TOAW supply Bug

[pionier]

Happens with version 3.2 and 3.4.0.201

My opponment destroyed my only two railway brigdes through the front. I thought that there should be 25% supply...
But actually it is 100%. Take a look at the picture:



As you can see there shouldn't be 100% supply. You can proove this bug with any test secenario creating such a situation. The game does not differ between an direct link for the check of the supply.

[larryfulkerson]

ORIGINAL: pionier
My opponment destroyed my only two railway brigdes through the front. I thought that there should be 25% supply...
But actually it is 100%. Take a look at the picture:

The supply level doesn't decrease instantly the second the bridge is destroyed. Usually the supply level decreases start on the turns following the dropped bridge(s). Is this screenshot of a subsequent turn or the same turn the bridge(s) are dropped?

[Telumar]

Pionier is Player 1 and his opponent (Rums) is Player 2. Screenshot is from beginning of Pionier's turn, played under 3.2. In the previous player 2 turn the bridges got destroyed. So there should be a supply drop already.

[Panama]

Did the supply level remain that high or eventually drop? But like he said, it shouldn't be full.

[pionier]

... no it only drops when the small brigde two hex north of chudoyo is detroyed. Then you will see next turn the supply fall in the near of nova ladoga.

You can try it. for supply distribution it is enough to got in the hex next to you a railwail. as you may see in the next picture



and here you may see the impact when you ever thought to cut the enemy of supply while taction the railway junction....



Try it yourself it won't take so much longer then writing a post...

[Panama]

Nice, the supply does a hop to the next rail hex like it is connected. [8|]

[Curtis Lemay]

This is a problem with Old Supply only. And, as was noted, that's the way it's always worked.

I can happily report that New Supply does it right. See the attached screenshot:

[Panama]

Wow, never noticed it jumped rails in 3.2. I just thought it didn't bother with blown bridges. Which is why I have not bothered with 3.2 supply since the release of the 3.4 patches.

[sPzAbt653]

Unrelated and probably not worthy of its own thread, 'high supply' doesn't work anymore? I tried a couple old COW scenarios and switching 'high' on/off didn't change anything. Let several turns run, and closed and restarted, but still the supply level stayed the same.

[larryfulkerson]

And another thing...........here we have a supply unit that doesn't seem to be putting out any supply. Maybe I don't understand how supply units work or something but I kind of expected higher levels of supply immediately around the supply unit ( radius of 4 ). Anybody else notice that their supply units don't work?

[Silvanski]

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

And another thing...........here we have a supply unit that doesn't seem to be putting out any supply. Maybe I don't understand how supply units work or something but I kind of expected higher levels of supply immediately around the supply unit ( radius of 4 ). Anybody else notice that their supply units don't work?

As far as I know, the values of a mobile supply unit never show on the map

[sPzAbt653]

I've run tests on that and Silvanski is correct. For the supply units:

They increase the Supply Level in each supplied location that can trace a path no longer than the Supply Radius to the Supply unit. Additionally, Supply units multiply supply distribution to adjacent Cooperative units by 1.5. There is no effect on Unsupplied locations.

[Telumar]

Larry, have you moved the supply unit before you made the screenshot? If so, then it's effect will show up in the next turn.

[larryfulkerson]

ORIGINAL: Telumar
Larry, have you moved the supply unit before you made the screenshot? If so, then it's effect will show up in the next turn.

The screenshot was at the beginning of turn 4 before any thing had moved. So he ( the supply unit ) was there from the end of turn 3 until the screenshot was taken and I expected to see the supply level higher immediately around the supply unit like what happens in FITE. And if the supply levels don't increase visibly on the map then I'm confused as to how in the world the supply unit is supposed to work. I guess.

[Panama]

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

ORIGINAL: Telumar
Larry, have you moved the supply unit before you made the screenshot? If so, then it's effect will show up in the next turn.

The screenshot was at the beginning of turn 4 before any thing had moved. So he ( the supply unit ) was there from the end of turn 3 until the screenshot was taken and I expected to see the supply level higher immediately around the supply unit like what happens in FITE. And if the supply levels don't increase visibly on the map then I'm confused as to how in the world the supply unit is supposed to work. I guess.

I don't even see the supply level appear on the map in FiTE within what should be the supply unit's range. I'm looking at it right now and the supply unit is within two movement points of a railhead, yet two movement points down the road, beyond the supply unit, the supply is not displayed at the level it should be (full). I'm thinking it never has been displayed. So, yeah, how do you know if the supply level really is being elevated because of the supply unit without constantly trying to do math on a units past and current supply? Do you just assume it's being elevated without any verification?

[Curtis Lemay]

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

And another thing...........here we have a supply unit that doesn't seem to be putting out any supply. Maybe I don't understand how supply units work or something but I kind of expected higher levels of supply immediately around the supply unit ( radius of 4 ). Anybody else notice that their supply units don't work?

This shot doesn't give us enough info to tell what the values should be.

My tests indicate that supply units are working - both in New and Old Supply Rules.

[Curtis Lemay]

ORIGINAL: Silvanski

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

And another thing...........here we have a supply unit that doesn't seem to be putting out any supply. Maybe I don't understand how supply units work or something but I kind of expected higher levels of supply immediately around the supply unit ( radius of 4 ). Anybody else notice that their supply units don't work?

As far as I know, the values of a mobile supply unit never show on the map

The increases within a supply radius of the supply units do appear on the map display. The boost for being adjacent don't - like the boost for being adjacent to an HQ.

[Curtis Lemay]

Here's a shot of a location beyond the range of any SU.

[ogar]

Larry, Panama,

I can confirm that supply units do increase supply. A couple of weeks ago, I got curious and re-ran a turn in 3.4.191 after I had pulled all supply units back to the main supply point. The effect was clear and dramatic.

Also, I dimly recall from somewhere that you are not supposed to dig in your supply units -- 'makes the trucks slower ?', I dunno, but that may also be happening in Larry's example.

And what drove me to make my experiment, was I too wondered if supply units were doing anything. I found out that what you think is supply radius (new rules) is often overestimating it -- remember the 50% density cost, plus terrain and environment costs. So instead of using the documentation's example and placing a supply unit 2*supply radius from a supply point, I try to keep the unit at about 1.5*radius from the point. So far, that seems to be working.

As Silvanski pointed out, there's no discernible effect other than HQ-like 50% boost (for adjacent cooperating units) of using supply units. Essentially, if you get the supply unit placed within the [1.5*] radius, ordinary units that would be at 60% of supply without any supply unit, will now be at about 80% (and those at 40% will now be at 60%). BUT where a unit is unsupplied, it is unsupplied even with a supply unit a hex or two away -- those badlands stop 'em cold.

And sadly, Panama, I tried, but I could not get a chain of units working -- they help, but there's no magic relaying of suppply past 1 unit in the chain.

HTH

[Curtis Lemay]

And here's the same location the turn after a SU was moved there.