GC (V1.03 Beta 3 patch) Bwheatley sov vs Abulbulian Axis (Ara no cheating/peek..) Take 2!

[bwheatley]

ORIGINAL: Mynok


Don't like that AGS move. A human will eat that up as you know. I still prefer to just cut the rail line south of Tarnopol so the Sovs can't rail out most of Southwest Front. They'll still move a bunch out to the south, but those can be isolated in a turn or two.

Yea i was torn between doing it or not. I figured it worked out ok with ara against me last game. We had 2-3 turns of pitched encircling and counter encircling. But one thing i plan on doing differently as well is sending more tanks to AGS. I know what a death sentence 42 is going to be if i can't capture numerous manpower cities.

[bwheatley]

ORIGINAL: Klydon

For what it is worth on my 2 cents on the AGN panzers. I would leave them attached to AGN for command purposes and attach a AGC infantry corps or AGC panzer corps (from PG3) to them to help relieve the pressure on AGC's command overload. PG4 can operate in conjunction with PG3 if you are looking to drive in the middle or you can basically do a bit of a shift to the south with PG3 taking the place of PG2 and PG2 moving further south to help AGS.

I agree with Mynok that the AGS opening is weak. Every single unit will be back in supply when the security regiment along the Rumanian border moves back. The other issue is the corridor is too narrow. You will likely be coming to the rescue of those panzers, but part of it depends on what your opponent does too. Eventually, you may be able to kill all those units, but it is going to take a lot of extra time and there won't be a very big push towards Kiev while it is going on.

Yea last game i also cut off that southern panzer. But the panzer was able to walk into Romanian territory so i'm confident we'll get it sorted out. Being my first axis game it very well could be a terrible move. But you only learn by making mistakes.

So you both recommend leaving the Romanians to unfreeze naturally? I was a little worried that might cause me a lot of grief leaving them be.

[Mynok]

Yes, I do, with the caveat that I've only played the AI in campaigns. They really aren't all that, and they really aren't situated (or capable) of helping you achieve your objectives much.

Here's the Axis key: isolated panzers lose time. Time is of the essence. You have to keep them moving and exploiting to maximize their effectiveness. Their strength is maneuver, not force, despite the massive arguments about this on the forum. Indeed, if you boil down much of the complaints about Axis drawbacks in the system it is that the Sovs can so easily control their maneuverability. That's what the checkerboard and the defense in depth are all designed to do.

So the Axis player has to play to enable his panzers to maneuver effectively. This is a difficult job for sure.

[karonagames]

The comment I would make is about rail conversion.

In my early games I used to surround Brest to get the surrender to T2, but I now rout 'em out so I can get 3 rail lines converted. Likewise I attack with IV corps in the South to clear and convert the rail line that runs through Lvov.

I would also recommend that you make maximum use of the Baltic rail zone - there is a line that gets supply over the Dvinsk and through Vitebsk pretty quickly. The routes you convert will have a major impact on your ability to support offensives - there are some areas that are logistic "black holes"

[Redmarkus5]

ORIGINAL: bwheatley

ORIGINAL: randallw

We'll see if abulbulian's knowledge on the Eastern Front is usable in a game. [;)]

Heh i've toyed with the idea of sending him the youtube clip of hitler screaming about whatever is dubbed over the real lines. And telling him that's how he gets when he let's himself get all fired up about stuff. And i also tell him he would make more friends not calling people who disagree with him stupid.
It's the little things.

He's actually a really nice guy when you don't get his ire up with things he thinks are non-sense. We were actually jointly working on an AT (advanced tactics) scen. I had the world at war map all nicely done up with regional weather which i thought was great. But he just griped too much so it really caused me to burn out on AT. When AT Gold comes out i'll hopefully have fun finishing that as well as redoing the GPW scenario i took over.

IIRC, I was the person who did the original 1.0 map and OOB for that AT GPW scenario, then someone else took it over from me and refined it. Good to hear that it's still alive. Is it popular? Please PM me an update

[Klydon]

I am mixed on freeing the Rumanians, although it certainly does fall into the "nice to do" category.

It depends on what your views are in regards of pulling from AGC. At the very least, I pull a panzer corps from PG2 and sometimes will pull an extra infantry corps south as well to get the ball rolling. A lot don't like to pull that much, but it sort of depends on objectives, etc and it is one of those decisions that perhaps doesn't have a right or wrong answer.

I have not really worked on a "AGS forces only" opening and perhaps I will at some point, but the way the game is set up right now, it is hard not to pull troops from AGC to help get rid of those good (for Russians) units that start in the AGS area.

[Ketza]

Although I like the idea of grabbing the Crimea early it seems to me the Kuban would be very easy to bottle up.

[sillyflower]

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

The big new Axis-friendly patch is out? Did I miss something?

Joel posted today it should be out early next week if tests OK. Maybe bwheatley slept with him, or promised not to, or something
or even

[bwheatley]

ORIGINAL: BigAnorak

The comment I would make is about rail conversion.

In my early games I used to surround Brest to get the surrender to T2, but I now rout 'em out so I can get 3 rail lines converted. Likewise I attack with IV corps in the South to clear and convert the rail line that runs through Lvov.

I would also recommend that you make maximum use of the Baltic rail zone - there is a line that gets supply over the Dvinsk and through Vitebsk pretty quickly. The routes you convert will have a major impact on your ability to support offensives - there are some areas that are logistic "black holes"

Ahh thanks BigA.

[bwheatley]

ORIGINAL: redmarkus4

ORIGINAL: bwheatley

ORIGINAL: randallw

We'll see if abulbulian's knowledge on the Eastern Front is usable in a game. [;)]

Heh i've toyed with the idea of sending him the youtube clip of hitler screaming about whatever is dubbed over the real lines. And telling him that's how he gets when he let's himself get all fired up about stuff. And i also tell him he would make more friends not calling people who disagree with him stupid.
It's the little things.

He's actually a really nice guy when you don't get his ire up with things he thinks are non-sense. We were actually jointly working on an AT (advanced tactics) scen. I had the world at war map all nicely done up with regional weather which i thought was great. But he just griped too much so it really caused me to burn out on AT. When AT Gold comes out i'll hopefully have fun finishing that as well as redoing the GPW scenario i took over.

IIRC, I was the person who did the original 1.0 map and OOB for that AT GPW scenario, then someone else took it over from me and refined it. Good to hear that it's still alive. Is it popular? Please PM me an update

Yea i liked it. Yea tweber did it. So what ara and i were trying to do was beef up the soviets a little bit. In the version we played the soviets really had nothing in the winter they could use to stop the axis.

But i got frustrated with the editor for AT. You can't do any sort of real scripting so it was a pita. If i was able to use variables inside of loops i could have written my weather system in 20 lines but instead it took 300 since the engine didn't support it. It sounds like AT gold will based on a lot of my thoughts on it. So that would be very awesome.

[bwheatley]

ORIGINAL: Klydon

I am mixed on freeing the Rumanians, although it certainly does fall into the "nice to do" category.

It depends on what your views are in regards of pulling from AGC. At the very least, I pull a panzer corps from PG2 and sometimes will pull an extra infantry corps south as well to get the ball rolling. A lot don't like to pull that much, but it sort of depends on objectives, etc and it is one of those decisions that perhaps doesn't have a right or wrong answer.

I have not really worked on a "AGS forces only" opening and perhaps I will at some point, but the way the game is set up right now, it is hard not to pull troops from AGC to help get rid of those good (for Russians) units that start in the AGS area.

Ya i totally planned to steal from AGC to help AGS. It's obvious from my last game that the germans have have have to take kharkov(maybe), kursk, rostov and the crimea to put a dent in the soviets ability to keep a large army.

I appreciate all the feedback of you guys

[bwheatley]

ORIGINAL: sillyflower

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

The big new Axis-friendly patch is out? Did I miss something?

Joel posted today it should be out early next week if tests OK. Maybe bwheatley slept with him, or promised not to, or something
or even

oh ya i totally slept with him. hehe
just helping find bugs. found a cool edge case last night in my soviet game. If you land a small diversionary force in constants the romanians surrender and germany loses any units with romanians..ouch.

at least that will get fixed.

[bwheatley]

ok sad news. Due to issues with not being able to keep your turns from the slitherine server we're going to shelve this game and i'll convert the thread to the PBEM game between me and ara with me as soviets again.

We just quit our last game in nov 42 because the better part of the 6th army surrendered when i landed a diversiony cav division in constants in prep for my winter offensive of 42.

So next posts here will be the AAR of our new game.

GC
Settings:
Fort 80% Axis 50% soviets
Admin 110% axis
Morale 110% axis

Also there will be a 6 turn limit of attacks in the first blizzard. This is up for discussion depending on how well ara does this time.
I learned a lot of valuable lessons from last game. Like don't put too much at leningrad you can live without it.
Pull back from exposed positions instead of sending armorered and infantry reserves to try to check a panzer breakthrough. that was stupid from my first game and lead to the smolensk pocket of 750k.

But i won't by any stretch be doing a sir robin defense but i also won't leave an army to get cut off. Even if your army is well supplied once it's isolated it turns into gumby even when you keep it in decent supply and can't do anything. So i have to try to prevent that this time around.

[Senno]

ORIGINAL: bwheatley

ok sad news. Due to issues with not being able to keep your turns from the slitherine server we're going to shelve this game and i'll convert the thread to the PBEM game between me and ara with me as soviets again.

We just quit our last game in nov 42 because the better part of the 6th army surrendered when i landed a diversiony cav division in constants in prep for my winter offensive of 42.

So next posts here will be the AAR of our new game.

GC
Settings:
Fort 80% Axis 50% soviets
Admin 110% axis
Morale 110% axis

Also there will be a 6 turn limit of attacks in the first blizzard. This is up for discussion depending on how well ara does this time.
I learned a lot of valuable lessons from last game. Like don't put too much at leningrad you can live without it.
Pull back from exposed positions instead of sending armorered and infantry reserves to try to check a panzer breakthrough. that was stupid from my first game and lead to the smolensk pocket of 750k.

But i won't by any stretch be doing a sir robin defense but i also won't leave an army to get cut off. Even if your army is well supplied once it's isolated it turns into gumby even when you keep it in decent supply and can't do anything. So i have to try to prevent that this time around.

Most successful "diversionary" attack ever. Heroes of the SU for the entire division, woot![&o]

[bwheatley]

ORIGINAL: Senno

ORIGINAL: bwheatley

ok sad news. Due to issues with not being able to keep your turns from the slitherine server we're going to shelve this game and i'll convert the thread to the PBEM game between me and ara with me as soviets again.

We just quit our last game in nov 42 because the better part of the 6th army surrendered when i landed a diversiony cav division in constants in prep for my winter offensive of 42.

So next posts here will be the AAR of our new game.

GC
Settings:
Fort 80% Axis 50% soviets
Admin 110% axis
Morale 110% axis

Also there will be a 6 turn limit of attacks in the first blizzard. This is up for discussion depending on how well ara does this time.
I learned a lot of valuable lessons from last game. Like don't put too much at leningrad you can live without it.
Pull back from exposed positions instead of sending armorered and infantry reserves to try to check a panzer breakthrough. that was stupid from my first game and lead to the smolensk pocket of 750k.

But i won't by any stretch be doing a sir robin defense but i also won't leave an army to get cut off. Even if your army is well supplied once it's isolated it turns into gumby even when you keep it in decent supply and can't do anything. So i have to try to prevent that this time around.

Most successful "diversionary" attack ever. Heroes of the SU for the entire division, woot![&o]

Yea it was. though i'm super bummed i won't get to finish and see if my winter attack with ski troops was going to be successful.

[sillyflower]

ORIGINAL: bwheatley


GC
Settings:
Fort 80% Axis 50% soviets
Admin 110% axis
Morale 110% axis

Interesting fort settings. Seems to me that could rebound against German because imho they need forts more that Russians looking at GC as a whole. Russians need for 2 summers. Germans for 2 summers and 4 winters.

[bwheatley]

ORIGINAL: sillyflower

ORIGINAL: bwheatley


GC
Settings:
Fort 80% Axis 50% soviets
Admin 110% axis
Morale 110% axis

Interesting fort settings. Seems to me that could rebound against German because imho they need forts more that Russians looking at GC as a whole. Russians need for 2 summers. Germans for 2 summers and 4 winters.

I tend to think the low soviet numbers might mess me up but i agree with area that fort building seems too high for both sides. Having miles and miles of level 3-4 forts by the 2nd spring seemed a little off. So we'll give it a try. We also changaed it

Admin 100/100
Morale 100/80 After talking to joel and reading the manual i wasn't comfortable with any player having 110% as that gives you automatic passing of leadership checks.

In the end i just want to play i've been having a rough week with my business so sometime to take my mind off it and wargame would be appreciated.

[bwheatley]

Ok first turn of our new game is in and here are the numbers!

Ground Losses


Destroyed Units


Air Losses

[bwheatley]

Well this turn was a pita as usual.

In my north i have all of 10th and other armies encircled.


In the south as usual chaos reigns!

[bwheatley]

My first order of business was disbanding as many corp hq's as possible.

And here is why!


But after disbanding all the corp hq's i could look at my manpower


A change of 120360 soldiers that can go into the field next turn.