send out some surface combat TFs.

If he stays for more than 2 days with these approaches he has big stones.

Isn't this a bit gamey? It sounds like you're doing something that wouldn't have been done in real life just to exploit the game system (sending out worthless ships as targets to eat up the bulk of the enemy's attacks). In real life, an air combat TF commander would not waste sorties on PT boats and minesweepers. Unfortunately, the game system does this and the player has no control over it. So, what you're doing is taking advantage of this shortcoming of the game engine. Very gamey. [:-]

[CV2]

ORIGINAL: inqistor

There was plan, about third wave in Pearl Harbor attack. Nagumo was generally criticised for not sending it, but Japanese Navy Officers, during whole war, usually after striking tactical victory, withdrew.
Loses will be greater, than 20 planes, but KB should use most of its strikes against Pearl. With Allies planes reinforcements, airfields should get special attention. There is also possibility of detaching heavy ships, and bombarding base, although it have some badasss naval guns. Even returning to PH, after refuelling could be beneficial, as Allies planes reinforcements are horrible at the beginning.

Yes, the losses WOULD be greater than 20 planes. But the game doesnt work like it should.

In the years I have played AE, I have never seen a PH raid that lost even half the 29 planes they historically lost on the first day. The last game I played where the Japs hit a 2nd day they lost 11. 11 on the SECOND day. I think real world the AA gunners shot down that many US planes after the attack [;)]

Personally as the Japs, I have never stayed for a 2nd attack. I think its a gamey move myself, so I dont do it. Real world, the Japs had no idea where the US carriers were. They had no idea how many subs were out and they certainly didnt know the torps were near useless.

[Nikademus]

i'll trade a third raid on Pearl in exchange for not having to run away from KB straight into an i-Boot which sank my poor Enterprise. [:@]

Dang game is BROKEN! [:D]

[HansBolter]

ORIGINAL: crsutton

I asked my two Japanese opponents for a two round limit, and even that can be enough to wipe out most of the Allied BB fleet. With a reasonble first round attack, the Allied player is usually in pretty poor shape to resist further attacks. Not always but usually. Yes, the Allied could get lucky with a surface attack but then again they could also get very butt kicked too. I don't mind losing old BBs but losing valuable crusiers and DDs is throwing good money after bad.

An aggressive sorty can indeed go both ways, but in the words of an old wrgame buddy "no balls, no babies"!

I posted this in another thread about the AIs atacks at Pearl:

I play alot against the AI and have started at least 20 different games of various scenarios.

I have seen it go many ways. It does appear to be variable, but the AI seems to give a lot of weight to naval attacks when making choices.

If I am not assuming a second day of strikes will not occur then I will form the various ASW TFs necessary to start working on the job of clearing the area of subs.

If I am assuming a second day of strikes then I will clear Pearl of every thing that floats with orders to flee the area at high speed.

Sometimes I choose the aggressive route and sorty against the KB.

It's a guessing game I have played a number of times with different results every time.

As long as you are playing against the AI you might want to have a go at a surface action against the KB. It can be a lot of fun if it comes off.

I just restarted scenario #10 and had only one CA, three CLs and a slew of Destroyers and PT boats to sorty with. I got lucky and chose the right path to intercept. The Minneapolis was superb, putting an 8" shell into Hiryu, Soryu and THREE 8"ers into Kaga while deftly avoiding 14" shells from Kirishima and 18" ers from Musashi (I'm playing Iron Man). I lost two destroyers and two PT boats. The action didn't sink any carriers but it affected what the KB did at Wake on the way home and was a boat load of fun.


Here it is:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Time Surface Combat, near Lihue at 177,101, Range 11,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
CV Kaga, Shell hits 3
CV Hiryu, Shell hits 1, on fire
CV Soryu, Shell hits 1
CV Shokaku
CV Zuikaku
CV Akagi
BB Hiei
BB Kirishima, Shell hits 2
BB Musashi
CA Tone
CA Chikuma
CL Abukuma
DD Akigumo
DD Kagero
DD Isokaze
DD Shiranui
DD Urakaze
DD Hamakaze
DD Tanikaze
DD Arare
DD Kasumi
CA Adatara

Allied Ships
CA Minneapolis, Shell hits 1
CL Detroit
CL Helena
CL Phoenix
DD Bagley, Shell hits 1, on fire
DD Blue
DD Helm, Shell hits 2
DD Mugford, Shell hits 3, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
DD Ralph Talbot
DD Henley, Shell hits 2, on fire
DD Patterson
DD Jarvis



Improved night sighting under 85% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Clear Conditions and 85% moonlight: 12,000 yards
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 11,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 11,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CV Kaga at 11,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CV Zuikaku at 11,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CV Shokaku at 11,000 yards
CL Detroit engages CV Shokaku at 11,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CV Kaga at 11,000 yards
BB Kirishima engages DD Ralph Talbot at 11,000 yards
DD Mugford engages CV Kaga at 11,000 yards
DD Hamakaze engages DD Mugford at 11,000 yards
DD Urakaze engages DD Jarvis at 11,000 yards
DD Blue engages DD Akigumo at 11,000 yards
Range closes to 10,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CV Akagi at 10,000 yards
CL Detroit engages CV Soryu at 10,000 yards
DD Henley engages CV Kaga at 10,000 yards
DD Ralph Talbot engages CV Kaga at 10,000 yards
DD Mugford engages CV Kaga at 10,000 yards
CA Adatara engages CA Minneapolis at 10,000 yards
DD Blue engages CV Kaga at 10,000 yards
CA Tone engages CA Minneapolis at 10,000 yards
DD Arare engages DD Henley at 10,000 yards
DD Mugford sunk by DD Tanikaze at 10,000 yards
DD Henley engages CV Zuikaku at 10,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CV Shokaku at 10,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CV Hiryu at 10,000 yards
DD Henley engages CV Kaga at 10,000 yards
DD Ralph Talbot engages BB Kirishima at 10,000 yards
BB Hiei engages CA Minneapolis at 10,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CA Adatara at 10,000 yards
DD Bagley engages CV Akagi at 10,000 yards
DD Hamakaze engages DD Ralph Talbot at 10,000 yards
DD Shiranui engages DD Patterson at 10,000 yards
CA Tone engages CA Minneapolis at 10,000 yards
CL Phoenix engages CV Zuikaku at 10,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CV Shokaku at 10,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CV Soryu at 10,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CV Hiryu at 10,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CV Kaga at 10,000 yards
DD Isokaze engages DD Henley at 10,000 yards
BB Kirishima engages CA Minneapolis at 10,000 yards
DD Helm engages BB Hiei at 10,000 yards
DD Shiranui engages DD Blue at 10,000 yards
CA Tone engages CA Minneapolis at 10,000 yards
DD Kasumi engages DD Jarvis at 10,000 yards
DD Helm engages DD Tanikaze at 10,000 yards
DD Helm engages DD Shiranui at 10,000 yards
DD Helm engages DD Kagero at 10,000 yards
DD Akigumo engages DD Henley at 10,000 yards
Range closes to 8,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CV Kaga at 8,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CV Soryu at 8,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CV Hiryu at 8,000 yards
DD Akigumo engages DD Patterson at 8,000 yards
DD Henley engages DD Hamakaze at 8,000 yards
BB Kirishima engages CA Minneapolis at 8,000 yards
BB Hiei engages CA Minneapolis at 8,000 yards
CA Adatara engages DD Blue at 8,000 yards
CA Chikuma engages DD Bagley at 8,000 yards
CL Abukuma engages CA Minneapolis at 8,000 yards
DD Bagley engages DD Tanikaze at 8,000 yards
DD Bagley engages DD Isokaze at 8,000 yards
DD Kagero engages DD Blue at 8,000 yards
Range increases to 10,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CV Kaga at 10,000 yards
CL Phoenix engages CV Zuikaku at 10,000 yards
CL Helena engages CV Kaga at 10,000 yards
CL Detroit engages CV Kaga at 10,000 yards
DD Bagley engages CV Hiryu at 10,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CV Kaga at 10,000 yards
DD Isokaze engages DD Henley at 10,000 yards
BB Kirishima engages CA Minneapolis at 10,000 yards
BB Hiei engages DD Helm at 10,000 yards
DD Akigumo engages DD Blue at 10,000 yards
CL Detroit engages CA Chikuma at 10,000 yards
CA Minneapolis engages CA Tone at 10,000 yards
CL Abukuma engages CA Minneapolis at 10,000 yards
DD Arare engages DD Bagley at 10,000 yards
DD Helm engages DD Tanikaze at 10,000 yards
DD Henley engages DD Hamakaze at 10,000 yards
Japanese Task Force Manages to Escape
Task forces break off...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Time Surface Combat, near Lihue at 177,100, Range 12,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
CV Kaga
CV Hiryu, on fire
CV Soryu
CV Shokaku
CV Zuikaku
CV Akagi
BB Hiei
BB Kirishima
BB Musashi, Shell hits 1
CA Tone
CA Chikuma
CL Abukuma
DD Akigumo
DD Kagero
DD Isokaze
DD Shiranui
DD Urakaze
DD Hamakaze
DD Tanikaze
DD Arare
DD Kasumi
CA Adatara

Allied Ships
DD Cummings, Shell hits 1
DD Case
DD Conyngham, Shell hits 1, on fire
DD Reid, Shell hits 5, and is sunk
DD Allen
DD Chew
DD Schley, Shell hits 1
DD Ward



Improved night sighting under 85% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Clear Conditions and 85% moonlight: 12,000 yards
Range closes to 24,000 yards...
Range closes to 22,000 yards...
Range closes to 20,000 yards...
Range closes to 18,000 yards...
Range closes to 16,000 yards...
Range closes to 14,000 yards...
Range closes to 12,000 yards...
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 12,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 12,000 yards
BB Musashi engages DD Case at 12,000 yards
DD Arare engages DD Cummings at 12,000 yards
CA Chikuma engages DD Reid at 12,000 yards
CL Abukuma engages DD Reid at 12,000 yards
DD Kasumi engages DD Reid at 12,000 yards
DD Shiranui engages DD Reid at 12,000 yards
Range closes to 9,000 yards
DD Reid engages CV Zuikaku at 9,000 yards
DD Reid engages CV Kaga at 9,000 yards
DD Case engages DD Kasumi at 9,000 yards
DD Cummings engages DD Arare at 9,000 yards
DD Reid engages CA Adatara at 9,000 yards
CA Tone engages DD Reid at 9,000 yards
DD Tanikaze engages DD Cummings at 9,000 yards
DD Hamakaze engages DD Schley at 9,000 yards
Range closes to 8,000 yards
DD Ward engages DD Kasumi at 8,000 yards
DD Reid engages CV Zuikaku at 8,000 yards
DD Kasumi engages DD Chew at 8,000 yards
DD Kasumi engages DD Reid at 8,000 yards
DD Kasumi engages DD Conyngham at 8,000 yards
BB Musashi engages DD Reid at 8,000 yards
DD Kasumi engages DD Cummings at 8,000 yards
DD Isokaze engages DD Reid at 8,000 yards
DD Akigumo engages DD Reid at 8,000 yards
DD Ward engages CV Akagi at 8,000 yards
DD Isokaze engages DD Schley at 8,000 yards
DD Conyngham engages CV Soryu at 8,000 yards
DD Isokaze engages DD Conyngham at 8,000 yards
DD Conyngham engages CV Kaga at 8,000 yards
BB Musashi engages DD Conyngham at 8,000 yards
BB Hiei engages DD Conyngham at 8,000 yards
CA Tone engages DD Conyngham at 8,000 yards
DD Kasumi engages DD Schley at 8,000 yards
DD Schley engages DD Tanikaze at 8,000 yards
Range increases to 11,000 yards
DD Conyngham engages CV Akagi at 11,000 yards
DD Kasumi engages DD Schley at 11,000 yards
DD Chew engages CV Shokaku at 11,000 yards
DD Arare engages DD Conyngham at 11,000 yards
DD Case engages DD Kasumi at 11,000 yards
BB Musashi engages DD Cummings at 11,000 yards
BB Hiei engages DD Conyngham at 11,000 yards
CA Tone engages DD Conyngham at 11,000 yards
DD Conyngham engages DD Kasumi at 11,000 yards
DD Tanikaze engages DD Conyngham at 11,000 yards
DD Hamakaze engages DD Conyngham at 11,000 yards
DD Urakaze engages DD Case at 11,000 yards
DD Ward engages DD Isokaze at 11,000 yards
DD Case engages DD Kagero at 11,000 yards
DD Akigumo engages DD Cummings at 11,000 yards
Japanese Task Force Manages to Escape
Task forces break off...


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Time Surface Combat, near Lihue at 177,100, Range 17,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
CV Kaga
CV Hiryu, on fire
CV Soryu
CV Shokaku
CV Zuikaku
CV Akagi
BB Hiei
BB Kirishima
BB Musashi
CA Tone
CA Chikuma
CL Abukuma
DD Akigumo
DD Kagero
DD Isokaze
DD Shiranui
DD Urakaze
DD Hamakaze
DD Tanikaze
DD Arare
DD Kasumi
CA Adatara

Allied Ships
PT-20, Shell hits 2, and is sunk
PT-21
PT-22
PT-23, Shell hits 1, and is sunk



Improved night sighting under 85% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Clear Conditions and 85% moonlight: 12,000 yards
Range closes to 24,000 yards...
Range closes to 23,000 yards...
Range closes to 21,000 yards...
Range closes to 20,000 yards...
Range closes to 19,000 yards...
Range closes to 15,000 yards...
Range increases to 16,000 yards...
Range increases to 17,000 yards...
Range closes to 16,000 yards...
Range increases to 17,000 yards...
Range increases to 20,000 yards...
Range increases to 21,000 yards...
Range closes to 20,000 yards...
Range closes to 18,000 yards...
Range closes to 17,000 yards...
Range closes to 15,000 yards...
Range closes to 11,000 yards...
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 11,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 11,000 yards
Both TF attempt to withdraw!
Range increases to 17,000 yards...
CV Akagi , CV Zuikaku , CV Shokaku ,
CV Soryu , CV Hiryu , CV Kaga screened from combat
- escorted by DD Tanikaze , DD Shiranui , DD Isokaze ,
DD Akigumo
PT-23 sunk by BB Hiei at 17,000 yards
PT-20 sunk by DD Hamakaze at 17,000 yards
Task forces break off...


p.s. Don't forget to put an aggresive admiral like Rockwell in command of your principal SAG.

< Message edited by HansBolter -- 12/22/2010 12:42:42 PM >

_____________________________

[aprezto]

ORIGINAL: Icedawg

ORIGINAL: aprezto

There are some relatively easy counters to the 'many day pearl raids':

* Load up some AOs on the west coast and head them out to sea.
* Send undamaged warships towards the west coast at full speed, once you clear the danger zone reduce speed to cruise and head for the AOs.
* Create TFs of dead ducks in Pearl along with some PT boat groups - CAP with whatever you have. Japs are very very likely to use "naval attack first - port attack second" and will concentrate on the dead ducks sparing slow Aux ships that can't run like the warships can.
* Move your carriers to a range that can offload their complement of dauntlesses and wildcats - see how he likes them apples (depends on airfield damage)
* as stated by others - send out some surface combat TFs.

If he stays for more than 2 days with these approaches he has big stones.

Isn't this a bit gamey? It sounds like you're doing something that wouldn't have been done in real life just to exploit the game system (sending out worthless ships as targets to eat up the bulk of the enemy's attacks). In real life, an air combat TF commander would not waste sorties on PT boats and minesweepers. Unfortunately, the game system does this and the player has no control over it. So, what you're doing is taking advantage of this shortcoming of the game engine. Very gamey. [:-]

Hmmm, not sure. They are ships destined to die anyway. I usually use the highly damaged BBs as the bait because they're high value and likelihood to be targeted. The PT boats are not there as targets and are unlikely to attract much attention - I've not found they over-ride a "naval attack" order anyway unless the planes are set to altitude 100". No, the PT boats are there to try and offset the opponent sending in a surface attack force that then clears the dead ducks.
As to this being 'gamey', well I kind of get where you are coming from but I think it is more 'gamey' against the AI only. Against a PBEM opponent I think I am just taking advantage of his fear of enemy surface or carrier forces putting to sea. If he sets some attack squads to attack Port first he'll side-step this approach. So I disagree that the game engine does not have a way of coping with my tactic. My opponent may not want to set this for fear of the allied CVs turning up and he not having his attack squads set to "attack naval" as a primary. But then, that is his choice and therefore a risk he takes. I'd not do this against the AI for exactly the reason you put forward - I can hardly play mind games with the AI. I KNOW it will be set to naval first, port second.

To extrapolate, now that he's only hit the dead ducks because he had a primary target of 'attach naval', in the next turn I'd change approach and put all ships into task forces, assumming he's now changed his orders to attack port. It is also, at this point, that I'd send the US carriers in if I felt I had his mettle. You would also say this was gamey, as I was taking advantage of the primary orders of "attack port", where in your mind your commander would circumvent these orders when the carriers turned up. I say he could be following the orders as given to him by you, and they are to attack the port.

I don't entirely disagree with you, it is a bit of a fiddle of the restriction of the orders process. But navies were built around orders and doctrine, it was often difficult for them to be broken, especially for the Japanese. I also say there is a way for the port to be targeted and the naval units to be ignored, if you, as high commander order it. You just have to have the stones to order it - such is life as the top dog.

[inqistor]

Pearl Harbor is large port, with Repair Facilities. Any additional KB attacks are mostly to finish off those already, highly damaged ships (or they will return year later, just check the historical 8th December turn - BBs have even 95 float, and they are still rescuable), so any "Light (or even heavy) Brigade Charge" is playing directly into Japan hand, as they do not have to face AA fire from base.
And Allies have 80% non-working torpedoes, and Buffaloes as fighters, so sending it against KB is wasting of any near-future opportunity.