The Pe-2 production does not go through the whole war, so the computer must change some of the units once the replacement pool dries up. [:(]
Do you have the 1.03 patch? That should fix the air unit fatigue problem with the 1.02 patch, which should then decrease flying accident rates.
Against the computer i'm into mid 1944 and I still have a few I-16 family units around; production of modern planes hasn't kept up with losses and the computer churned out new air units up to the end of 1942.
Defending the Motherland (Sov Player vrs AI)
Moderators: Joel Billings, Sabre21
RE: Turn 43
I am using the public patches, I've got a mental block about beta patches. The list of things in the patch though so far looks great, and I see why I can't make my Guards Tank Corps. I'll wait on that...I've got 4 Guard Bde and may get a few more as the fighting starts up.
I finally spotted what was causing my high losses of Mig-3's...it is the damned recon the AI is doing around Moscow. I suspect his recon fighters are doing a fine job killing on the order of 40-50 planes (mix of Migs and LaGGs) a week. One of the Yak-7A's just transitioned to the 7B...so I think I'm giving up on manual changes. It looks like you have to use them when they show up as they show up. Modernization you would think would take precedence over making new units.
I had 500 AP at the start of April...now down to 110...that took a lot of AP to make the tank Corps...I think I have 24 of them now. A lot of fiddle faddle as I was trying to put them together in sequential order but it turns out that isn't necessary. ah well it made me feel good...dressing up the lines and such.
I finally spotted what was causing my high losses of Mig-3's...it is the damned recon the AI is doing around Moscow. I suspect his recon fighters are doing a fine job killing on the order of 40-50 planes (mix of Migs and LaGGs) a week. One of the Yak-7A's just transitioned to the 7B...so I think I'm giving up on manual changes. It looks like you have to use them when they show up as they show up. Modernization you would think would take precedence over making new units.
I had 500 AP at the start of April...now down to 110...that took a lot of AP to make the tank Corps...I think I have 24 of them now. A lot of fiddle faddle as I was trying to put them together in sequential order but it turns out that isn't necessary. ah well it made me feel good...dressing up the lines and such.
RE: Turn 43
APs well spent. [:D]
Don't worry about not having Guards Tank Corps yet....just win battles and they'll get it. [:)]
Don't worry about not having Guards Tank Corps yet....just win battles and they'll get it. [:)]
-
karonagames
- Posts: 4701
- Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 8:05 am
- Location: The Duchy of Cornwall, nr England
RE: Turn 43
@ Paul: thanks for posting the OOB comparisons. The Axis have increased effective manpower by 200k in a month and increased AFV strength by 600. Another month like that, and I think the numbers for the Axis are going to be very close to the 1942 campaign benchmark numbers that we used in testing. The Soviets are going to over 1.5 Million up, but that is expected in SU vs AI games due to the lack of pocketing in 1941.
We have seen the AI do interesting things in 1942, but your current strength might limit what she can do.
We have seen the AI do interesting things in 1942, but your current strength might limit what she can do.
It's only a Game
RE: Turn 43
You're welcome. I'll post up the start of may and then turn 53 as well as the more detailed losses report. I've not put those up since the only combat is attrition. The rebound is disturbing, and I may have to mentally prepare for retreats in the summer.
The lack of pocketing is due to my efforts to break out of the pockets the AI formed, which were risky but I felt necessary, and the fact the AI often didn't try to make pockets but just over ran my troops. However, I am not so much convinced anymore that this is a direct AI failure since I never managed to do much pocketing in the blizzard as I had hoped. It is, looking back on it, entirely possible the AI's behavior was a better decision then it looked to be at the time.
I've been playing wargames for more than 30 years, that was a lot of work on my part. Near the end there was a lot of swearing going on, because it managed to seriously threaten the Southern and Southwestern Fronts, and it did catch me off guard around 3 times. I don't think I've seen an AI perform so well, at least not one that doesn't cheat significantly more than this one appears to.
The only serious failure I noticed the AI do was using its security forces to occupy ground and trying to use them to screen its advancing units. But I was nearly at the point of tossing the kitchen sink in during the blizzard actions so again while it at the time looked to be stupid, I have to admit it might have been just that they were the only thing available...and in the situation I would have possibly done the same. I do know, at least once, I was contemplating another combat drop even though I had a pathetically small number of transports just to seal a pocket.
The lack of pocketing is due to my efforts to break out of the pockets the AI formed, which were risky but I felt necessary, and the fact the AI often didn't try to make pockets but just over ran my troops. However, I am not so much convinced anymore that this is a direct AI failure since I never managed to do much pocketing in the blizzard as I had hoped. It is, looking back on it, entirely possible the AI's behavior was a better decision then it looked to be at the time.
I've been playing wargames for more than 30 years, that was a lot of work on my part. Near the end there was a lot of swearing going on, because it managed to seriously threaten the Southern and Southwestern Fronts, and it did catch me off guard around 3 times. I don't think I've seen an AI perform so well, at least not one that doesn't cheat significantly more than this one appears to.
The only serious failure I noticed the AI do was using its security forces to occupy ground and trying to use them to screen its advancing units. But I was nearly at the point of tossing the kitchen sink in during the blizzard actions so again while it at the time looked to be stupid, I have to admit it might have been just that they were the only thing available...and in the situation I would have possibly done the same. I do know, at least once, I was contemplating another combat drop even though I had a pathetically small number of transports just to seal a pocket.
Turn 47 (initial)
7/5/1942 STAVKA
The weather...the forcasting bureau has just had a sudden turn over in staff, plus a number of people here at planning have suddenly vanished. The confident replies of several more weeks of bad weather, that we had been getting up until now have just proven to be incorrect. And the Hitlerites have seized the imitative and launched a massive attack against the 12th and 16th Armies just south of Kiev. Reports are still pouring in by motorcycle courier from the Moscow Airdrome as Yak couriers make their way back, the land lines are down again and as usual the radio is unreliable.
From all reports the enemy unleashed 8 Panzer and 2 motorizied infantry divisions with a full compliment of supporting troops. The 12th Army again takes the burnt of the offensive and from all reports has been driven south of its starting positions. This exposes the 19th Army Kharkov MD to the enemy but we are currently waiting on more details. Further south the enemy attempted to drive our troops away from Odessa with mixed results.
A serious problem seems to be some division commanders had released men on leave and their front line rifle regiments were much reduced in size. This was worse in the north, but still complicated the issue for the 9th Army. The forces arrayed against the 9th Army are significantly weaker then those facing the Southwestern Front and the situation looks stable.
Here at planning we are evaluating two operations. The enemies actions have destroyed our planned slow withdraw of the 12th Army to the positions held by the 19th with the 16th passing through both the 12th and 6th to take up position in the rear. We had hoped to buy several weeks with that maneuver. The question now is to withdraw back or make counter attacks to restore the line first. The individual enemy formations are not that strong and there is scope for a counter attack, the question is if it worth risking this now at the start of the summer campaign season especially since there is no certainty spring rains will not fall. Two options will be prepared and evaluated as the staff here seeks order from chaotic battle reports. But one thing is clear, this is not last summer out troops have significantly improved in fighting capacity.
The current stand of our Guards Forces is:
4 Guard Tank Brigades
20 Guard Rifle Divisions
3 Guard Rifle Brigades
2 Guard Airborne Brigades
2 Guard Mountain Rifle Divisions
1 Guard Cavalry Corps
5 Guard Cavalry Divisions (including those in the Guard Cavalry Corps)
6 Guard Artillery Regiment RVGK
4 Guard Howitzer Regiments
1 Guard Motorcycle Regiment
2 Guard BAP (IL-4, SB-2)
On more mundane matters, given there is time while the reports are processed the following officers are rewarded for their efforts:
5th Army commander Mikhail Potapov is promoted to General-Polkovnik. The 5th Army is responsible for the defense of Kiev and has performed well thoughout the last year so this is well deserved.
4th Shock Army commander Ilya Smirnov is promoted to General-Armii. Just in time to be sent south to deal with the oncoming panzers it is not a bad thing to motivate our commanders.
6th Army commander Ivan Muzychenko is promoted to General-Armii. Another officer who will be tasked with perfoming under considerable stress as the 6th Army will be holding the open ground just to the south of Kiev and securing the flank of the 12th Army come what may.
32nd Army commander Mikhail Parsegov is promoted to General-Polkovnik. The 32nd Army is currently performing vital engineering efforts but was active in the early part of the winter counter offensive.
Unfortunately 6th IAK PVO Air Command commander Daniil Zhuravlev has been killed in action when he took a Mig up against a particularily annoying German recon pilot, one can admire the concept of leading from the front while perhaps understanding that there is a time and place for such things. General-Mayor Sergei Rudenko takes command of 6th IAK PVO Air Command and we all wish him the best as he is covering our building from air attack.
In a move that no one here can understand Comrade Stalin announced that 16th Army commander Mikhail Lukin is dismissed and that General-Leytenent Fyodor Remezov takes command of 16th Army. General Rememzov was removed from command only some weeks ago for failure to perform. While one should say nothing about Comrade Stalin's personal managment requests this is one is very odd. And the timing is, perhaps, not the best.
Official War Records Office
Soviet Losses to date:
Men Killed: 1 066 180
Men Captured: 554 754
Men Disabled: 899 507
Guns Lost: 37 799
AFVs Lost: 13 214
Fighters: 5
Fighter Bombers: 9 822
Tactical Bombers: 1 547
Level Bombers: 3 130
Recon: 723
Transports: 1 115
Flak Losses: 1 784
Operational Losses: 7 284
Total Aircraft Losses: 16 342
Estimated Axis Losses (from NKVD sources):
Men Killed: 475 310
Men Captured: 195 106
Men Disabled: 1 402 395
Guns Lost: 20 033
AFVs Lost: 3 642
Fighters: 1 287
Fighter Bombers: 165
Night Fighters: 3
Tactical Bombers: 628
Level Bombers: 1 817
Recon: 468
Transports: 395
Flak Losses: 928
Operational Losses: 2 399
Total Aircraft Losses: 4 733
Player Notes:
This is just a start, I have two more reports with pictures and I will add in the losses and oob screenshot to this post. I was an idiot, and didn't properly look at the weather chart...I was thinking the weather was mostly rain it is only about 50-50 so this caught me with my pants down in a big way. Mea Cupia Maxima.
Compounding the situation is the whole rifle squads vanishing from divisions problem I have been fighting with for the last game-month. It hits two ways: the first is that you loose the bulk of your infantry strength, then when/if they come back they have no experience. So my front line Rifle divisions lost their 50+ experience Rifle Squads, and assuming they have gotten them back have now 30 exp. CV3 to CV1 time here. Outside of it started with the 42a Rifle TOE swap and me having 6000+ Rifle Squad(-) in my pools I don't know why it is happening. Setting units to refit mode results in divisions fully equipped with Rifle Squad(-)...with low experience. I've notice that things are sorting out themselves but still it is bang your head on the desk frustrating. When I put up the numbers you will see some divisions with 7-8K men...this is most likely a unit with 100% non-infantry TOE and 30% Rifle Squads rather than a unit with 60% TOE. Any developers reading please please if you find out what caused this and fix it I'm sure everyone affected by it would be beyond grateful. Anything I can do to help just ask!
I watched about half the fights in message lvl 4 then switched to 3 as it was getting late. Unfortunately I missed the Panzer attacks so I can't see if my anti-armour capacity is improved. Regardless, the infantry is fighting considerably better. I see multiple firing of long range artillery as the enemy closes, then the 120 mm and 82 mm mortar's kick in again multiple times, then the Maxim HMGs start firing, this is the first time I've ever seen that, then the 76 mm infantry guns. The enemy is taking 300+ casualties before Rifle fire start and a lot happens between the initial artillery duel and the rifle squads firing. The Guards Art Rgt RVGK when it showed up really shot a lot. Very different from what I was seeing in summer of 41. Also the enemy launched not a single hasty attack, and not all of them worked. Plus I got very good ground support, though I still find the air-to-air combat a bit hard to sort out. Later on in the turn when the AI tried to bomb my fields it got obliterated...must have lost nearly 200 level and tactical bombers this turn. I saw one attack where it lost 50 and another where it lost 70 if memory serves. I lost enough I-16 Model 24s a group switched over to Yak-1s...great.
Unfortunately the game is also trying me in another way. I just read that a Gen-L who had been dismissed for incompetence is back in command of the 16th Army (my primary SW front reserve)...now just why would someone with a win:3 loss:42 ratio even be considered for front line duty? This just annoys me, since my house rule is to not do manual officer changes and someone with mech 2, inf 4 and morale/admin/initiative 3-4 ...that just sucks. I feel a bit kicked while I'm down over it.
Anyway over the next day or so expect to see some more detailed accounting and the usual color maps and things show up. I have to analyze, adapt and overcome at a time I was mostly thinking about that stupid bug...time to switch gears.
The weather...the forcasting bureau has just had a sudden turn over in staff, plus a number of people here at planning have suddenly vanished. The confident replies of several more weeks of bad weather, that we had been getting up until now have just proven to be incorrect. And the Hitlerites have seized the imitative and launched a massive attack against the 12th and 16th Armies just south of Kiev. Reports are still pouring in by motorcycle courier from the Moscow Airdrome as Yak couriers make their way back, the land lines are down again and as usual the radio is unreliable.
From all reports the enemy unleashed 8 Panzer and 2 motorizied infantry divisions with a full compliment of supporting troops. The 12th Army again takes the burnt of the offensive and from all reports has been driven south of its starting positions. This exposes the 19th Army Kharkov MD to the enemy but we are currently waiting on more details. Further south the enemy attempted to drive our troops away from Odessa with mixed results.
A serious problem seems to be some division commanders had released men on leave and their front line rifle regiments were much reduced in size. This was worse in the north, but still complicated the issue for the 9th Army. The forces arrayed against the 9th Army are significantly weaker then those facing the Southwestern Front and the situation looks stable.
Here at planning we are evaluating two operations. The enemies actions have destroyed our planned slow withdraw of the 12th Army to the positions held by the 19th with the 16th passing through both the 12th and 6th to take up position in the rear. We had hoped to buy several weeks with that maneuver. The question now is to withdraw back or make counter attacks to restore the line first. The individual enemy formations are not that strong and there is scope for a counter attack, the question is if it worth risking this now at the start of the summer campaign season especially since there is no certainty spring rains will not fall. Two options will be prepared and evaluated as the staff here seeks order from chaotic battle reports. But one thing is clear, this is not last summer out troops have significantly improved in fighting capacity.
The current stand of our Guards Forces is:
4 Guard Tank Brigades
20 Guard Rifle Divisions
3 Guard Rifle Brigades
2 Guard Airborne Brigades
2 Guard Mountain Rifle Divisions
1 Guard Cavalry Corps
5 Guard Cavalry Divisions (including those in the Guard Cavalry Corps)
6 Guard Artillery Regiment RVGK
4 Guard Howitzer Regiments
1 Guard Motorcycle Regiment
2 Guard BAP (IL-4, SB-2)
On more mundane matters, given there is time while the reports are processed the following officers are rewarded for their efforts:
5th Army commander Mikhail Potapov is promoted to General-Polkovnik. The 5th Army is responsible for the defense of Kiev and has performed well thoughout the last year so this is well deserved.
4th Shock Army commander Ilya Smirnov is promoted to General-Armii. Just in time to be sent south to deal with the oncoming panzers it is not a bad thing to motivate our commanders.
6th Army commander Ivan Muzychenko is promoted to General-Armii. Another officer who will be tasked with perfoming under considerable stress as the 6th Army will be holding the open ground just to the south of Kiev and securing the flank of the 12th Army come what may.
32nd Army commander Mikhail Parsegov is promoted to General-Polkovnik. The 32nd Army is currently performing vital engineering efforts but was active in the early part of the winter counter offensive.
Unfortunately 6th IAK PVO Air Command commander Daniil Zhuravlev has been killed in action when he took a Mig up against a particularily annoying German recon pilot, one can admire the concept of leading from the front while perhaps understanding that there is a time and place for such things. General-Mayor Sergei Rudenko takes command of 6th IAK PVO Air Command and we all wish him the best as he is covering our building from air attack.
In a move that no one here can understand Comrade Stalin announced that 16th Army commander Mikhail Lukin is dismissed and that General-Leytenent Fyodor Remezov takes command of 16th Army. General Rememzov was removed from command only some weeks ago for failure to perform. While one should say nothing about Comrade Stalin's personal managment requests this is one is very odd. And the timing is, perhaps, not the best.
Official War Records Office
Soviet Losses to date:
Men Killed: 1 066 180
Men Captured: 554 754
Men Disabled: 899 507
Guns Lost: 37 799
AFVs Lost: 13 214
Fighters: 5
Fighter Bombers: 9 822
Tactical Bombers: 1 547
Level Bombers: 3 130
Recon: 723
Transports: 1 115
Flak Losses: 1 784
Operational Losses: 7 284
Total Aircraft Losses: 16 342
Estimated Axis Losses (from NKVD sources):
Men Killed: 475 310
Men Captured: 195 106
Men Disabled: 1 402 395
Guns Lost: 20 033
AFVs Lost: 3 642
Fighters: 1 287
Fighter Bombers: 165
Night Fighters: 3
Tactical Bombers: 628
Level Bombers: 1 817
Recon: 468
Transports: 395
Flak Losses: 928
Operational Losses: 2 399
Total Aircraft Losses: 4 733
Player Notes:
This is just a start, I have two more reports with pictures and I will add in the losses and oob screenshot to this post. I was an idiot, and didn't properly look at the weather chart...I was thinking the weather was mostly rain it is only about 50-50 so this caught me with my pants down in a big way. Mea Cupia Maxima.
Compounding the situation is the whole rifle squads vanishing from divisions problem I have been fighting with for the last game-month. It hits two ways: the first is that you loose the bulk of your infantry strength, then when/if they come back they have no experience. So my front line Rifle divisions lost their 50+ experience Rifle Squads, and assuming they have gotten them back have now 30 exp. CV3 to CV1 time here. Outside of it started with the 42a Rifle TOE swap and me having 6000+ Rifle Squad(-) in my pools I don't know why it is happening. Setting units to refit mode results in divisions fully equipped with Rifle Squad(-)...with low experience. I've notice that things are sorting out themselves but still it is bang your head on the desk frustrating. When I put up the numbers you will see some divisions with 7-8K men...this is most likely a unit with 100% non-infantry TOE and 30% Rifle Squads rather than a unit with 60% TOE. Any developers reading please please if you find out what caused this and fix it I'm sure everyone affected by it would be beyond grateful. Anything I can do to help just ask!
I watched about half the fights in message lvl 4 then switched to 3 as it was getting late. Unfortunately I missed the Panzer attacks so I can't see if my anti-armour capacity is improved. Regardless, the infantry is fighting considerably better. I see multiple firing of long range artillery as the enemy closes, then the 120 mm and 82 mm mortar's kick in again multiple times, then the Maxim HMGs start firing, this is the first time I've ever seen that, then the 76 mm infantry guns. The enemy is taking 300+ casualties before Rifle fire start and a lot happens between the initial artillery duel and the rifle squads firing. The Guards Art Rgt RVGK when it showed up really shot a lot. Very different from what I was seeing in summer of 41. Also the enemy launched not a single hasty attack, and not all of them worked. Plus I got very good ground support, though I still find the air-to-air combat a bit hard to sort out. Later on in the turn when the AI tried to bomb my fields it got obliterated...must have lost nearly 200 level and tactical bombers this turn. I saw one attack where it lost 50 and another where it lost 70 if memory serves. I lost enough I-16 Model 24s a group switched over to Yak-1s...great.
Unfortunately the game is also trying me in another way. I just read that a Gen-L who had been dismissed for incompetence is back in command of the 16th Army (my primary SW front reserve)...now just why would someone with a win:3 loss:42 ratio even be considered for front line duty? This just annoys me, since my house rule is to not do manual officer changes and someone with mech 2, inf 4 and morale/admin/initiative 3-4 ...that just sucks. I feel a bit kicked while I'm down over it.
Anyway over the next day or so expect to see some more detailed accounting and the usual color maps and things show up. I have to analyze, adapt and overcome at a time I was mostly thinking about that stupid bug...time to switch gears.
- Attachments
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- oob T47.jpg (128.3 KiB) Viewed 407 times
RE: Turn 47 (initial)
Building rifle corps yet? You'll like the amount of mortars they have, since like the cav corps they consist of three divisions.
I made the mistake of trying to swoosh around my Guards divisions to create Guards corps; that takes a lot of movement by rail and removes a lot of divisions from the line for a turn or two. Might be better to just merge them with divisions close to each other.
Those panzer rushes can be disconcerting; 5 or 6 divisions together, and you start worrying the line will collapse and it will take a month and a half to get things back in order. In my game the computer attacked me for about 2 and a half months, then withdrew the armor and has been passive since then.
I made the mistake of trying to swoosh around my Guards divisions to create Guards corps; that takes a lot of movement by rail and removes a lot of divisions from the line for a turn or two. Might be better to just merge them with divisions close to each other.
Those panzer rushes can be disconcerting; 5 or 6 divisions together, and you start worrying the line will collapse and it will take a month and a half to get things back in order. In my game the computer attacked me for about 2 and a half months, then withdrew the armor and has been passive since then.
RE: Turn 47 (initial)
Soviet anti tank equipment is a slow process of upgrading; the 45mm AT piece is upgraded in 1943, the 76mm piece needs some time to be introduced, AT riflemen have some use but I tend to be short of full deployment ( they die a lot in battle ), T-34 85mm doesn't arrive until late 1943 or early 1944, IS-1 doesn't come until about the same time.
1942 T-34 has pretty much the same stats as the 1941 version.
1942 T-34 has pretty much the same stats as the 1941 version.
RE: Turn 47 (initial)
The generals selected by the computer may just be semi random, limited to rank, type, and availability.
RE: Turn 47 (initial)
I have noticed many odd choices by the computer to attack airfields beyond range of good fighter escorts. Sometimes 30-40% of the bombers are casualties. Most of my top experience fighter units are I-15/16 variants, even into Oct 1944. ( Why do I still have them? I left the upgrading to the computer, and my total air losses are over 26k; not a lot of spare good planes in the pool ).
RE: Turn 47 (initial)
I don't think the game allows me to build rifle corps yet, that can only start in June. The first 12 created Guards Rifle divisions are already in 4 Corps...in the sense that they are all in the same place as I gave each shock army a single "Guards Rifle Corps" as the Guards divsisions showed up. After that I'm not doing any reshuffle I'm just leaving the guards units where they are. The 51st Army is nearly all guards units (outside of the Tank Corps and maybe a rifle division that are still regular).
I would have liked to see if my tanks are doing much. I have to admit in the one battle I watched that had tanks I didn't see my T34s or KV's shoot at all. I'm not sure what was up there. The AT Brigades are changing TOE very soon and that looks to be an improvement. AT Rgt's are a mixed bag at the moment, they don't seem to upgrade in a consistent fashion. 2 AT-Rifle Bn were in combat but one was destroyed in combat and the other I'm not sure about. But both of them were also freshly raised so this isn't a fair test as I have no idea what their morale-experience-TOE was. In a lot of different ways my delusion over what the weather was to be hurt me...good for balancing out things against an AI. I have to switch from an "administrative" mindset back to a fighting one.
The AT Rgt aren't the only thing that seems a bit chaotic in upgrade path...I'm not sure how many different flavors of them I have currently. 41 Mortar Bn for example don't automatically upgrade to 42a Mortar Rgt.
When do the heavy tank rgt show up to be built probably after the TOE change that removes the KV's from the Corps and Bde would be my guess.
Semi-random leader selection...yeah...just sorta was the cherry on top. I was, well: ticked off would be to put it mildly, last night. Of course as is typical it is easier to pass the blame then face the fact you goofed big time over something absurdly simple and this magnifies minor things. Still this is not the first time the computer has stuck someone removed but not executed back in the line even though there are a huge number of better candidates available.
I would have liked to see if my tanks are doing much. I have to admit in the one battle I watched that had tanks I didn't see my T34s or KV's shoot at all. I'm not sure what was up there. The AT Brigades are changing TOE very soon and that looks to be an improvement. AT Rgt's are a mixed bag at the moment, they don't seem to upgrade in a consistent fashion. 2 AT-Rifle Bn were in combat but one was destroyed in combat and the other I'm not sure about. But both of them were also freshly raised so this isn't a fair test as I have no idea what their morale-experience-TOE was. In a lot of different ways my delusion over what the weather was to be hurt me...good for balancing out things against an AI. I have to switch from an "administrative" mindset back to a fighting one.
The AT Rgt aren't the only thing that seems a bit chaotic in upgrade path...I'm not sure how many different flavors of them I have currently. 41 Mortar Bn for example don't automatically upgrade to 42a Mortar Rgt.
When do the heavy tank rgt show up to be built probably after the TOE change that removes the KV's from the Corps and Bde would be my guess.
Semi-random leader selection...yeah...just sorta was the cherry on top. I was, well: ticked off would be to put it mildly, last night. Of course as is typical it is easier to pass the blame then face the fact you goofed big time over something absurdly simple and this magnifies minor things. Still this is not the first time the computer has stuck someone removed but not executed back in the line even though there are a huge number of better candidates available.
RE: Turn 47 (initial)
I thought you were in July; didn't know you were using a proper calendar where the day comes before the month. [:D]
Tank corps do not use heavy tanks, just a bunch of mediums and some lights. That leaves unemployed KVs, which will be good for heavy tank regiments.
I dislike AT brigades; there's no artillery. I kept a bunch in my game, and even into 1944, with experience into the 80's the CV is still just 1. Might want to disband them; the rifle divisions could use the AT guns better.
Tank corps do not use heavy tanks, just a bunch of mediums and some lights. That leaves unemployed KVs, which will be good for heavy tank regiments.
I dislike AT brigades; there's no artillery. I kept a bunch in my game, and even into 1944, with experience into the 80's the CV is still just 1. Might want to disband them; the rifle divisions could use the AT guns better.
RE: Turn 47 (initial)
The AT Bde have a CV of 1 because they don't have many infantry squads and artillery devices don't have a weighted CV value. The CV they have comes from the support squads. Their combat power comes from their attached artillery/AT/mortars. Their performance is probably strongly experience dependent, but if you don't view the combat it would be hard to see what is going on.
CV is apparently a vastly misunderstood value in this game. People seem to think it means something in terms of combat power, it doesn't. If you are comparing two infantry divisions with different CV the one with a higher number (assuming TOE is the same) will perform better due to better experience. But a unit with a high CV due to a high TOE may perform significantly worse then a unit whose CV is low because it has a reduced TOE value but has a high experience of its surviving devices. CV is calculated at the end of the combat to determine if the unit holds or retreats otherwise it plays no role in the combat itself, that is determined by the devices and the experience of the devices, terrain etc etc etc. Leader rolls will also modify the adjusted final CV value. Comparing CV between different units is risky and not at all straight forward. Or at least this is my experience.
Yes I am using a proper calender!
I am looking forward to corps and new toys (hvy tank Rgts and such) but just have to get through the next months...
CV is apparently a vastly misunderstood value in this game. People seem to think it means something in terms of combat power, it doesn't. If you are comparing two infantry divisions with different CV the one with a higher number (assuming TOE is the same) will perform better due to better experience. But a unit with a high CV due to a high TOE may perform significantly worse then a unit whose CV is low because it has a reduced TOE value but has a high experience of its surviving devices. CV is calculated at the end of the combat to determine if the unit holds or retreats otherwise it plays no role in the combat itself, that is determined by the devices and the experience of the devices, terrain etc etc etc. Leader rolls will also modify the adjusted final CV value. Comparing CV between different units is risky and not at all straight forward. Or at least this is my experience.
Yes I am using a proper calender!
I am looking forward to corps and new toys (hvy tank Rgts and such) but just have to get through the next months...
RE: Turn 47 (initial)
I still do not have much faith in AT brigades, with the lack of regular artillery. If they had lots of AT guns, like 80 or 100 then I might be inclined to keep them, pairing them with rifle units.
The tank regiments sound large but they have only 21 tanks; supporting mass riflemen attacks on single German divisions they do fine.
The tank regiments sound large but they have only 21 tanks; supporting mass riflemen attacks on single German divisions they do fine.
RE: Turn 47 (initial)
The first TOE for tank corps is a bit small, like 6000 men and under 150 tanks. They have less fighting stuff than a 1941 tank division. With the 25% experience loss upon creation they will not be good enough to go 1 vs 1 on a panzer division.
Turn 47 (1 of 3l)
7/5/1942 STAVKA
Well now that we have the couriers information we are making some progress. The map shows the attacks made on the positions of the 9th and 18th Armies. Overall the forces performed extremely well and held the enemy to either no advance or the barest of one. The attacks near Odessa were extremely weak, which was good as the divisions and brigades in that area were suffering from men on leave badly. Full strength divisions and brigades should muster in at nearly 17,000 men while none of the battles reported more than 12,000. This makes the 150 Rifle division's stand against nearly 60,000 enemies all the more impressive as the divisions rifle complement was severely understrength with the pre-battle roll showing only 7718 men in the entire division. Heads will roll over this to be sure, hopefully the leave situation is corrected soon. Leave is a luxury for capitalist dogs not Russian Peasants and Workers.
Beyond that detail, however, the 9th Army indicates it plans to launch an immediate counter attack to drive back the exposed enemy forces using its Guards divisions and Cavalry Corps to send them fleeing westward. Air support has been quite effective though the enemy massed his own air power for these attacks.
The situation for the 18th Army is far more complex as its actions will depend a great deal on what is finally decided here in STAVKA. The 12th Army Southwestern front was badly displaced by the enemies opening attacks which opens the flank of the 51st and 18th Armies. It is not yet decided where to apply the potential of the 51st but it may be necessary to pull the 18th's flank around and across the Yuzbny River while the 51st Army advances north. The primary concern is maintaining the fighting strength of the 18th for its position on the Bug. It is also intended to swap out the hurt 390 Rifle Division for one currently engaged in engineering work on the Bug. The HQ of the 18th Army will need to withdraw, as it is currently coexisting with the 390th Division.
Complicating the issues facing the Southern front is the weather. This time however their distance of withdrawal is much shorter and with the STAVKA forces conducting engineering efforts they will be occupying strong fighting positions on the Bug and its tributaries. The question remains as to what to do with the 51st Army and how to prevent the northern flank of the Southern Front from collapsing as it nearly did at the end of last fall.
The Southern Front Air Command has done a good job of supporting our troops and the reports are that the enemy was unhappy to be on the receiving end of their bombs. The enemy did bring a lot of his air power into play but he still failed to achieve his objectives.
Players Notes:
I'm experimenting with the map details. Feedback would be appreciated.
The "Rifle Squad Vanishing" bug or whatever it is...this is unfun at this stage. It is not game destroying but it is annoying. I'm really impressed this turn with the fighting. I watched all of these fights in detail and the change is significant.
You see the guns of the artillery fire twice now, the heavy mortars (120 mm and 82mm) fire 3 times in general and for the first time I saw exchanges where who was shooting swapped. Also for the very first time I saw HMG fire at range. The advancing enemy forces were taking a lot of punishment closing with my troops. Also none of these were hasty attacks. Guards artillery Rgts seem (and I stress this is seem) to fire even more often then a regular support artillery unit.
Also all units are/were in fortifications around level 3.
Well now that we have the couriers information we are making some progress. The map shows the attacks made on the positions of the 9th and 18th Armies. Overall the forces performed extremely well and held the enemy to either no advance or the barest of one. The attacks near Odessa were extremely weak, which was good as the divisions and brigades in that area were suffering from men on leave badly. Full strength divisions and brigades should muster in at nearly 17,000 men while none of the battles reported more than 12,000. This makes the 150 Rifle division's stand against nearly 60,000 enemies all the more impressive as the divisions rifle complement was severely understrength with the pre-battle roll showing only 7718 men in the entire division. Heads will roll over this to be sure, hopefully the leave situation is corrected soon. Leave is a luxury for capitalist dogs not Russian Peasants and Workers.
Beyond that detail, however, the 9th Army indicates it plans to launch an immediate counter attack to drive back the exposed enemy forces using its Guards divisions and Cavalry Corps to send them fleeing westward. Air support has been quite effective though the enemy massed his own air power for these attacks.
The situation for the 18th Army is far more complex as its actions will depend a great deal on what is finally decided here in STAVKA. The 12th Army Southwestern front was badly displaced by the enemies opening attacks which opens the flank of the 51st and 18th Armies. It is not yet decided where to apply the potential of the 51st but it may be necessary to pull the 18th's flank around and across the Yuzbny River while the 51st Army advances north. The primary concern is maintaining the fighting strength of the 18th for its position on the Bug. It is also intended to swap out the hurt 390 Rifle Division for one currently engaged in engineering work on the Bug. The HQ of the 18th Army will need to withdraw, as it is currently coexisting with the 390th Division.
Complicating the issues facing the Southern front is the weather. This time however their distance of withdrawal is much shorter and with the STAVKA forces conducting engineering efforts they will be occupying strong fighting positions on the Bug and its tributaries. The question remains as to what to do with the 51st Army and how to prevent the northern flank of the Southern Front from collapsing as it nearly did at the end of last fall.
The Southern Front Air Command has done a good job of supporting our troops and the reports are that the enemy was unhappy to be on the receiving end of their bombs. The enemy did bring a lot of his air power into play but he still failed to achieve his objectives.
Players Notes:
I'm experimenting with the map details. Feedback would be appreciated.
The "Rifle Squad Vanishing" bug or whatever it is...this is unfun at this stage. It is not game destroying but it is annoying. I'm really impressed this turn with the fighting. I watched all of these fights in detail and the change is significant.
You see the guns of the artillery fire twice now, the heavy mortars (120 mm and 82mm) fire 3 times in general and for the first time I saw exchanges where who was shooting swapped. Also for the very first time I saw HMG fire at range. The advancing enemy forces were taking a lot of punishment closing with my troops. Also none of these were hasty attacks. Guards artillery Rgts seem (and I stress this is seem) to fire even more often then a regular support artillery unit.
Also all units are/were in fortifications around level 3.
- Attachments
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- SouthernFrontT47.jpg (239.71 KiB) Viewed 407 times
Turn 47 (2 of 3l)
Southwestern Front HQ
The reports kept coming in each day with worse news as massive Hitlerite attack hit the forward elements of the front and while some held firm under the attack the 12th Army's front line bent backward and then cracked as the enemy through the bulk of his mechanized forces at the 12th Mountain divisions. Although the leave issues that had weakened the Southern front's divisions were not prevalent it did not impact in the results as the enemy used massive local superiority and concentrated armour as opposed to finesse.
5th Army
In an attempt to regain its foothold to encircle Kiev the enemy unleashed the Das Reich and L.A.H. SS Infantrie(M), the 29th Infantrie(M), the 5th Jäger, and the 79th Infantrie divisions against the 193 Rifle division (see map point 1). 51,000 men, 858 guns and 19 tanks hit the 13,000 men and 199 guns of the rifle division. SW Air command scrambled 45 fighters and 23 bombers to support the troops but to no avail as the division was forced across the Dnepr exactly as had happened the fall before. The retreat across the river cost the 193 3493 men and 84 guns, the attackers lost 1470 men, 28 guns and 2 tanks in their victory.
The 213 Rifle division easily stood off an attempt by the 6th Infantrie to force the river (see map point 2). The enemy lost 903 men and 22 guns while the 213 lost less than half a company (53 men). Obviously this was some attempt to divert our reserves rather than a serious assault.
6th Army
The 6th Armies forward positions were struck but held firm even under two attempts by the 12th Panzer to force the issue. At map point 3 the 80th and 81st Rifle Divisions garrisioning the 48th Fortified Region were attacked first by the 12th Pz Division with support from the 215th Infantrie and the 1st Hungarian Mnt Bde a force of 27,000 men, 356 guns and 120 tanks against 19,000 men, and 387 guns. The enemy lost massively with 3189 men, 73 guns and 18 tanks destroyed to 666 men and 13 guns. Attempting again the 12th Panzer and 35 Infantrie Divisions muster 18,000 men, 264 guns and 109 tanks losing less in this attempt where we only managed to inflict 1819 men, 23 guns and 11 tanks in casualties on them. Our losses were again low at 503 men and 8 guns.
At map point 4 the 109th Rifle division faced the 5th and 19th Panzer divsions supported by the 56th and 88th Infantrie. SW Air command managed to scrape up 10 fighters and 7 bombers to support the 109th. The enemy attacked with 59,000 men, 700 guns and 224 tanks loosing 1819 men, 23 guns and 11 tanks. Our losses were higher at 2438 men, and 44 guns out of our starting force of 13,000 men and 185 guns.
16th Army
The 16th Army was hit with the flanking attack of the enemies attempt to smash through our line as it drove east. Points 5, 6, 7, and 8 cover the attack on the 46th Rifle division and 62nd Tank Bde. The starting strength of the formations combined was 11,000 men, 170 guns and 49 tanks. First the enemy hit our troops with the 23rd Panzer division, the 57th, 111th, and 218th Infantrie, the 52nd Torino Italian Infantry, and the 108th and 124th Hungarian Security divisions. A massive assault of 75,000 men, 697 guns and 174 tanks cost the combined force 2150 men, 43 guns and 21 tanks as they were forced back for the price of 1136 men, 24 guns and 13 tanks. SW air command committed 91 fighters to counter the enemies 76 bombers. Then the 9th and 16th Panzers divisions exploited against our men still trying to recover from the first attack. The enemies 21 bombers were countered by a massive commitment of the bulk of the SW Air commands assets and 230 fighters and 78 bombers attempted to blunt the enemies advancing armour. Our men hit on the move lost 2256 men, 59 guns and 13 more tanks with the 62nd Tank Bde retreating north with the 46 Rifle now barely more than a regiment sized force heading eastward. The 2nd Panzer division smashed into the rear guard of the 46th and another 1871 men, 28 guns and 5 tanks were lost, as the 23 Mtcl Rgt had been sent to assist the beleaguered divison and was crushed beneath the enemies armour. Again SW air command rallied to the divisions plight and 135 fighters and 69 bombers hammered at the advancing tanks. Finally the 14th and 20th Infantrie Motorized in their turn at exploitation over ran the 46th causing it a further 696 men and 36 guns in losses. The Luftwaffe sent 35 fighters and 27 bombers which clashed with our 64 fighters and 20 bombers. The remnents of the 46th withdrew to the lines of the 19th Army. Considering the forces arrayed against it that it never broke under fire is a testament to the increased skill of our men.
12th Army
The bulk of the enemies attacks fell on the 12th Army. Map points 9, 10, 11, 12 show the path of the 58th Mountain division as it withdrew under pressure. The 58th Mountain started with 15,000 men, and 189 guns. It was reinforced in the first battle by the 155 Separate Tank Bn giving it 39 tanks for the first battle. The enemy opened up his assault with the 57th, 71st, 218th and 298th Infantrie divisions supported by the 101st Jäger, the 52 Torinio Italian Infantry, the 108th Hungarian Security divisions and the 2nd Fortress RM Bde plus 18 fighters and 9 bombers. 92,000 men, and 1146 guns were used to smash through the 58th defenses inflicting 3932 men, 119 guns and 22 tanks as casualties on the 58th Mnt in exchange for 1373 men and 36 guns even though SW Air command commited 235 fighters and 9 bombers to the fight. The enemy then sent in the 23rd Panzer division and the 11th and 57th Infantrie. Again SW Air command committed its resources to help a division under assault and 145 fighters and 35 bombers struck back. The division shed another 319 men and 11 guns in the withdrawal which must be said to have been skillfull performed to keep the losses so low. The 58th now joined forces with the 6th Tank Corps which was working up after being formed some two weeks earlier. This force had a strength of 18,000 men, 172 guns and 162 tanks. The enemy committed the 2nd, 14th and 16th Panzer divisions to the attack and 35,000 men, 358 guns and 262 tanks hit our forces. SW Air command sent in 54 fighters and 27 bombers and the results were an utter rout. The enemy lost 476 men, 3 guns and a pathetic 5 tanks to our 2935 men, 62 guns and 72 tanks. The enemy then used the 2nd Panzer joined by the 9th and 13th Panzer. This time our men performed much better and although driven eastward they lost only 705 men, 9 guns and 19 tanks to the enemies 382 men, 5 guns and 16 tanks. The exhausted troops of the 58th Mnt Division had reached the 19th Army positions.
The enemy attacked the crumbling line twice more. At map point 13 the 192nd Mountain division is caught by the 23rd Panzers on its supposedly protected flank while the 298th Infantrie and the 1st Geburgs division hit it from the enemies lines. SW Air command and the Luftwaffe skirmish overhead with 60 fighters and 24 bombers from our side and the enemy committing 49 fighters and 74 bombers. It is a close run battle and if not for the unexpected appearance of the 23rd where it should not be our men might have held against the enemies infantry but with that they were driven off but even though the enemy committed 41,000 men, 393 guns and 166 tanks to our 14,000 men and 151 guns the loses were about equal. We lost 1746 men and 29 guns while the attack cost them 1180 men, 21 guns and 6 tanks.
Not giving the 192nd Mountain a chance to rest they were pursed back to the positions of the 60th Mountain division. The enemy threw a massive force at our troops: the 52nd, 93rd, 132nd, 294th Infantrie, the Polizei SS division and the 4th Geburgs division with a total of 66,000 men, and 850 guns. The fight was going well until the enemy used some infernal fascist tactical maneuver...these infernal "kampfgruppe" and changed the operational environment. Even 66 fighters and 33 bombers could not save the day and our forces withdrew losing 3033 men and 60 guns to the enemies 1608 men and 36 guns. See point 14 on the map.
The situation for the 12th is now pecarious with a lot of enemy held territory between where they are and where STAVKA wants them.
The reports kept coming in each day with worse news as massive Hitlerite attack hit the forward elements of the front and while some held firm under the attack the 12th Army's front line bent backward and then cracked as the enemy through the bulk of his mechanized forces at the 12th Mountain divisions. Although the leave issues that had weakened the Southern front's divisions were not prevalent it did not impact in the results as the enemy used massive local superiority and concentrated armour as opposed to finesse.
5th Army
In an attempt to regain its foothold to encircle Kiev the enemy unleashed the Das Reich and L.A.H. SS Infantrie(M), the 29th Infantrie(M), the 5th Jäger, and the 79th Infantrie divisions against the 193 Rifle division (see map point 1). 51,000 men, 858 guns and 19 tanks hit the 13,000 men and 199 guns of the rifle division. SW Air command scrambled 45 fighters and 23 bombers to support the troops but to no avail as the division was forced across the Dnepr exactly as had happened the fall before. The retreat across the river cost the 193 3493 men and 84 guns, the attackers lost 1470 men, 28 guns and 2 tanks in their victory.
The 213 Rifle division easily stood off an attempt by the 6th Infantrie to force the river (see map point 2). The enemy lost 903 men and 22 guns while the 213 lost less than half a company (53 men). Obviously this was some attempt to divert our reserves rather than a serious assault.
6th Army
The 6th Armies forward positions were struck but held firm even under two attempts by the 12th Panzer to force the issue. At map point 3 the 80th and 81st Rifle Divisions garrisioning the 48th Fortified Region were attacked first by the 12th Pz Division with support from the 215th Infantrie and the 1st Hungarian Mnt Bde a force of 27,000 men, 356 guns and 120 tanks against 19,000 men, and 387 guns. The enemy lost massively with 3189 men, 73 guns and 18 tanks destroyed to 666 men and 13 guns. Attempting again the 12th Panzer and 35 Infantrie Divisions muster 18,000 men, 264 guns and 109 tanks losing less in this attempt where we only managed to inflict 1819 men, 23 guns and 11 tanks in casualties on them. Our losses were again low at 503 men and 8 guns.
At map point 4 the 109th Rifle division faced the 5th and 19th Panzer divsions supported by the 56th and 88th Infantrie. SW Air command managed to scrape up 10 fighters and 7 bombers to support the 109th. The enemy attacked with 59,000 men, 700 guns and 224 tanks loosing 1819 men, 23 guns and 11 tanks. Our losses were higher at 2438 men, and 44 guns out of our starting force of 13,000 men and 185 guns.
16th Army
The 16th Army was hit with the flanking attack of the enemies attempt to smash through our line as it drove east. Points 5, 6, 7, and 8 cover the attack on the 46th Rifle division and 62nd Tank Bde. The starting strength of the formations combined was 11,000 men, 170 guns and 49 tanks. First the enemy hit our troops with the 23rd Panzer division, the 57th, 111th, and 218th Infantrie, the 52nd Torino Italian Infantry, and the 108th and 124th Hungarian Security divisions. A massive assault of 75,000 men, 697 guns and 174 tanks cost the combined force 2150 men, 43 guns and 21 tanks as they were forced back for the price of 1136 men, 24 guns and 13 tanks. SW air command committed 91 fighters to counter the enemies 76 bombers. Then the 9th and 16th Panzers divisions exploited against our men still trying to recover from the first attack. The enemies 21 bombers were countered by a massive commitment of the bulk of the SW Air commands assets and 230 fighters and 78 bombers attempted to blunt the enemies advancing armour. Our men hit on the move lost 2256 men, 59 guns and 13 more tanks with the 62nd Tank Bde retreating north with the 46 Rifle now barely more than a regiment sized force heading eastward. The 2nd Panzer division smashed into the rear guard of the 46th and another 1871 men, 28 guns and 5 tanks were lost, as the 23 Mtcl Rgt had been sent to assist the beleaguered divison and was crushed beneath the enemies armour. Again SW air command rallied to the divisions plight and 135 fighters and 69 bombers hammered at the advancing tanks. Finally the 14th and 20th Infantrie Motorized in their turn at exploitation over ran the 46th causing it a further 696 men and 36 guns in losses. The Luftwaffe sent 35 fighters and 27 bombers which clashed with our 64 fighters and 20 bombers. The remnents of the 46th withdrew to the lines of the 19th Army. Considering the forces arrayed against it that it never broke under fire is a testament to the increased skill of our men.
12th Army
The bulk of the enemies attacks fell on the 12th Army. Map points 9, 10, 11, 12 show the path of the 58th Mountain division as it withdrew under pressure. The 58th Mountain started with 15,000 men, and 189 guns. It was reinforced in the first battle by the 155 Separate Tank Bn giving it 39 tanks for the first battle. The enemy opened up his assault with the 57th, 71st, 218th and 298th Infantrie divisions supported by the 101st Jäger, the 52 Torinio Italian Infantry, the 108th Hungarian Security divisions and the 2nd Fortress RM Bde plus 18 fighters and 9 bombers. 92,000 men, and 1146 guns were used to smash through the 58th defenses inflicting 3932 men, 119 guns and 22 tanks as casualties on the 58th Mnt in exchange for 1373 men and 36 guns even though SW Air command commited 235 fighters and 9 bombers to the fight. The enemy then sent in the 23rd Panzer division and the 11th and 57th Infantrie. Again SW Air command committed its resources to help a division under assault and 145 fighters and 35 bombers struck back. The division shed another 319 men and 11 guns in the withdrawal which must be said to have been skillfull performed to keep the losses so low. The 58th now joined forces with the 6th Tank Corps which was working up after being formed some two weeks earlier. This force had a strength of 18,000 men, 172 guns and 162 tanks. The enemy committed the 2nd, 14th and 16th Panzer divisions to the attack and 35,000 men, 358 guns and 262 tanks hit our forces. SW Air command sent in 54 fighters and 27 bombers and the results were an utter rout. The enemy lost 476 men, 3 guns and a pathetic 5 tanks to our 2935 men, 62 guns and 72 tanks. The enemy then used the 2nd Panzer joined by the 9th and 13th Panzer. This time our men performed much better and although driven eastward they lost only 705 men, 9 guns and 19 tanks to the enemies 382 men, 5 guns and 16 tanks. The exhausted troops of the 58th Mnt Division had reached the 19th Army positions.
The enemy attacked the crumbling line twice more. At map point 13 the 192nd Mountain division is caught by the 23rd Panzers on its supposedly protected flank while the 298th Infantrie and the 1st Geburgs division hit it from the enemies lines. SW Air command and the Luftwaffe skirmish overhead with 60 fighters and 24 bombers from our side and the enemy committing 49 fighters and 74 bombers. It is a close run battle and if not for the unexpected appearance of the 23rd where it should not be our men might have held against the enemies infantry but with that they were driven off but even though the enemy committed 41,000 men, 393 guns and 166 tanks to our 14,000 men and 151 guns the loses were about equal. We lost 1746 men and 29 guns while the attack cost them 1180 men, 21 guns and 6 tanks.
Not giving the 192nd Mountain a chance to rest they were pursed back to the positions of the 60th Mountain division. The enemy threw a massive force at our troops: the 52nd, 93rd, 132nd, 294th Infantrie, the Polizei SS division and the 4th Geburgs division with a total of 66,000 men, and 850 guns. The fight was going well until the enemy used some infernal fascist tactical maneuver...these infernal "kampfgruppe" and changed the operational environment. Even 66 fighters and 33 bombers could not save the day and our forces withdrew losing 3033 men and 60 guns to the enemies 1608 men and 36 guns. See point 14 on the map.
The situation for the 12th is now pecarious with a lot of enemy held territory between where they are and where STAVKA wants them.
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- SW_T47.jpg (183.31 KiB) Viewed 407 times
Turn 47 (3 of 3l)
Elsewhere in Russia
The other place the enemy has masses substantial forces is before the Bryansk Front. On the map you can clearly see the enemies Panzer forces and in addition the command confusion that persists in plaguing this area of the line. Due to the events going on to the south of Kiev the 4th Shock Army has been cut orders to withdraw from the line and move south.
(more to come, I'm still thinking on what I will do this turn)
The other place the enemy has masses substantial forces is before the Bryansk Front. On the map you can clearly see the enemies Panzer forces and in addition the command confusion that persists in plaguing this area of the line. Due to the events going on to the south of Kiev the 4th Shock Army has been cut orders to withdraw from the line and move south.
(more to come, I'm still thinking on what I will do this turn)
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RE: Turn 47 (3 of 3l)
If you get your frontline stacks to three units that should help to slow down the computer attacks; losing mass amounts of units in large encirclements should not be probable.
Remember that rifle brigades can be slapped together starting in May.
Remember that rifle brigades can be slapped together starting in May.
RE: Turn 47 (3 of 3l)
Think of a tank corps as a raw unit; when I started putting them together I wanted to throw bunches at panzer divisions but the tank corps CV gave me pause. 4? 5? Vs the panzers still at 9 or 12? Uh ohs
I ended up easing them into battle, having them work with lots of rifle divisions attacking lone German divisions. It's a long growing process.
I ended up easing them into battle, having them work with lots of rifle divisions attacking lone German divisions. It's a long growing process.